# Is Antifa a thing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 9, 2020, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309 "2020-06-09T18:15:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/101 "2020-06-18T02:52:57Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Not really. Do _you_ think antifa exists? why or why not? > > I count something on the order of 16 posts from you, just in this thread alone, that consists of nothing but a one or two line aggressive and pointless questions. what is you point? > > Not only have i shared such pictures here, it was in response to one of your questions. So, why are you asking for the third time something that has already been provided? > > Debate honestly, or i see no need to debate with you at all. You’ve not shared such pictures. You just say you have, when you haven’t. It’s hard to have a debate about ‘antifa’ when the person who claims ‘antifa’ exists won’t provide any proof as such beyond pictures that are captioned ‘antifa’ ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/102 "2020-06-18T03:21:35Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > You’ve not shared such pictures. You just say you have, when you haven’t. It’s hard to have a debate about ‘antifa’ when the person who claims ‘antifa’ exists won’t provide any proof as such beyond pictures that are captioned ‘antifa’ Not really. Do you think antifa exists? why or why not? I count something on the order of 16 posts from you, just in this thread alone, that consists of nothing but a one or two line aggressive and pointless questions. what is you point? Not only have i shared such pictures here, it was in response to one of your questions. So, why are you asking for the third time something that has already been provided? Debate honestly, or i see no need to debate with you at all. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/103 "2020-06-18T03:33:05Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Not really. Do you think antifa exists? why or why not? > > I count something on the order of 16 posts from you, just in this thread alone, that consists of nothing but a one or two line aggressive and pointless questions. what is you point? > > Not only have i shared such pictures here, it was in response to one of your questions. So, why are you asking for the third time something that has already been provided? > > Debate honestly, or i see no need to debate with you at all. My last post wasn’t a question. So you are wrong again. Good luck with all that. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/104 "2020-06-18T03:47:06Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > They have pictures of people holding signs identifying themselves as Antifa. > > What, exactly, is your point? We have pictures of Trump holding a bible in front of a church. Few would call him a religious person. People holding a sign that they are a member of a non-existent group is meaningless. North Korea holds elections. There are [pictures of people participating in those elections.](https://www.google.com/search?q=north+korea+elections&rlz=1C1GCEA_enUS868US868&sxsrf=ALeKk03yDcmPwAXFpuU64wKVEHN1x-zMXQ:1592451764089&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjDp-GNuYrqAhVNa80KHZzqB7EQ_AUoAnoECA4QBA&biw=2560&bih=1329) Hell, North Korea is properly called the “Democratic People’s Republic of Korea”. It would seem, by your reckoning, having pictures makes a thing real. So, North Korea is really a democratic state. I mean, they’ve got pictures! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/105 "2020-06-18T03:53:48Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > We have pictures of Trump holding a bible in front of a church. Few would call him a religious person. > > People holding a sign that they are a member of a non-existent group is meaningless. > > North Korea holds elections. There are [pictures of people participating in those elections.](https://www.google.com/search?q=north+korea+elections&rlz=1C1GCEA_enUS868US868&sxsrf=ALeKk03yDcmPwAXFpuU64wKVEHN1x-zMXQ:1592451764089&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjDp-GNuYrqAhVNa80KHZzqB7EQ_AUoAnoECA4QBA&biw=2560&bih=1329) Hell, North Korea is properly called the “Democratic People’s Republic of Korea”. > > It would seem, by your reckoning, having pictures makes a thing real. So, North Korea is really a democratic state. I mean, they’ve got pictures! :rolleyes: Of course, when every cite and every news agency quoted is dismissed as being fictional because muh bigfootz it’s apparent that any evidence provided would be insufficient. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/106 "2020-06-18T03:58:32Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Of course, when every cite and every news agency quoted is dismissed as being fictional because muh bigfootz it’s apparent that any evidence provided would be insufficient. Yeah, when the cites are “Google searches” and “Youtube videos”, they deserve to be dismissed. ---
**Author:** ![Mcmechanic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@Mcmechanic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mcmechanic)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/107 "2020-06-18T04:18:00Z")
The hillbilly’s around here think antifa is real and a serious threat to biker cosplay, covid 19 is fake, and evidently love paying huge life changing hospital bills. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/108 "2020-06-18T05:34:39Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > … > People holding a sign that they are a member of a non-existent group is meaningless. > > … what is your point? That there is no Antifa? It’s all made up by trump? No one has ever organized a counter demonstration against Nazis and called themselves “antifa”? Clearly that’s false. I have posted proof right here in this thread. Or do you mean- antifa isnt organized? It is whoever shows up and counter demonstrates and calls themselves “antifa”? That is true. Antifa isnt really organized, there is no membership roster, no dues, no officers, no membership cards. I have pointed that out right here in this thread. Since they did organize several counter protests you cant say they arent ever “organized” in one sense of the term- but it is so loose and open to be practically non-existent. Antifa isnt a “terrorist organization” since it isnt either terrorist or organized. It is real like “truth” is real or like “happiness” is. It is more a state of mind, a philosophy than a organization. But even tho there arent (afaik) any organization of Epicureanians, that doesnt mean that Epicureanism doesnt exist. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/109 "2020-06-18T05:42:09Z")
By the way, Mark Bray, is author of Antifa: The Anti-Fascist Handbook > **[BBC Radio 4 - Seriously..., Seriously... - Seven things you need to know...](https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/X56rQkDgd0qqB7R68t6t7C/seven-things-you-need-to-know-about-antifa)** > > The anti-fascist movement has been making the headlines, but what is it? > **[An Intimate History of Antifa](https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/an-intimate-history-of-antifa)** > > “Antifa: The Anti-Fascist Handbook,” by Mark Bray, is part history, part how-to. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/110 "2020-06-18T07:16:13Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Yeah, when the cites are “Google searches” and “Youtube videos”, they deserve to be dismissed. You ridicule or ignore NYTimes and CNN cites. Say it’s like Bigfoot. That supposed to be taken seriously? ---
**Author:** ![EnolaStraight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@EnolaStraight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EnolaStraight)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/111 "2020-06-25T13:13:34Z")
Micro-aggressions are to be met with Macro-aggressions. If someone else does/says/believes something which offends your sensibilities…you have the right to punch them in the face! “There are only two genders?” PUNCH! “An unborn baby is a person at the moment of conception?” PUNCH! “It’s okay to be a white guy?” PUNCHPUNCHPUNCH!!! ANTIFA uses violence…or the threat thereof…to forbid you from exercising your thoughts and beliefs because they don’t like it. That’s not Anti-Fascism. _That’s straight-up GENUINE Fascism._ ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/112 "2020-06-25T13:20:35Z")
> [@EnolaStraight](#): > > ANTIFA uses violence…or the threat thereof…to forbid you from exercising your thoughts and beliefs because they don’t like it. No. This is something that exists in your imagination and does not reflect reality. ---
**Author:** ![EnolaStraight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@EnolaStraight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EnolaStraight)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/113 "2020-06-25T17:33:45Z")
Don’t believe me? Then believe an ANTIFA saying so herself. [Inside violent anarchist group Antifa - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUu46J_OHQ4) time index 0:50. “You have to speak in a language _they_ understand…and sometimes, that _is_ violence.” “They” don’t have to be wearing white hoods or _seig-heil"-ing_ in order to be the enemy to be fought; they need only be perceived to be. Apparently, a fascist is whoever ANTIFA says is a fascist. You work long and hard, and expect to keep all the money yourself? _Fascist._ You have a problem that upsets you and want to “fix” the problem instead of talking about how it makes you feel? _Fascist._ Your 5 year old son says he wants to be a girl, and you don’t take it seriously because only last week he wanted to be a superhero dinosaur-riding astronaut? _Fascist._ ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/114 "2020-06-25T19:13:10Z")
> [@EnolaStraight](#): > > Apparently, a fascist is whoever ANTIFA says is a fascist. > > You work long and hard, and expect to keep all the money yourself? _Fascist._ > You have a problem that upsets you and want to “fix” the problem instead of talking about how it makes you feel? _Fascist._ > Your 5 year old son says he wants to be a girl, and you don’t take it seriously because only last week he wanted to be a superhero dinosaur-riding astronaut? _Fascist._ This is made up nonsense that in no way resembles anything in the video you linked. A complete fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![EnolaStraight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/41988e/32.png) [@EnolaStraight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EnolaStraight)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/115 "2020-06-25T22:01:17Z")
Is it fantasy to realize ANTIFA practices an extreme form of Social Justice on behalf of historically marginalized groups and opposes perceived oppressors? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/116 "2020-06-25T22:08:05Z")
Yeppers. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2020, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/117 "2020-06-26T01:13:05Z")
The President said CNN and NYTimes are fake news. Why should I believe anything they say? Oh, also, [here](https://www.amazon.com/Robert-W-Morgan/dp/0937663158/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&keywords=bigfoot+handbook&qid=1593133924&s=books&sr=1-6) is a guide to finding Bigfoot, in case you are interested in other imaginary things. ---
**Author:** ![Embraceable\_Ewe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/embraceable_ewe/32/3810_2.png) [@Embraceable\_Ewe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Embraceable_Ewe)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2020, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/118 "2020-07-01T19:39:42Z")
A lot of the ‘who is really Antifa?’ discussions remind me of people making claims about Satanism. There are organized groups of people who call themselves Satanists who are primarily secular people who want to protest the mingling of church and state by government bodies. For example, if your local government wants to put up a Christmas nativity scene, the [Temple of Satan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Satanic_Temple#Tenets) may ask to put up _their_ religious symbol in the same place, primarily to make a point that the government in the US is not allowed to favor one religion above others. They But there are also teenage edgelords who call themselves as Satanists. Some of those will do things like kill a cat to show they’re serious. I’m sure the secular humanists from the Temple of Satan would like to disassociate themselves from the cat-killing teenagers, but I can see why the public has a negative perception of Satanists. Similarly, the Antifa people have a “no true Scotsman” problem. They are just as real as Satanists, but the definition of who they are and what they believe will be vastly different even among self[identified Antifa people. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2020, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/119 "2020-09-17T20:49:55Z")
To add to the discussion: > FBI Director Chris Wray told lawmakers Thursday that antifa is an ideology, not an organization, testimony that puts him at odds with President Donald Trump, who has said he would designate it a terror group. > > Wray did not dispute that antifa activists were a serious concern, saying that antifa was a “real thing” and that the FBI had undertaken “any number of properly predicated investigations into what we would describe as violent extremism,” including into individuals who identify with antifa.” > > But, he said, “It’s not a group or an organization. It’s a movement or an ideology.” > > SOURCE: [FBI director says antifa is an ideology, not an organization](https://apnews.com/bdd3b6078e9efadcfcd0be4b65f2362e) ---
**Author:** ![razordance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e47774/32.png) [@razordance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/razordance)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2020, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309/120 "2020-09-19T04:33:42Z")
Well, when you say, “These were the guys and gals we saw at Charlottesville with heavy weaponry. They were not there to cause disorder or damage property, but to physically oppose the white supremacists who showed up there,” we certainly need a great deal more of THAT! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-antifa-a-thing/855309.md?page=7)