# Is civil war in Egypt averted? 90% yes for new Constitution. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 17, 2014, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071 "2014-01-17T16:30:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/121 "2014-01-21T08:32:00Z")
Most Egyptians will vote for Sisi if he runs. All the other candidates have very little or no popular support so they would have to negotiate with the MB. Sisi will not negotiate with the terrorist brothers and Egyptians know that and that’s part of reason they will back him 100% IF he runs. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/122 "2014-01-21T08:37:01Z")
Rep. Rohrabacher: “Totally on board with Sisi’s program” and says “Morsi undermined democracy with desire for radical caliphate and lied to the people” Rep. Sanchez: “It’s truly amazing when a military sides with the people and says enough! let’s try this democracy thing again… The next government will be elected by the “real people” of Egypt” ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 8:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/123 "2014-01-21T08:40:40Z")
This is exactly what Egypt would have looked like if the Egyptian army had not listened to the people and Tamarod calling for ouster of Morsi. _The Morsi that Obama and EU support!_ Gouta Islamic State in what WAS Arab worlds most cultured secular country Syria. [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMqz-aNCda8) ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/124 "2014-01-21T08:52:30Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > That is, not that I encourage the idea of any nation as a U.S. trophy, but, why not Egypt in particular? Egypt for one is not tribal. Egyptians are nationalists. Egypt’s army is historically famous going right back to bible. Egypt was not constructed and given borders and monarchs by foreign powers. Every Egyptian has watched the USA and what it has been doing for a very long time in our region. Every Egyptian has had to deal with repercussions of US support for Israel on our border for 60 years and it’s hypocrisy and vetos and bias. Egyptians love their army. Egyptians are very peaceful people, we do not interfere in other countries business, BUT when we are pushed then you see what you saw on 25th January 2011. Egyptians brand of Islam is very moderate, moderated by Al Azhar which has a more Sufi peaceful nature and is not radical like Wahabism or Shia. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/125 "2014-01-21T09:06:21Z")
You know, you’ve been making quite a lot of nasty remarks about Israel in this threat, **Marmite Lover,** especially considering the fact that my country is the biggest supporter of General Sissi’s regime in, like, the world. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/126 "2014-01-21T09:06:54Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > In the US, if a general, even a beloved one, resigns or retires that’s pretty much it. He quit his job, and no one follows him around after that. In Egypt I gather, a beloved general is always a general not only to his fellow officers but to the whole country. It’s not really comparable. Egyptian generals can become patriarchs of society, in the US they’re done as soon as they sign the paper. and what makes you think that Egypt is different? Egyptians love their army because the army is the people, our sons, our uncles and fathers. It doesn’t matter who is the musheer although currently Sisi has a massive following and a LOT of them WOMEN! 😃 He is liked because he is quiet and a moderate Muslim and this is one thing that is said about him over and over here, and he is an honest man and his family are well known as humble people. In Egypt the ‘family’ background matters a lot. He has massive respect in Egypt because of his character, his manners. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/127 "2014-01-21T12:53:57Z")
> [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > Rep. Sanchez: > > “It’s truly amazing when a military sides with the people and says enough! let’s try this democracy thing again… The next government will be elected by the “real people” of Egypt” So who was it that elected Morsi, then, if not the “real people” of Egypt? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/128 "2014-01-21T13:41:17Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > So who was it that elected Morsi, then, if not the “real people” of Egypt? What I believe you are being told is that the vast majority of Morsi supporters are themselves not extremists but certainly believe that their religion must or should be a strong part of the governing law of the land. The trick is having Islam related to national governance but have a real democracy where non-belief or moderate to secular views are protected. When Morsi got elected he began it appeared to many that democracy that protected secularism was not Morsi’s true agenda. Real democracy was in peril under Morsi, It was proper Sisi to take Morsi’s regime down. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/129 "2014-01-21T13:59:45Z")
> [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > This is exactly what Egypt would have looked like if the Egyptian army had not listened to the people and Tamarod calling for ouster of Morsi. _The Morsi that Obama and EU support!_ > Gouta Islamic State in what WAS Arab worlds most cultured secular country Syria. > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMqz-aNCda8&feature=youtu.be](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMqz-aNCda8&feature=youtu.be) Do you consider that Obama as president of the United States of America at the time that Morsi was elected must officially support the democratically elected government and say so publicly? And secondary to that can you accept that the US government through the Department’s of Stare and Defense can quietly and in private support the leadership of the Egyptian military because it is more in line with US policy in the region? And thirdly there is the politics of Egypt and the US where a fine line must be walked by the US government that won’t be seen by Egyptians as interfering in the new workings of democracy within Egypt? In other words the US should not publicly support the secularists and the military for fear if giving raw meat to anti democracy extremists who would label men of good family character such as Sisi to be a US puppet. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/130 "2014-01-21T14:07:38Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > You know, you’ve been making quite a lot of nasty remarks about Israel in this threat, **Marmite Lover,** especially considering the fact that my country is the biggest supporter of General Sissi’s regime in, like, the world. Even Israel allies are making lots of nasty remarks about it now. They woke up too. IF the world knew what it does today do you think for a second they would support the creation of the aparthied terrorist state of Israel? Israeli baby was born out of terrorism. It should never have been born. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/131 "2014-01-21T14:08:52Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > So who was it that elected Morsi, then, if not the “real people” of Egypt? Morsi was elected by people who had to choose between Shafik and him or by the millions who got oil and rice in exchange for their vote. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/132 "2014-01-21T14:18:40Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Do you consider that Obama as president of the United States of America at the time that Morsi was elected must officially support the democratically elected government and say so publicly? > > And secondary to that can you accept that the US government through the Department’s of Stare and Defense can quietly and in private support the leadership of the Egyptian military because it is more in line with US policy in the region? > > And thirdly there is the politics of Egypt and the US where a fine line must be walked by the US government that won’t be seen by Egyptians as interfering in the new workings of democracy within Egypt? In other words the US should not publicly support the secularists and the military for fear if giving raw meat to anti democracy extremists who would label men of good family character such as Sisi to be a US puppet. 1. To be honest the reality now is very few Egyptians actually care a damn about what the USA thinks. 2. What is the US policy in the region? 3. Egypt and Egyptians are not the same as before. The US has been turned on it’s head and has no clue what do do. For once we are in control and it will not be easy for Egyptians to ever again think that the people are not in control. We will have demanded 3 presidents in 3 years. Americans can only dream of being able to do that. Democracy. The people decide. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/133 "2014-01-21T14:20:47Z")
Test Balloon Al Hayat reporting that Sisi will resign in days and run for president due to massive popular support. To be confirmed by the Military council. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/134 "2014-01-21T14:27:48Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > What I believe you are being told is that the vast majority of Morsi supporters are themselves not extremists but certainly believe that their religion must or should be a strong part of the governing law of the land. > > The trick is having Islam related to national governance but have a real democracy where non-belief or moderate to secular views are protected. When Morsi got elected he began it appeared to many that democracy that protected secularism was not Morsi’s true agenda. Real democracy was in peril under Morsi, It was proper Sisi to take Morsi’s regime down. Is a “real democracy” what they have now, where the military removes the president from power, then the president’s party and those similar to them (e.g., Strong Egypt) are suppressed from organizing and campaigning? “Real democracy” is in peril all right, but not only, or even primarily, from Morsi. > [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > Morsi was elected by people who had to choose between Shafik and him or by the millions who got oil and rice in exchange for their vote. And those aren’t the “real people” of Egypt? ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/135 "2014-01-21T14:28:43Z")
Western Media Promotes Anti-Democrat Agenda with Egypt Coverage > [@](#): > > I’ve witnessed first-hand the highs and lows since that time. The reality on the ground in Egypt is completely different than what you will read in the Washington Post or the New York Times. The western media is not representing the truth of the situation here in Egypt, but seem to be pandering to an anti-democratic and politically incompetent group that has been openly rejected by the majority of the Egyptian people. > > The realization that Egyptians are fighting the war on terrorism – daily - in their own backyards does not seem to register or resonate with the Western media; they seem to be too concerned about promoting “democracy” than the value of human lives in a nation gripped by Islamist violence. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/136 "2014-01-21T14:31:01Z")
> [@](#): > > The same pundits that are criticizing Egypt’s democratic roadmap are the very same people who I imagine will criticize the will of the Egyptian people for summoning General el-Sisi to run for President. > > The question is: are they really promoting democracy? > > If they are, it would make sense that they should fully support the will of the Egyptian people as it has been expressed by peaceful marches and ballots. > > \*\*Democracy requires governance by and for the people, not decided once, but over and over. \*\* > Democracy allows for the removal of an unjust leader through due process; as our founding fathers recognized, when a ruler abuses his power, it is a nation’s duty to depose him and restore a just order. > > Democracy hinges on the willingness of men and women to resist movements and ideologies that have no respect for limited government, but who choose to embrace any tactic that will bring them to the top. more here on how Western Media have been manipulating what it happening [http://azzasedky.typepad.com/egypt/2014/01/western-media-promotes-anti-democrat-agenda-with-egypt-coverage.html](http://azzasedky.typepad.com/egypt/2014/01/western-media-promotes-anti-democrat-agenda-with-egypt-coverage.html) ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/137 "2014-01-21T14:32:06Z")
\*\* The image that the Western media is disseminating on the Egyptian military is completely unfounded and could not be farther from the truth. I have witnessed first-hand the love and admiration that the Egyptian people have for their military. There is a special bond between the people and the military here in Egypt; it is a very unique relationship.\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/138 "2014-01-21T14:32:46Z")
What “due process” accompanied Morsi’s removal, again? ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/139 "2014-01-21T14:34:16Z")
**Here are some of the comments taken from my interviews with Egyptian voters this week to get a sense of the mood:** Dr. Noha Bakr, college professor “Due to the high turn out on the constitution referendum, it took me three hours to be able to cast my vote. I was very happy to stand and witness how everyone was standing full of hope and confidence in the future. Everyone around made me feel we are moving forward to a better Egypt, unlike the 2012 constitution referendum where many felt it was institutionalizing an Islamic Empire on the Expense of our Egyptian Identity” Samira Habashy, 42 yrs old “One million yeses, Sisi is our President from now. Next 15th January we are going to be happy as the results of today. With our spirit and our life we are going to say yes for Sisi.” Khaled Khalil, 50 yrs old “Today means the interpretation of 30 June. I read the Constitution and made sure to read it and I agree 95% with it…the future is not easy, we still have challenges…people must understand there are differences between the U.S., Europe and Egypt in democracy. We have to take step by step to build our democracy.” Essam Moustafa Mahran, 43 yrs old “This is the first step in the road map for Egypt. The Egyptian nation has chosen a new life with most of the Christian and Muslim community with unity…If General Sisi will go for the President election, I will have the honor to be the first one to give my voice for his vote.” Tahany Ahmed Mohamed 69 yr old lady, former lawyer “Very happy, a happy day. We destroyed terrorism and the Muslim Brotherhood. Obama is not good, we love Americans, but we are against the Obama Administration. The Egyptian American relations forever.” Nagwa Hassain, 75 yr old lady “This is considered no less than the biggest festival of occasions in the Islamic religion, such as the sacrifice of feast or Ifthar feast…Obama is supporting the Muslim Brotherhood since day one. I thought and believed Obama was the symbol of democracy, but after what he has done, I am very disappointed and can’t rely on him anymore”. Safinaz Abd Almageed, 76yr old lady “I love Egypt. The future will be good…America, I am sorry to say, that it is against terrorism but She [America] helped terrorism in Egypt, and for that, all Arabs do not love the American Administration. They never do what they have promised or said, but we love the American people.” Manwa Yehia, mother 38 yrs old “It is a big day for all the Egyptian people. Voting for our country and the future of our children. I need a good future for my son…I don’t know why Obama is supporting terrorism and why he wants to destroy Egypt…Do you, the American people, support your President and his regime? We know the American people are kind people. We here are certain that the American people don’t approve of what Obama is doing”. Merna Nadra, 21 yrs old “Egypt will be in safe hands. We love the military and we trust them. They stand with the Egyptians and they protect Egypt. We were in danger with the Muslim Brotherhood…America should understand the Egyptian people and their desire to be free. I invite the American people to come to Egypt and see we are not a terrorist state. The Muslim Brotherhood are the terrorists.” With the constitutional referendum overwhelmingly passed – with millions more voting than during the Islamist referendum in December 2012 - the interim government will now proceed with presidential and parliamentary elections. As the third anniversary of the January 25th Revolution approaches, all Egyptians need to work to put the past behind them and embrace the future ahead without consideration of the scorn of Western governments and media. As was true for our own War for Independence and subsequent history, the process is not perfect. But I saw this week that many Egyptians are trying their best, and as longtime allies, and as a democracy with our own shortcomings, we should support them in their aspirations to become a more free and more secure country. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2014, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071/140 "2014-01-21T14:43:59Z")
> [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > Even Israel allies are making lots of nasty remarks about it now. They woke up too. > > IF the world knew what it does today do you think for a second they would support the creation of the aparthied terrorist state of Israel? Israeli baby was born out of terrorism. It should never have been born. Whatever. Just as long as you guys keep the Muslim Brotherhood/Hamas out of power, you can say what you want. Everyone here was \*very \*happy to see Morsi go. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-civil-war-in-egypt-averted-90-yes-for-new-constitution/679071.md?page=8)