# Is a US-Iranian Rapproachment possible? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 24, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700 "2013-11-24T20:07:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/1 "2013-11-24T20:07:57Z")
In the long term, I think this would be desirable, apart from the rhetoric the Iranians have a highly educated population, good cinema, with a government which is I’d say partially representative, and who, like Western nations, is not too keen on Al-Qaeda or Sunni extremism either. It seems rather ironic that we’re allied with the Saudis, who, because of their repressive actions and political arrangements, have exported an ideology far more dangerous than the Iranian version. Will this be a process of decades for something like this to come about? I mean, the US didn’t have relations with Communist China for 20 years, and Nixon eventually went and a process of normalisation occurred, the same can be said for Vietnam as well, why not with Iran? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/2 "2013-11-24T20:18:10Z")
Yeah, mainly because of the “good cinema”. 😕 Seriously, though I’ve been saying this for years: We are more naturally allied with Iran than with Saudi Arabia. We only ally ourselves with the latter because value security over anything else. But if we can find a way to balance things so that we don’t have to choose one over the other, that would best. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/3 "2013-11-24T20:34:03Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yeah, mainly because of the “good cinema”. 😕 > > Seriously, though I’ve been saying this for years: We are more naturally allied with Iran than with Saudi Arabia. We only ally ourselves with the latter because value security over anything else. But if we can find a way to balance things so that we don’t have to choose one over the other, that would best. Who knows, maybe that’s what’s happening, so the US is in a position for them to both jockey for favour. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/4 "2013-11-24T21:22:41Z")
I imagine that our fondness for oil also has a lot to do with our fondness for Saudi Arabia. I haven’t been looking too closely at our relationships with countries we aren’t bombing; aside from having been ruled by a series of rather dickish leaders, what specifically has Iran done to piss off the US? Similarly, what have we done to piss off Iran? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/5 "2013-11-24T21:25:06Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > I imagine that our fondness for oil also has a lot to do with our fondness for Saudi Arabia. Iran has lots of oil, too. > [@](#): > > I haven’t been looking too closely at our relationships with countries we aren’t bombing; aside from having been ruled by a series of rather dickish leaders, what specifically has Iran done to piss off the US? Similarly, what have we done to piss off Iran? We hold long grudges. Embassy take-overs and hostage taking isn’t something we easily forget. ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/6 "2013-11-24T21:29:05Z")
Seriously? You mean in the last few years, Or do you really not know about Mossadegh, the Shah, the Islamic Revolution, the hostages, the Iran-Iraq War, and … all that? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/7 "2013-11-24T22:16:15Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > Seriously? You mean in the last few years, Or do you really not know about Mossadegh, the Shah, the Islamic Revolution, the hostages, the Iran-Iraq War, and … all that? I remember them from 30 years ago… As I said, I may not know enough about their current activities (trying to make nuclear weapons and having a president who’s a dick), but all the things you listed occurred back during the Carter administration… What has Iran done recently that’s particularly reprehensible that we believe to be indicative of the opinions and goals of the majority of ruling politicos or religious leaders? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/8 "2013-11-24T23:08:10Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > I remember them from 30 years ago… As I said, I may not know enough about their current activities (trying to make nuclear weapons and having a president who’s a dick), but all the things you listed occurred back during the Carter administration… What has Iran done recently that’s particularly reprehensible that we believe to be indicative of the opinions and goals of the majority of ruling politicos or religious leaders? [This.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_presidential_election,_2009#Aftermath) ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2013, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/9 "2013-11-24T23:20:20Z")
Okay, that’s a problem. I can’t see us building any kind of lasting anything with that regime in place. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/10 "2013-11-25T00:55:17Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > Seriously? You mean in the last few years, Or do you really not know about Mossadegh, the Shah, the Islamic Revolution, the hostages, the Iran-Iraq War, and … all that? And the anti-Israeli rhetoric and the support for Hezbollah. The rest might be forgiven and forgotten, but that remains a sticking point. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/11 "2013-11-25T01:13:29Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > Okay, that’s a problem. I can’t see us building any kind of lasting anything with that regime in place. As opposed to our longstanding relationship with that model of freedom and democracy, Saudi Arabia? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/12 "2013-11-25T01:22:08Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > As opposed to our longstanding relationship with that model of freedom and democracy, Saudi Arabia? Yeah, but that’s different. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/13 "2013-11-25T01:42:10Z")
Basically Israel is going to veto any US-Iranian Rapproachment; if a President does anything to irritate the Israeli government Israeli supporters in the U.S. will make sure the other party wins the next election. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/14 "2013-11-25T02:04:40Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Basically Israel is going to veto any US-Iranian Rapproachment; if a President does anything to irritate the Israeli government Israeli supporters in the U.S. will make sure the other party wins the next election. How will they do that? Mind control? ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/15 "2013-11-25T02:18:03Z")
All those US Jews who vote in lockstep with Tel Aviv will do it. They are a measurable fraction of our population. Not a BIG fraction, but they can make or break a candidate in certain neighborhoods in Boca or Skokie. Today a suburban precinct, tomorrow the world! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/16 "2013-11-25T02:28:56Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > All those US Jews who vote in lockstep with Tel Aviv will do it. They are a measurable fraction of our population. Not a BIG fraction, but they can make or break a candidate in certain neighborhoods in Boca or Skokie. Today a suburban precinct, tomorrow the world! :rolleyes: No, it’s all the Jews who control the media. They’ll sound out the memos to all their goy henchmen to write nothing but negative stuff about Obama. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/17 "2013-11-25T02:39:05Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Basically Israel is going to veto any US-Iranian Rapproachment; if a President does anything to irritate the Israeli government Israeli supporters in the U.S. will make sure the other party wins the next election. > [@John\_Mace](#): > > How will they do that? Mind control? > [@dropzone](#): > > All those US Jews who vote in lockstep with Tel Aviv will do it. They are a measurable fraction of our population. Not a BIG fraction, but they can make or break a candidate in certain neighborhoods in Boca or Skokie. Today a suburban precinct, tomorrow the world! :rolleyes: More likely there’d be retaliation from the fundie Christians who support Israel because of their take on End Times “prophecy”; there’s far more of them than there are Jews in the US, much less Jews who blindly support Israel. And having nothing to do with Israel, there’s the rabid nationalists who _just can’t stand_ the fact that Iran hasn’t historically knuckled under to America like they are “supposed” to. And of course there are the “Obama must fail at any cost!” Republicans who’ll oppose any such thing just because it _might_ be counted as a success by Obama. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/18 "2013-11-25T02:53:26Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > More likely there’d be retaliation from the fundie Christians who support Israel because of their take on End Times “prophecy”; there’s far more of them than there are Jews in the US, much less Jews who blindly support Israel. > > And having nothing to do with Israel, there’s the rabid nationalists who _just can’t stand_ the fact that Iran hasn’t historically knuckled under to America like they are “supposed” to. And of course there are the “Obama must fail at any cost!” Republicans who’ll oppose any such thing just because it _might_ be counted as a success by Obama. How many of those voters would vote for a Democrat under any circumstances? IOW, that’s not going to swing an election. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/19 "2013-11-25T02:53:28Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > More likely there’d be retaliation from the fundie Christians who support Israel because of their take on End Times “prophecy”; there’s far more of them than there are Jews in the US, much less Jews who blindly support Israel. > > And having nothing to do with Israel, there’s the rabid nationalists who _just can’t stand_ the fact that Iran hasn’t historically knuckled under to America like they are “supposed” to. And of course there are the “Obama must fail at any cost!” Republicans who’ll oppose any such thing just because it _might_ be counted as a success by Obama. And how exactly will these “fundie Christians” “retaliate” against Israel? Did they “retaliate” against Reagan after he told Begin to get out of Lebanon and did they turn against George Bush when he rapped the Israelis in the nose over settlements and loan guarantees? I ask, because I don’t remember any retaliations by fundies deciding to turn Democrat. Could you point me to some examples? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2013, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700/20 "2013-11-25T03:10:20Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > And how exactly will these “fundie Christians” “retaliate” against Israel? They won’t? They _support_ Israel. Well sort of; they support the existence of a Jew-controlled Israel because they think Biblical prophecy requires the Jews to be in charge of Israel in order to be slaughtered as the End Times begin. So from the Israeli point of view they’d be an example of what’s been called “useful idiots”, not real allies. > [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > I ask, because I don’t remember any retaliations by fundies deciding to turn Democrat. They don’t need to “turn Democrat” to affect elections; they just need to support a Republican who agrees with them, or just stay home and not vote. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-us-iranian-rapproachment-possible/674700.md?page=2)