# Is an armed society a polite society? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 30, 2008, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090 "2008-11-30T20:52:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/1 "2008-11-30T20:52:46Z")
So said Robert Heinlein in his first (and worst) published novel, [_Beyond This Horizon,_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beyond_This_Horizon) set in a future which has revived the custom of (only) men bearing weapons in public and responding to slights with a challenge to a duel. But “polite” is not a word I’ve ever heard applied to South Central L.A. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/2 "2008-11-30T22:04:49Z")
Stephen Pinker, in _The Blank Slate_, talks about this idea (at least orthagonally). As I stated in the other thread, he suggests that in a society in which people do not feel that a law-enforcement organization adequately provides for their protection, many folks rely on their reputation to protect them. As such, they work to build a reputation as someone who won’t tolerate the slightest slight, as someone who will vastly overreact to a slight, on the belief that they’ll therefore be safe from predation. It’s not a question of whether an armed society is a polite society, then: it’s a question of whether a lawless society is a polite society. It’s not, if you believe that politeness requires a certain amount of give and take. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/3 "2008-11-30T22:09:28Z")
I think an armed society is an armed society, and that’s about the only conclusion that can be drawn. ---
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/4 "2008-11-30T22:09:35Z")
In addition to South Central, I also submit the Old West as a test example. One might infer that being known as armed and willing to respond to slights with lethal force does indeed make people treat you with respect, until you turn your back and it catches a bullet. As a society, we have in common decided that rudeness is deserving of death, and written laws and customs accordingly. I think that the only way that an armed society would lead to a polite society is if we rethought this conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/5 "2008-11-30T22:45:12Z")
> [@robertliguori](#): > > In addition to South Central, I also submit the Old West as a test example. One might infer that being known as armed and willing to respond to slights with lethal force does indeed make people treat you with respect, until you turn your back and it catches a bullet. > > As a society, we have in common decided that rudeness is deserving of death, and written laws and customs accordingly. I think that the only way that an armed society would lead to a polite society is if we rethought this conclusion. Check that last paragraph :). Daniel ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/6 "2008-11-30T23:09:14Z")
> **[Honour](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_of_honor)** > > Honour (Commonwealth English) or honor (American English; see spelling differences) is a quality of a person that is of both social teaching and personal ethos, that manifests itself as a code of conduct, and has various elements such as valour, chivalry, honesty, and compassion. It is an abstract concept entailing a perceived quality of worthiness and respectability that affects both the social standing and the self-evaluation of an individual or of institutions such as a family, school, regi... > [@](#): > > Honor or Honour (see spelling differences), (from the Latin word honos, honoris) is the evaluation of a person’s trustworthiness and social status based on that individual’s espousals and actions. Honour is deemed exactly what determines a person’s character: whether or not the person reflects honesty, respect, integrity, or fairness. Accordingly, individuals are assigned worth and stature based on the harmony of their actions, code of honour, and that of the society at large. Honour can be analysed as a relativistic concept, i.e., conflicts between individuals and even cultures arising as a consequence of material circumstance and ambition, rather than fundamental differences in principle. Alternatively, it can be viewed as nativist — that honour is as real to the human condition as love, and likewise derives from the formative personal bonds that establish one’s personal dignity and character. ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/7 "2008-11-30T23:12:18Z")
You really think _Beyond This Horizon_ is worse than _Sixth Column_? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/8 "2008-11-30T23:47:28Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > You really think _Beyond This Horizon_ is worse than _Sixth Column_? Or _Number of the Beast_? Phew, what a stinker that was. > [@robertliguori](#): > > As a society, we have in common decided that rudeness is deserving of death, and written laws and customs accordingly. I think that the only way that an armed society would lead to a polite society is if we rethought this conclusion. Funniest thing I’ve read all day! thanks! ---
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2008, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/9 "2008-12-01T00:41:01Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Funniest thing I’ve read all day! thanks! Um. That was meant to be ‘ **not** deserving of death’ in my above quote. I appear to have unintentionally produced humor. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2008, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/10 "2008-12-01T00:46:44Z")
> [@robertliguori](#): > > Um. That was meant to be ‘ **not** deserving of death’ in my above quote. I appear to have unintentionally produced humor. go ahead give yerself a :smack: lol ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2008, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/11 "2008-12-01T01:37:07Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > You really think _Beyond This Horizon_ is worse than _Sixth Column_? Yes, because _Sixth Column_ has (1) only one plot (2) which makes sense. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2008, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/12 "2008-12-01T03:13:08Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I think an armed society is an armed society, and that’s about the only conclusion that can be drawn. Exactly right. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2008, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/13 "2008-12-01T11:22:34Z")
A German coworker in Switzerland claimed that the Swiss are so polite because they all know that everybody else does have an automatic in his house. Not “may have:” “has.” Government issue, even. So you don’t want to drive your neighbor up a wall, no no no! The Swiss are very polite but I didn’t find them particularly welcoming, or helpful. ---
**Author:** ![Llama\_Llogophile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2008, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-an-armed-society-a-polite-society/475090/14 "2008-12-01T16:07:33Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > The Swiss are very polite but I didn’t find them particularly welcoming, or helpful. I felt some of the same about the British. Politeness isn’t necessarily a good thing. Taken past basic courtesy, being extremely polite is to hide what one is really thinking or intending. Apart from any discussion of guns, I’m glad we in the U.S. are more likely to be frank with each other.