# Is Evergreen State College the canary in the coal mine, foretelling the death of higher education? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 2, 2017, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914 "2017-06-02T05:53:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/181 "2017-06-09T17:46:34Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > We’re talking about a very small sample of males here so I would hesitate to generalize too much, but it suggests that either a) _males_ are at a higher risk of sexual assault when they are in college, or b) that they are more likely to report it if they are college students. (if we go with ‘‘b,’’ we have to allow the possibility that female college students are less likely to report than nonstudents.) I suspect the answer is A. I don’t know what to suspect - like you say, it’s probably too small a sample to be able to tell much. As well as the usual difficulties of establishing what is meant by rape/sexual assault/harassment, reported vs. convicted, he said/he said, the even greater shame felt by male rape victims - it’s hard to be sure. > [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > But just as douchebro fratboys don’t sound the death knell of public education, neither do asshole radicals. I doubt this will be the death of public universities, but it might exacerbate something that already happens - someone graduates with a degree in Grievance Studies and can’t find a job, or else does find a job and then discovers nobody at work wants to listen to how oppressed the Third World is. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/182 "2017-06-09T17:53:59Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Thanks for your thoughts. From my perspective, the emphasis on physical bodies would seem to have the opposite effect, but maybe I’m the one thinking about it backwards. 😕 Well, would something like ‘‘the exploitation of female bodies’’ come off as weird? ''a cloud of oppression over female bodies"? Well, I guess that’s weirder. Yeah, I dunno. [QUOTE=Shodan] I doubt this will be the death of public universities, but it might exacerbate something that already happens - someone graduates with a degree in Grievance Studies and can’t find a job, or else does find a job and then discovers nobody at work wants to listen to how oppressed the Third World is. [/QUOTE] You might have missed it earlier, but I gave a pretty detailed description of what these kids will likely end up doing after college. The short answer is: working in nonprofits. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2017, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/183 "2017-06-10T21:25:11Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > It is my opinion that the vast majority of Americans want to do the right thing and vote the right way. But alienate them and they’ll fuck off. Or at least enough to let someone like Trump win. > > This Evergreen thing WILL…well, if it were closer to an election,WOULD cost votes. Who wants to be associated with that? And you can scream til your blue in the face about holding your nose and voting, and you’ll just push people further away. > There was some thread about a Slate interview recently and the interviewer asked, “Well what do we say to the millions of people that voted for a horrible racist bigot?” > > Is that really a question??? You say what you have to, to get their goddamn vote!! > > And you stop lecturing the people who sat out the last election. > > That was a general rant, not directed at anyone. Ok, I can see this. You can bet that a president Hillary would have ignored for fear of being associated with this. This would be wrong because like it or not, she would have been associated with this as would all the democrats. Now would she have called them out as snowflakes who are making a mockery of everything previous generations of liberals worked for? I doubt it. I wonder how the mainstream democrats are taking it? ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2017, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/184 "2017-06-10T21:26:14Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Well, would something like ‘‘the exploitation of female bodies’’ come off as weird? > > ''a cloud of oppression over female bodies"? Well, I guess that’s weirder. > > Yeah, I dunno. > You might have missed it earlier, but I gave a pretty detailed description of what these kids will likely end up doing after college. The short answer is: working in nonprofits. Or at Starbucks. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2017, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/185 "2017-06-10T21:31:12Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > When I went there, I had friends who turned into acquaintances over stuff like this: they’d go to Exxon stations and call people murderers if they got gas there, or they’d go to a business school and write FUCK AMERIKKKA with Sharpies on the statues, or they’d engage in a pointless environmental action that accomplished nothing other than getting a few dozen folks arrested for trespassing, and they’d count it all as a victory. > > In my experience, most of the other students rolled our eyes and changed the subject and kept on with our educations. > > I never heard anyone say they weren’t part of the Evergreen community; they were just as much a part of our community as douchebro fratboys are part of the community at other colleges. But just as douchebro fratboys don’t sound the death knell of public education, neither do asshole radicals. Yeah, but what happens when they have to write “Evergreen” on a job application? Are they going to have to say “I wasnt a part of that”? Like it or not your colleges reputation is now part of you. Part of the reason the students at the University of Colorado pushed to remove the 420 marijuana events was the perception that their school was full of potheads. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2017, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/186 "2017-06-10T22:11:32Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Or at Starbucks. But you could say that about virtually every other degree these days. The only people I’ve seen get consistent employment straight out of undergrad are engineers. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2017, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/187 "2017-06-11T00:26:17Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Yeah, but what happens when they have to write “Evergreen” on a job application? Are they going to have to say “I wasnt a part of that”? :dubious: I’ve written that shit on many job applications, and I’ve told many people where I went to school. You may be in a bubble, because in my experience, people either haven’t heard of Evergreen, or if they have, they’re knowledgeable enough about it that their eyes light up, and they say, “Oh, cool!” There are some areas of life where I’m weak (I’m a terrible flirter, and I don’t exercise enough, and on occasion I may come across as sanctimonious folks tell me), but I don’t have much practice applying at jobs, because I don’t need to: I tend to get hired pretty quickly, and I tend to stay hired. Your beliefs about the foolish prejudices folks hold against Greeners aren’t founded, in my experience. If you want to show me some stats that employers aren’t smart enough to distinguish between a school’s radical contingent and the bulk of its students, please offer those stats. Otherwise, accept that you’re wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2017, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/188 "2017-06-11T14:49:42Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > :dubious: I’ve written that shit on many job applications, and I’ve told many people where I went to school. You may be in a bubble, because in my experience, people either haven’t heard of Evergreen, or if they have, they’re knowledgeable enough about it that their eyes light up, and they say, “Oh, cool!” > > There are some areas of life where I’m weak (I’m a terrible flirter, and I don’t exercise enough, and on occasion I may come across as sanctimonious folks tell me), but I don’t have much practice applying at jobs, because I don’t need to: I tend to get hired pretty quickly, and I tend to stay hired. > > Your beliefs about the foolish prejudices folks hold against Greeners aren’t founded, in my experience. If you want to show me some stats that employers aren’t smart enough to distinguish between a school’s radical contingent and the bulk of its students, please offer those stats. Otherwise, accept that you’re wrong. Ok, but that was then, this is now. Now Evergreen is all over the news. And yes, you went there before all this crap. But what about the next wave of graduates? Will they get by so easily? Will employers still thing Greeners are cool now? ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2017, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/189 "2017-06-11T14:54:20Z")
The only time any employer gives a shit where you went to college is a) if it has an exceptionally good reputation or b) they went to the same college. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2017, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/190 "2017-06-11T15:09:44Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Ok, but that was then, this is now. Now Evergreen is all over the news. > > And yes, you went there before all this crap. > > But what about the next wave of graduates? Will they get by so easily? Will employers still thing Greeners are cool now? Do employers not hire people from ohio state university, because they riot after every game with michigan? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2017, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/191 "2017-06-12T02:12:16Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Do employers not hire people from ohio state university, because they riot after every game with michigan? Penn State, for obvious reasons? This line of reasoning is wishful schadenfreude, as far as I can tell, hoping with little evidence that bystander students at Evergreen will suffer, so that the radicals learn to shut up. It doesn’t work that way, and there’s no evidence that it’s ever worked that way. At best, a boss steeped in right-wing propaganda might make a judgment like this. That sort of boss is fairly rare in the circles I travel in, and if I lost a job under such a boss, I’d consider the bullet well dodged. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914.md?page=9)