Never say die, that’s my philosophy.
Google hits for
…“throw a die”: 267,000
…“throw a dice”: 188,000
So, at least in this set phrase, they seem to be used pretty much interchangeably, though with a clear preference for “throw a die”. But look how the preference is reversed when we restrict our results to sites from the UK:
“throw a die”: 10,300
“throw a dice”: 14,400
in speaking I would normally say dice for singular, unless I was specifically trying to emphasise that it was only one. In writing though it is definitely die.
And as to data and datum, yeppers - again when I am emphasising that I am speaking in the singular I will use datum
Oh - I was New Zealand edumacated, we follow that England system of spelling
According to every writer’s/style/submission guide that I’ve ever seen for an American Game manufacturer (many), and according to my friends and acquaintances who are writers and/or editors for many of those companies, the singular form is “die”.
From the Steve Jackson Games’ Guidelines:
(bolding mine)
No-one is denying that it used ot be that way (are they) but unfortunately it is one of those things where constant uncorrected incorrect usage has ended up giving the corruption official status.
In this case, “dice” is an irregular plural with no other singular/plural pair following the same pattern in English. (Other nouns with “-ice” as plural have “-ouse” as the singular; other nouns with “-ie” as singular have “-ies” as the plural). The word “die” has multiple other uses, including the very common verb meaning to become dead; “dice” is only used for gambling polyhedra or small cubes – so it makes sense for “dice” to be used as the singular as a step towards regularisation. The obvious next step is for the plural form to become “dices”. And this is not “corruption”: it’s a natural part of the way languages evolve.
I’m afraid the obvious next step was for the singular to become “douse”, and the brits missed it. I’m pretty sure that I’ve never heard “dice” as singular in the US, not even once, and something tells me it’s unlikely to catch on. Just like the plural “maths”.
I just had to comment on this and how funny it is. Since when is the US usage the “old-fashioned” usage? It’s almost always the UK version that’s considered archaic. I think that’s great.
I’ve heard it many times while playing board games as a kid and teenager. I would say “dice” was the default singular where I grew up (Chicago, 80s to 90s). I don’t think I heard “die” for singular until one of my friends started playing D&D.
I personally use “die” for the singular now, but I had to relearn it.
Mukin
Say dice for two
Mostly say die for one. Don’t often speak of one, outside of RPG situations.
Always use data in the plural sense.
One datum is just an anecdote. You don’t get data until you have a bunch.
Tris
In British (and Australian) English, “maths” is singular, just as “mathematics” is. You don’t have one “math” or one “mathematic”.
Do americans regularly use the singler “graffito” instead of “graffiti”?
“That graffito really spoils the look of the park”?
There’s several examples of this in the language, where British English further evolved, and American English kept older forms of English around. If you consider it from a historical context, it makes sense. You have English landing on our shores hundreds of years ago, mostly separated from linguistic influences on the island. The dialects are going to grow fairly independently, so some aspects of the language might evolve in England, while staying pretty much the same here, and vice versa.
I’m really blanking on examples right now, though. One that comes to mind is the subjunctive mood is much better preserved in American English than British English (although it does seem to be dying away.)
I use “graffito”, but really, it’s pretty uncommon to have need for the singular. More often, one refers to graffiti as a whole, such as “the bridge is covered in graffiti”, or in a sense where it isn’t really singular or plural, like “graffiti artist”. Although I suppose that an up-and-coming graffiti artist who has only to date produced a single solitary opus might be said to be a graffito artist.
"It should be noted that the singular – die – is rarely heard, because there is a prohibitory proverb – “Never say die”
--Ambrose Bierce *The Devil's Dictionary*
Where did you Brits learn to speak English, anyway? Sheesh.
“I had gotten” is classic English, but is rarely heard this side of the pond.
@ chronos re. graffiti… would you say “that graffiti is wonderful”, or “those graffiti are wonderful”? Or would you avoid that construction altogether?
You have some facts wrong here. The spelling “dice” is a reflection of a conservative pronunciation of a regular plural. The plural of English nouns in -s used to be pronounced with unvoiced [s], as in “sssssss.” Most of them are now the voiced equivalent of [s], “zzzzzz,” except where the preceding consonants make that difficult (cats, pups). The plural “pies” was once a perfect rhyme with “dice.” For some reason, “dice” did not voice the final consonant and the spelling reflects that by incorrect analogy with mice, lice, etc. There is at least one parallel: bodice is a re-spelled “bodies” for that one specialized usage.
Dr. Drake, your explanation of the history is interesting, and explains where “dice” comes from. However, the fact remains that die/dice is an irregular plural in present-day English with no parallel construction. “Bodice” may have a parallel history, but in present-day English the singular is “bodice” and the plural is “bodices”. And that’s the direction that I think “dice” may be heading in: “dice” and “dices”.
It seems to me that it makes much more sense to leave the singular alone and create a regular plural (one die, two dies), because:
-
That’s already the case with other meanings of the noun “die”
-
It’s consistent with pie/pies, lie/lies, tie/ties…
And based on what Dr. Drake said, that may be its origin anyway.
Lingual evolution doesn’t have to create confusion–which is what the singular dice does. I hate seeing things like the evolution of plural you, which went (at least in some parts of the U.S.):
singular “thou” plural “you”
singular “you” plural “y’all”
singular “y’all” plural “all y’all”
Where the heck is THAT one going next?