# Is Adultery Wrong **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 27, 2010, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470 "2010-10-27T01:07:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/41 "2010-10-27T13:35:48Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > That would only be the case if > > (a) the arranger will only arrange a marriage with someone from within your ethnic group > > _ **and** _ > > (b) you can _only_ enter an arranged marriage. Both of these things are characteristics of arranged marriage. > [@](#): > > As for (b), I have a friend from a community in which arranged marriage is common. He dated a number of women, some of them arranged by his parents with a view to marriage, some introduced to him by wider family or friends with the same view and some that he met himself, at school, at work or socially. He eventually married a woman introduced to him by his sister with a view to marriage. He assures me that there was no issue at all about his having rejected all the women suggested by his parents, and that there would equally have been no issue had he married someone that he had met himself. This would not be arranged marriage, then. Arranged marriage, by definition, means that someone else arranges it, nit that they just introduce you to people. It is not racist just to marry someone of your own ethnic group, obviously, but it is racist to forbid your children from marrying outside that group. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/42 "2010-10-27T13:43:05Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > I’ve heard of it working the way that **even sven** And **One and Only Wanderer** mention it. The way my mom explained it to me (and no, I’m not getting into one) is more like parents or relatives will introduce you to some people–kind of a set up. It’s no more forceful than a blind date or matchmaking. That’s not arranged marriage. That’s just introducing people. > [@](#): > > So for those of us not up on our Ayn Rand, what did she do? She insisted that she be able to sleep with other people but that her husband could not. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/43 "2010-10-27T13:53:03Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > That’s not arranged marriage. That’s just introducing people. Why can’t it also fit into arranged marriage, since people doing it are the ones using that term? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/44 "2010-10-27T13:55:59Z")
Because it doesn’t meet the definition of arranged marriage. Nothing is being arranged. It doesn’t matter if they use the term. It just means they’re using it wrong (or so watering down the practice that the term no longer applies). ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/45 "2010-10-27T13:57:40Z")
People may make arrangements to find you someone based on what you want in a partner (finances/job, personality, good family background, etc.). It’s just that if you don’t hit it off or want to pull out, you can. Maybe you’re thinking of forced marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/46 "2010-10-27T13:59:56Z")
No, I’m thinking of arranged marriage, as in marriages that are arranged. If they’re not arranged, then they’re not arranged. Simply introducing people is not arranging anything (thought it still does involve those racist parameters I was talking about). ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/47 "2010-10-27T14:05:05Z")
Forget it, Jake. It’s Doggy-knees. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/48 "2010-10-27T14:12:44Z")
Yeah, right. It’s me that’s being obtuse, not the people changing definitions of words. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/49 "2010-10-27T14:30:07Z")
[QUOTE=even sven] Careful. An arranged marriage is not the same as a forced marriage. The vast majority of arranged marriages are freely entered by two people who want to create a family unit, expect fidelity of each other, and hope that love will grow. As a system, it’s results surely are not worse than our willy-nilly passion based on. Anyway, these days arranged marriages are more like really marriage-focused online dating than anything else and cheating would almost certainly be a violation of a freely given promise. [/QUOTE] I was thinking of more the forced kind when I wrote that. I have a friend from India who was in just such an arrangement. His folks and his wife’s folks basically arranged the whole thing (they didn’t ask the kids what they thought at all). He says he didn’t even really know her when they got married. And he was completely miserable, since she was not a very nice person (and as stupid as a rock IMHO). Anyway, in his situation I would say that adultery would not only NOT be wrong, but possibly the only thing that could keep him sane (not that he seems to be taking my excellent advice…of course, my excellent advice involved dumping her and moving to the US where I could hook him up with a job and he could find a mate here. I’m not a homosexual and even I think he’s incredibly good looking and just a great guy). The point I was making though is that circumstances are going to impact whether something is ‘good’ or ‘bad’, and the assessment of ‘good’ or ‘bad’ is going to be highly dependent on the person making the call, their view point, and level of involvement. If the OP has highly rigid morals then I’m not sure what the point of this ‘debate’ even is, since nothing is going to sway him or her from that stance…just as I think it’s going to be a hard sell to convince most of the other folks in this thread that adultery is ALWAYS wrong (unless one of the participants is raped, in which case it’s ok, though still adultery…to be sure…:rolleyes:) -XT ---
**Author:** ![Reno\_Nevada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Reno\_Nevada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reno_Nevada)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/50 "2010-10-27T14:42:28Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Yeah, right. It’s me that’s being obtuse, not the people changing definitions of words. See, **Dio** , there are people right now, like today, October 27th, marrying people that they met recently, have known very briefly, and who were screened for suitability by their parents. These marriages are called “arranged” by almost all English-speaking people, but the marriages do not work like the ones in your fevered imagination. In particular, both participants are entering into the marriage with very different expectations than you might think. I know several people who married in this way and have successful marriages. Admittedly, I have met others who had arranged marriages that failed, but then I know plenty of non-arranged marriages that failed. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/51 "2010-10-27T14:44:46Z")
Let’s continue this hijack [in the pit](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=13071187#post13071187). ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/52 "2010-10-27T14:45:50Z")
> [@Reno\_Nevada](#): > > See, **Dio** , there are people right now, like today, October 27th, marrying people that they met recently, have known very briefly, and who were screened for suitability by their parents. These marriages are called “arranged” by almost all English-speaking people, but the marriages do not work like the ones in your fevered imagination. How do you know? How do they work in my fevered imagination? > [@](#): > > In particular, both participants are entering into the marriage with very different expectations than you might think. I know several people who married in this way and have successful marriages. Admittedly, I have met others who had arranged marriages that failed, but then I know plenty of non-arranged marriages that failed. I know what the expectations are and am familiar with how it works. I know that sometimes the marriages are happy. It’s still a backwards and racist paractice. Call me crazy, but I kind of believe in free choice. ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/53 "2010-10-27T15:10:44Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I’m prepared to assume any stance that is the direct opposite of the OP’s. Starting off from the aphorism “If you’re not a liberal when you’re young you have no heart / if you’re not a conservative when you’re old you have no brain”, I’m getting a bit concerned about \*\*Curtis LeMay / Qin Shi Huangdi \*\*. He’s kind of far to the right of Alex Keaton, if you know what I mean - is he going to have an epiphany and change his name to **Timothy Leary** or what? ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/54 "2010-10-27T15:29:31Z")
Getting back to the topic, I’m still bugging at this: > [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Yes always (except obviously rape which is excusable for the victim). There isn’t anything to excuse since the rape victim didn’t do anything. The fact that it even enters your mind as something to excuse or forgive is really creepy. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/55 "2010-10-27T15:54:15Z")
Back on topic, I would not consider it an immoral act if a spouse A commits adultery in the case of spouse B refusing any intimacy, even if spouse B would be hurt by it. In this case spouse B is acting somewhat immoral by putting unrealistic limits on the marriage by basically saying, “you can’t sleep with me OR anyone else.” I would also say it’s not immoral for spouse A to hide the adultery in the case I submit. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/56 "2010-10-27T16:31:25Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I would also say it’s not immoral for spouse A to hide the adultery in the case I submit. It’s (almost) always immoral to lie to people. In this case, spouse A should say to spouse B “Honey, you refuse me intimacy and you refuse to allow me to get it elsewhere. So I’m giving you the choice: allow me to be intimate with others or I’m leaving you.” Or even “I’m going to fuck other people. Do what you want with that information but I’ve already made my choice.” What’s wrong with that? Even when your actions are not wrong, it is still wrong to lie about it to relevant parties. Let everybody involved know what’s up so they can make informed decisions. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/57 "2010-10-27T16:34:19Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > Back on topic, I would not consider it an immoral act if a spouse A commits adultery in the case of spouse B refusing any intimacy, even if spouse B would be hurt by it. In this case spouse B is acting somewhat immoral by putting unrealistic limits on the marriage by basically saying, “you can’t sleep with me OR anyone else.” I would also say it’s not immoral for spouse A to hide the adultery in the case I submit. Even if Spouse A thereby exposes Spouse B to STD’s (assuming sex ever resumes between them)? or becomes pregnant by (or impregnates) the extramarital lover? As for whether “spouse B is acting somewhat immoral by putting unrealistic limits on the marriage,” that depends on **why** they’re doing so. What if Spouse A has decided to give up bathing and other personal hygiene? What if Spouse A is such an abusive asshole that Spouse B feels no desire for him/her? What if Spouse B is constantly exhausted and Spouse A won’t do anything to help? If Spouse B is denying intimacy to Spouse A, there’s **something** wrong in the marriage… but you know what they say about two wrongs not making a right. ---
**Author:** ![Kearsen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/82dd89/32.png) [@Kearsen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kearsen)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/58 "2010-10-27T16:35:36Z")
I once told my wife that she didn’t hold a monopoly on “the pussy”. It went over like a ton of bricks but It did accomplish it’s goal. I guess it all depends on what you hold sacred, if it’s the “ideal” that marriage purports to hold then it may be immoral. Otherwise, I don’t attach morality to adultery as a means to an end unless that end is to cause hurt. ---
**Author:** ![Acid\_Lamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/59 "2010-10-27T16:54:09Z")
Depends how you define “adultery”. I’d define it as “Consensual sexual contact with a partner outside of the marriage _without the consent of the spouse_.” So in that case, yes adultery would always be unethical since it is assumed that the act, by definition, is breaking all ground rules in the relationship and demonstrating a profound lack of respect for both the relationship and the spouse. Anything else would be consensual and thus not classified as adultery. Your definition of adultery, and what constitutes sexual contact will vary. ---
**Author:** ![Acid\_Lamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470/60 "2010-10-27T16:56:22Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Even if Spouse A thereby exposes Spouse B to STD’s (assuming sex ever resumes between them)? or becomes pregnant by (or impregnates) the extramarital lover? > > As for whether “spouse B is acting somewhat immoral by putting unrealistic limits on the marriage,” that depends on **why** they’re doing so. What if Spouse A has decided to give up bathing and other personal hygiene? What if Spouse A is such an abusive asshole that Spouse B feels no desire for him/her? What if Spouse B is constantly exhausted and Spouse A won’t do anything to help? > > If Spouse B is denying intimacy to Spouse A, there’s **something** wrong in the marriage… but you know what they say about two wrongs not making a right. Agreed. They should either work it out to a mutually agreeable solution or go their separate ways. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-adultery-wrong/558470.md?page=4)