# Is anyone else concerned with this new virus in China that is becoming a bigger problem every day? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 23, 2020, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841 "2020-01-23T12:42:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/403 "2020-02-12T04:34:20Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > Japanese people are too xenophobic for that to happen. To be somewhat fair to them, I think the reverse would also occur. If a cruise ship of mostly Chinese tourists were docked in LA, I don’t think the US would quarantine them on land, either. Many of these decisions are made for political rather than reasons. That reason would never have occurred to me. I’d be interested if that was documented anywhere. Because that could have been a death sentence for some on that ship. I don’t think anyone from the ship has died, but that was quite a gamble. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/404 "2020-02-12T04:39:21Z")
Granted, the sources aren’t the best so far, but there is some discussion about whether mass cremations are going on in Wuhan, and also another city, Chongqing, that has been quarantined. > **[Sulphur dioxide images do NOT show mass cremations in Wuhan](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7986553/Sulphur-dioxide-images-NOT-mass-cremations-Wuhan.html)** > > Maps from the weather service Windy.com were widely shared online last week, purporting to show high SO2 levels at ground zero of the coronavirus outbreak. Someone was talking about it at a meetup I attended this evening, and since I hadn’t heard anything like this, I decided to see for myself. I do know that in the past when they’ve done mass culls of livestock, they were destroyed by burning. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/405 "2020-02-12T08:27:18Z")
Just from seeing a big SO2 cloud we can’t know if it’s one big cremation or many, or, as the article concedes, if much of it is due to burning used masks, blankets etc. Sent from my Redmi 5A using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/406 "2020-02-12T11:34:20Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I would think they would take them off the ship and quarantine them in on land. what if the confined quarters is the incubator for more cases? Is anybody ever going to feel safe taking a cruise on on this ship? Quarantining those on a ship is not done to benefit those on board the ship, it’s done to protect those on shore. That is how all ship board quarantines have been since people started doing them. Yes, it’s inhumane for those on board, and more of them will get sick and/or die than if they were housed separately on land, but if the people on land fear the illness sufficiently they won’t care about the greater losses among those kept on a ship, they’ll only care that they themselves on land are perceived to be safer. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/407 "2020-02-12T17:08:53Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Quarantining those on a ship is not done to benefit those on board the ship, it’s done to protect those on shore. That is how all ship board quarantines have been since people started doing them. > > Yes, it’s inhumane for those on board, and more of them will get sick and/or die than if they were housed separately on land, but if the people on land fear the illness sufficiently they won’t care about the greater losses among those kept on a ship, they’ll only care that they themselves on land are perceived to be safer. This. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/408 "2020-02-12T17:43:07Z")
There’s nothing magic about the shoreline. If people come and go from the ship to resupply, etc. … then the same “logic” driving the fear of infection should apply. No one’s suggesting letting the cruise-ship patrons loose among the populace – just let them quarantine on land. Still quarantined. I understand that true, cold science is not driving the decision making. More’s the pity. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/409 "2020-02-12T17:55:41Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I would think they would take them off the ship and quarantine them in on land. what if the confined quarters is the incubator for more cases? Is anybody ever going to feel safe taking a cruise on on this ship? That sounds very humanitarian - except where on land would you put 3700 people on such short notice, and how would you take care of them? The average hotel has maybe 100 rooms, into which you could put maybe an average of two or three passengers. So you’d be shopping around for about ten hotels and buying out all of their rooms. You would need to transport all of these people, secure them in their new accommodations to limit their movements, and make arrangements to have food prepared and brought to their rooms. This would be a massive undertaking, and if you’re cramming these people 2-3 to a room, it’s not really any better for them (in terms of contagion) than being on the ship. Frankly, the ship is not a nice place to keep all these folks - especially the poor folks stuck in windowless staterooms for several days at a time. However, in terms of containing a potential public health disaster that could kill thousands more in Japan, this is the best solution. The ship already has what it takes to feed and house all these people in one place and prevent them from wandering into town; just bring more provisions to the ship, pay the crew a bunch of overtime (maybe even hazardous duty pay?), and keep anyone from crossing the gangway. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/410 "2020-02-12T20:54:11Z")
They are actually confined to their rooms on the ship. Not completely terrible if you have a balcony looking out at Yokohama, but like being in prison for anybody with an inside cabin. And they are being let out into the exercise yard for half an hour a day… Where they are told to stay at least 1 meter from each other. To receive meals, they have to mask up before opening the door. The staff are masked and gloved at all times. The new cases are presumably people who were already infected before they started individual quarantine. Are the new cases just passengers? If they are kitchen staff that might present a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2020, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/411 "2020-02-12T22:55:03Z")
There are new cases among the crew who, it should be pointed out, live more communally than the passengers. There is probably more danger of the crew passing it to each other than the passengers passing it around. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/412 "2020-02-13T00:43:20Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > Just from seeing a big SO2 cloud we can’t know if it’s one big cremation or many, or, as the article concedes, if much of it is due to burning used masks, blankets etc. > > Sent from my Redmi 5A using Tapatalk I have a feeling that a lot of it is due to destruction of medical waste. Hope so, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/413 "2020-02-13T01:50:33Z")
Meanwhile they must have run a big backlog batch of samples - confirmed case number JUMPED today after a small flattish patch. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/414 "2020-02-13T02:16:14Z")
> [@](#): > > BREAKING: Hubei reports 242 deaths & 14840 new cases > The government explained they are now adding “clinically diagnosed cases” in the tally of cases to make it easier for these patients to receive treatment early. > 2 hours ago · CNN From [here](https://thewuhanvirus.com/) Seems to be a significant jump in the number of deaths. ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/415 "2020-02-13T02:48:39Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > There’s nothing magic about the shoreline. If people come and go from the ship to resupply, etc. … then the same “logic” driving the fear of infection should apply. No one’s suggesting letting the cruise-ship patrons loose among the populace – just let them quarantine on land. Still quarantined. > > I understand that true, cold science is not driving the decision making. More’s the pity. By keeping them on the boat Japan can claim a lower number of infections “in Japan”. They are not “in Japan” so they don’t get counted. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/416 "2020-02-13T03:09:53Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > From [here](https://thewuhanvirus.com/) > > Seems to be a significant jump in the number of deaths. At a case fatality rate lower than what it had been (this batch 1.6% while overall remains 2.3%). Just _switching_ from confirmed cases to clinically diagnosed cases is a poor way to report it out. More ideally they should start a new line of clinically diagnosed cases and also continue to report out the confirmed case number. ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/417 "2020-02-13T03:40:12Z")
Is there data yet on exactly who is dying after having been infected? At first, the word was that it was only the elderly or those with other health conditions. But then the healthy young doctor died. I would think that the sample size is large enough to yield some good data by now. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/418 "2020-02-13T04:11:19Z")
For the cruise ship, I wondered if there is any danger of infections from shared heating. The web site claims > [@](#): > > Can the coronavirus be spread through the ship’s ventilation system? > A: The HVAC (heating ventilation air-conditioning) filtration system on our ships is comparable to those used by land-based hotels, resorts and casinos. > > According to a letter recently sent to cruise ship passengers and crew members onboard cruise ships by Anne Schuchat, principal deputy director at the U.S. CDC, there is no current evidence to suggest that the virus spreads through air-handling systems. Staying in your room and limiting contact with other people are the best ways to minimize exposure. Some experts say that it’s not a good idea to keep them on the ship. > [@](#): > > “The issue with quarantine remains the lack of ability in a closed environment like this to maintain infection prevention measures on a ship,” said Dr. Eric Cioe-Pena, director of global Health at Northwell Health in New Hyde Park, NY. > > “We are seeing numbers increase dramatically, which likely means that there is ongoing spread of the virus on these ships. That’s concerning, as its creating a second epicenter of the infection, in a Japanese port,” he said. I had to pick up my normal medication at the hospital yesterday and they wouldn’t let me in without a mask. I didn’t have one and a very kind passerby gave me one. Very kind of a stranger to help. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/419 "2020-02-13T04:35:17Z")
Yesterday was the first day that there was a significant decline in the reported _confirmed cases_. I guess we’re going to have to use a steroids era asterisk now. I agree that adding a lump of _clinically confirmed_ cases is a poor way of reporting it. If it is true that the number jumped because of adding _clinically confirmed_ cases, then the number should plateau again tomorrow. Unless. There is an ongoing group of untested yet _clinically confirmed_ patients. This suggests either a shortage of tests or a large group of fairly healthy yet infected patients. I don’t think this will turn out to be true but I believe we’ll have a better idea tomorrow. The decision to leave those patients on the cruise ship(s) will result in lawsuits at minimum. The days of plague ships should be long behind us. ETA, Heard that my US hospital was having trouble finding exam masks. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/420 "2020-02-13T05:20:08Z")
> [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](#): > > Is there data yet on exactly who is dying after having been infected? At first, the word was that it was only the elderly or those with other health conditions. But then the healthy young doctor died. I would think that the sample size is large enough to yield some good data by now. It appears to be mostly elderly or those with pre-existing conditions. [CNBC story](https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/11/the-coronavirus-appears-to-be-sparing-one-group-of-people-kids.html?recirc=taboolainternal). I don’t have a tremendous amount of confidence in this. One, this is too new and still unfolding. Two, today we learned of a large number of untested patients. If there are a large number of patients not being tested _and_ a belief that children aren’t being infected, it is possible they are being seriously under diagnosed. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/421 "2020-02-13T10:09:40Z")
The AP is reporting that 44 more people on the cruise ship docked in Japan have now tested positive. Additionally, five are “on artificial respirators or in intensive care”. The total positively identified as infected on that ship is now 218. That’s almost 6% of the 3700 passengers and crew. I’d like to think, that whoever thought that was it was a good idea to keep everyone confined on that ship, is held accountable. ---
**Author:** ![polar\_bear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ec9cab/32.png) [@polar\_bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/polar_bear)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841/422 "2020-02-13T10:27:43Z")
As has been posted before, the decision to quarentine the shop was not done to protect the people on board… Verstuurd vanaf mijn moto g(6) met Tapatalk [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-anyone-else-concerned-with-this-new-virus-in-china-that-is-becoming-a-bigger-problem-every-day/846841.md?page=22)