# Is Dennis Miller a complete sellout? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 4, 2004, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455 "2004-02-04T06:55:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/1 "2004-02-04T06:55:17Z")
I used to enjoy Dennis Miller’s rants, but over the years he seemed to move further away from the “get real, people” guy who butchered sacred cows and told activists of all ilks to get the hell over themselves into an embittered parody of his former self who wrote his rants on a template. “Seriously, it’s like (insert semi-obscure pop-culture figure) trying to \_\_\_\_\_ that \_\_\_\_\_ in (insert semi-obscure literary reference), but you know folks…”. Now he’s even worse. As he’s shifted right politically it’s not his views that make me despise him but rather the fact that he’s completely abandoned his former “take no prisoners/make no friends” ways. He will NOT say anything critical of George Bush, for example, stating that he’s shared a limo with him and it would be uncivil and even defending PATRIOT and other measures as fully justified by 9-11, a view that even many conservative Republicans do not share. Is this a complete sellout and what has caused it? Do you think he’s trying to defibrillate a career in mid-arrest or has he always been that much of a tool but now its taken sides? ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/2 "2004-02-04T06:57:09Z")
> [@](#): > > Is Dennis Miller a complete sellout? Yes extra letters cuz this post is too short be we! ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/3 "2004-02-04T07:14:33Z")
The chain that owns the newspaper (very Republican, very conservative, operating out of California) that I edit sent out a note a handful of weeks ago (could have been a bit longer - my paper is not in California so I ignore a lot of their notes concerning the West Coast ) that Miller was being considered as a candidate for the California State Legislature and he was to be treated as a friendly. So if he has shifted his points of view, it seems to be working (but you don’t think even California would be foolish enough to elect an entertainer do you?) Nah, never happen. TV ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/4 "2004-02-04T07:21:36Z")
How is he a sellout? A sellout to what? Liberalism? Democrats? Miller is evolving, just as George Carlin and other aging comedians have. He’s becoming more serious, and less flippant. And sure, he’s become more conservative with age. That’s not exactly an unknown phenomenon. I have my doubts that his schtick can remain fresh 5 hours a week - I think Miller is at his best in short bits, and after time his demeanor becomes a bit irritating. I imagine he must really piss off people on the left, because he’s got a real “If you don’t agree with me you’re an idiot” attitude. Just like Bill Maher does on the left. People of the opposing viewpoint generally don’t take it kindly. ---
**Author:** ![hazel-rah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/73ab20/32.png) [@hazel-rah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hazel-rah)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/5 "2004-02-04T07:30:28Z")
Yeah, Sam is right. George Carlin isn’t funny anymore either. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/6 "2004-02-04T07:39:00Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > How is he a sellout? A sellout to what? Liberalism? Democrats? The fact that he’s drawn a 38th parallel that he won’t shoot across. To a comedian, left or right, there should be no such dividers. (Incidentally, I think Bill Maher became the host of _Politically Incorrect_ because it’s the only way he’d ever be able to have people point at him and say “My God what a prick!”- there wasn’t an episode when I didn’t want to slap him with a not-quite-dead-yet catfish at least once, and when he started whining about “censorship” when it was cancelled I wanted to change it from a catfish to a baseball bat. “Sunshine, Galileo was censored… Titus Brandsma, Aung Suu Kyi, Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn and dissidents in Iraq were censored- you were just cancelled. You’re still free to express any opinion you want in print or on the air, you just don’t have the right to get paid for it.” ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/7 "2004-02-04T08:10:35Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > I imagine he must really piss off people on the left, because he’s got a real “If you don’t agree with me you’re an idiot” attitude. Just like Bill Maher does on the left. Frankly, I’ve never understood how Maher has been able to acheive the prominance he has. Whatever one thinks of his politics, Miller is genuinely intelligent and witty; Maher is just smug, smarmy and sarcastic. From the deliberately misleading title of his program, which should have been called “Four Smug Liberals vs. One Smug Conservative,” to his blatent Johnny Carson rip-off monologue style to his disgusted forceful declarations of idiocy on the part of any attitude or idea he opposed (as you point out above) I was never able to detect any shred of genuine talent or above average intellect. And yet he gets invited to the Playboy Mansion! There is no justice!!! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/8 "2004-02-04T08:11:44Z")
Another vote for sellout. In addition to losing his Funny™ these days (the same fate that befell George Carlin – once a master of the art, now just a cranky old guy), Miller’s blatant political bias has turned him into another wanna-be conservative pundit, asif there weren’t too many of those already. And it’s not as if being funny and political are mutually exclusive, either. Jay Leno, IMO, has a fairhanded way of approaching things, which is to simply make sure you throw brickabats at both sides equally. But then, that’s why Leno is hosting _The Tonight Show_ and Miller isn’t… ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/9 "2004-02-04T08:24:01Z")
Who cares if he’s a sellout? He’s not funny anymore, that’s my problem. He lost me when this march rightward became obvious (which was way before he announced it and started stumping for Bush), which was a little while after September 11. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/10 "2004-02-04T10:49:20Z")
I remember Miller making fun of born again Christians for having to be “born…_again!_ Well pardon me if I got it right the first time!” Or something similar. It seems odd he’d back one in the White House now. Then again, this is the guy who took a chainsaw to the Middow Eastern countries in the Weekend Update world-map backdrop way back when, so I guess he and Occupant have common cause in that respect. ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/11 "2004-02-04T11:02:30Z")
According to Al Franken–who knew him back in the day–Miller’s politics are what they always were. Can you appreciate humor from a political background not your own? I agree with Franken politically, but find PJ O’Rourke (the original “Pants-Down Republican”) to be the better, funnier writer. And Al Capp and Jeff McNally were consistently better cartoonists than Garry Trudeau and Jules Feiffer. Try to appreciate the broader range of satire; you don’t want to be in the choir that gets preached to all the time. ---
**Author:** ![mazirian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@mazirian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mazirian)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/12 "2004-02-04T11:38:10Z")
[The Conversion of Dennis Miller](http://www.blacktable.com/chandler030529.htm) Next: Dennis finds Jesus and embraces the thelogical wisdom of Pat Robertson. _Cha-ching, cha-chi!_ ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/13 "2004-02-04T12:09:51Z")
I guess anyone who changes their political beliefs and philosophy as they get older and wiser must be a “sell out” to those who have yet to mature to that level yet. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/14 "2004-02-04T13:08:59Z")
I find Franken’s insights more perceptive (which may simply be a sign that my politics are closer to his), but O’Rourke is a much better writer and humorist, _when he wants to be._ His writing in the National Lampoon in the late 1970s was absolutely brilliant, along with his book _Modern Manners_. When he makes defending his strangely-delineated\*, quasi-right-wing views the highest priority, he becomes another dull, unfunny Franken of the right. _During the 1992 Presidential campaign, O’Rourke wrote a piece in Rolling Stone on the Pat Buchanan bunch, which (IIRC) concluded that PB and his followers were basically the_real\* liberals. _Huh?_ C’mon PJ – you’re no Republican, you’re a libertarian with hawkish foreign policy views. Quit trying to be so freaking serious, and be the great humorist you can be. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/15 "2004-02-04T13:11:00Z")
Dennis Miller has become the white house jester. Mahre is not nearly as left-leaning as Miller is now right-leaning. Mahre definitely doesn’t like Bush but I still think he’s more of an iconoclast than a Bush hater. Its just that there are Repubs in office. That all said, **Starving Artist** is right on in his Mahre assessment. His stand up is totally a Jonny Carson knock-off. He’s not real bright, but occasionally has something meaningful and intelligent to add. I still like him and his show though. I liked the former format where his “sidekick” did a bit and they put sketches on at the end. Miller’s problem is that a lot of his stand up has now just become unfunny. Parts of his last HBO special were just angry statements that you hear from Rush Limbaugh every day. People were kind of laughing because **he** was saying them, but if you watch that again, a lot of it just wasn’t jokes. It was just statements. Still, when he’s funny, he’s as funny as anyone out there. I do like his style. I’m waiting for him to get a movie like “Bordello of Blood” where he’s still wise-cracking, and “smarter-than-thou” but more like a detective on a case. Like a “Fletch” but less bumbling. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/16 "2004-02-04T13:55:04Z")
Dennis Miller has gotten downright strange as of late. And I’m not just talking about his drastic swing in politics (which makes me sad). I saw him on Maher’s show a while back, and I swear he was drunk. And I saw him on (god help me) an angling show the other day! Out on a lake fishing with a couple professional anglers. At 5:00 am. I like his sarcasm and I think he’s a bright guy, but when you’re doing political humor, you have to take the chance that you’ll lose a few fans if the pendulum swings the opposite direction. I don’t like him much anymore, politically. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/17 "2004-02-04T14:06:19Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > I guess anyone who changes their political beliefs and philosophy as they get older and wiser must be a “sell out” to those who have yet to mature to that level yet. Older, yes—but “wiser?” No, just terrified and paranoid. Miller admitted that 9/11 and being a father completely changed his worldview and politics. So he is actually being honest: he is a completely different person than he was five years ago. I don’t _like_ that new person, but he _is_ being honest. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/18 "2004-02-04T14:12:49Z")
I was watching Dennis Miller rant about liberals and how the Patriot Act is the best thing since sliced bread on some late-night talk show, possibly _The Tonight Show_, a few weeks ago, and asked MrWhatsit, “What the hell? Did 9/11 make him go completely freaking insane?” After some pondering, MrWhatsit said no, he didn’t think so, but possibly the anthrax attack on Rockefeller Center did. His theory is that it hit too close to home for somebody who had worked in that building for several years, and possibly that (and fatherhood, and other unknown factors) is what started swinging him to the right. I dunno, but it’s as good a theory as I’ve got. ---
**Author:** ![Pabitel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbce88/32.png) [@Pabitel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pabitel)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/19 "2004-02-04T14:14:25Z")
Dennis Miller is just plain scared. He has said as much himself. To quell his fear he supports the US acting as a bully which is pretty much the short description of US foriegn policy under Bush. The bad guys scared him so he supports scaring them even more. Everything I have heard him say since he came out as a Bushite supports this interpretation. Oh, and my reply to this point of view, “Those who give up liberty for the sake of security deserve neither liberty nor security.” — Ben Franklin ---
**Author:** ![Mal\_Adroit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df788c/32.png) [@Mal\_Adroit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mal_Adroit)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2004, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455/20 "2004-02-04T14:24:05Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > Frankly, I’ve never understood how Maher has been able to acheive the prominance he has. Whatever one thinks of his politics, Miller is genuinely intelligent and witty; Maher is just smug, smarmy and sarcastic. I disagree completely; Maher is very, very bright, though it comes across more when he’s being interviewed. I’ll grant you he can be extremely smug and condescending. But when he’s asked about issues in a one-on-one setting, he shows an astute understanding of what motivates people. Though I’m loathe to concede the point, **Sam Stone** is probably right regarding folks’ newfound irritation with Dennis Miller. Lefties like to pride themselves on their ability to laugh at things, but sit us down to watch a right-leaner who’s intelligent _and_ funny? I personally start twitching like the guy from _Scanners._ Ever notice, though, how commentators with blatantly conservative leanings are afraid to be pegged as such? Miller now joins this self-deluded group. I’ve heard both he and that fascist asshole Bill O’Reilly fume when someone addressed them as right-wingers. Something fairly pussy about this, in my opinion. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-dennis-miller-a-complete-sellout/227455.md?page=2)