# Is eight hours too long to go without being offered a drink of water? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 14, 2018, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-eight-hours-too-long-to-go-without-being-offered-a-drink-of-water/826130 "2018-12-14T17:51:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2018, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-eight-hours-too-long-to-go-without-being-offered-a-drink-of-water/826130/221 "2018-12-30T20:48:41Z")
Why would they need a “hall pass” if our immigration policies weren’t broken? ---
**Author:** ![Dacien](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dacien/32/5663_2.png) [@Dacien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dacien)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2018, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-eight-hours-too-long-to-go-without-being-offered-a-drink-of-water/826130/222 "2018-12-30T20:51:10Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > There are different contexts. With Obama, there were some issues at the border, and somethings needed to be done. He was not presented with good options, and so chose the least bad option, even though it was also, a bad option in and of itself. > > With Trump, he is intentionally creating these situations. He knows that if he closes the border to asylum seekers, then some of them will be somewhat upset bout this, and maybe try to cross anyway. He even said that he was telling the military to shoot anyone who throws a rock. > > As I’ve said before, Obama was the guy at the switch, deciding if the run away train is going to run into the orphanage full of nuns, or the nunnery full of orphans. Trump is the guy who sold off the safety system that would have prevented that situation in the first place. > > You really cannot equate the two. Their actions do need to be taken in the context of their attitudes and actions. Just looking and seeing that one time, Obama did something superficially similar to what Trump is doing, and using that as an excuse for what Trump has done, is not an honest argument to make. I wouldn’t say it was superficially similar, Obama used tear gas at the border about once a month in 2012-2013, and again in later years, according to DHS data. It was a common method used throughout his years as president. But you’re right that context matters. The only reason I’m somewhat sympathetic to Trump’s tough line during the tear gas incident is for two reasons. One, there was a large caravan traveling to the border that presented a unique challenge, a caravan which ultimately arrived and stormed the border. Having a tough immigration stance in the face of this large group of people attempting to cross illegally is not immoral, wrong, or out of place. I don’t agree to the logic that stricter border security is inherently wrong because it leads to illegal crossings. Second, Trump inherited the same asylum backlog that existed during the Obama years. This will require an overhaul that, while we cannot credit Trump for attempting to address, we also cannot credit his predecessor who gave him this problem. It is not a Trump-created problem. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2018, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-eight-hours-too-long-to-go-without-being-offered-a-drink-of-water/826130/223 "2018-12-30T21:07:36Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Why would they need a “hall pass” if our immigration policies weren’t broken? “Broken” is a subjective term. Just because they want in doesn’t mean that we don’t have the fundamental right to say “Sorry, we’re full–have you tried Brazil?” ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2018, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-eight-hours-too-long-to-go-without-being-offered-a-drink-of-water/826130/224 "2018-12-30T23:39:37Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > “Broken” is a subjective term. Just because they want in doesn’t mean that we don’t have the fundamental right to say “Sorry, we’re full–have you tried Brazil?” Maybe if we’re actually “full” and not just saying we are because of racism and xenophobia. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2018, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-eight-hours-too-long-to-go-without-being-offered-a-drink-of-water/826130/225 "2018-12-31T02:43:15Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > “Broken” is a subjective term. Just because they want in doesn’t mean that we don’t have the fundamental right to say “Sorry, we’re full–have you tried Brazil?” Fuck if I can tell the difference between this post and Dacien’s trumpanzee nonsense. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-eight-hours-too-long-to-go-without-being-offered-a-drink-of-water/826130.md?page=11)