# Is Evergreen State College the canary in the coal mine, foretelling the death of higher education? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 2, 2017, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914 "2017-06-02T05:53:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/161 "2017-06-08T22:59:34Z")
Someone once captured a good example of this: > [@Scientific facts are oppressing women](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientific-facts-are-oppressing-women/766606/51): > > I agree. It’s mundane and pointless. > > But not unique or limited to totally irrelevant people. In the world of postmodernist philosophy, [Luce-Irigaray](https://www.britannica.com/biography/Luce-Irigaray) is an important figure. She has a famous theory concerning fluid mechanics [summarized thusly:](http://www.math.tohoku.ac.jp/~kuroki/Sokal/bricmont/node17.html) > > The privileging of solid over fluid mechanics, and indeed the inability of science to deal with turbulent flow at all, she attributes to the association of fluidity with femininity. Whereas men have sex organs that protrude and become rigid, women have openings that leak menstrual blood and vaginal fluids. Although men, too, flow on occasion – when semen is emitted, for example – this aspect of their sexuality is not emphasized. It is the rigidity of the male organ that counts, not its complicity in fluid flow. These idealizations are reinscribed in mathematics, which conceives of fluids as laminated planes and other modified solid forms. In the same way that women are erased within masculinist theories and language, existing only as not-men, so fluids have been erased from science, existing only as not-solids. From this perspective it is no wonder that science has not been able to arrive at a successful model for turbulence. The problem of turbulent flow cannot be solved because the conceptions of fluids (and of women) have been formulated so as necessarily to leave unarticulated remainders. > > It is, of course, true that not all feminist intellectual work consists of this sort of thing, but there’s enough to be amused by it. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/162 "2017-06-08T23:02:28Z")
And also: > [@Scientific facts are oppressing women](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientific-facts-are-oppressing-women/766606/1): > > Earlier this year we had [feminist perspectives on glaciology](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=786492&highlight=glaciers). But that raises the obvious question, why haven’t we yet had a feminist perspective on syllabi in science courses? Not to fear, though. Laura Parsons, a graduate student from UND, is here to fill that void with [Are STEM Syllabi Gendered? A Feminist Critical Discourse Analysis](http://nsuworks.nova.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2467&context=tqr). > > Through a poststructuralist lens, it is possible to make a comparison between a modernist view of knowledge as based on notions of absolute truth and a single reality, which is masculine, and the social construction of knowledge, where knowledge is unstable and informed by context … The view of knowledge as socially constructed challenges the modern male concept of power > > Ok, so to make sure I’ve got this right, to believe that there’s a “single reality”, and that some facts are simply true and not socially constructed, is masculine. Onwards! > > The STEM syllabi explored in this study demonstrated a view of knowledge that was to be acquired by the student, which promotes a view of knowledge as unchanging. This is further reinforced by the use of adverbs to imply certainty such as “actually” and “in fact” which are used in syllabi to identify information as factual and beyond dispute (Biber, 2006a; 2006b). For example, “draw accurate conclusions from scientific data presented in different formats” (Lower level math). Instead of promoting the idea that knowledge is constructed by the student and dynamic, subject to change as it would in a more feminist view of knowledge… ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/163 "2017-06-08T23:06:54Z")
_Oral Sadism and the Vegetarian Personality_ > **[Oral Sadism and the Vegetarian Personality: Reading fro…](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/447579.Oral_Sadism_and_the_Vegetarian_Personality)** > > Fact: One hundred percent of all dead patients showed a… ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/164 "2017-06-08T23:25:16Z")
Well, I listened to the first half hour (so far) of the Rubin Report podcast with professor Brett Weinstein. It’s rare that such a fundamental injustice is placed into relief this sharply. Weinstein is a rational, thoughtful human being capable of nuanced critical thinking, and his desire to instill this in his students is obvious. When they were screaming epithets at him, he wasn’t just responding calmly and rationally - he was trying to _teach_ them. He understood what was happening, and why. At one point he said something to the effect of, ''You realize the course of history could pivot on this moment?" Honestly what pissed me off the most was seeing students take such a good teacher for granted. They displayed an utter contempt for learning and should be expelled. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/165 "2017-06-08T23:30:45Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Another sweeping change in an academic environment is greeted with alarm and foreboding. And so it goes. > > Why, these days, its near impossible to find a university or college than teaches a physics program that adheres to rock-solid Newtonian insight! The tried-and-true common sense is drowned in a wave of “relativity” and something about dead cats! Liberal lefties love to fuzz up our vision with doubt, as if there _were_ no reliable certainties. Not even the sublime principles of the Free Market (Blessings and peace be upon It)! Not since that snotty little pencil-necked Keynes! > > A bath, a haircut and a job, all they need! Just like Bob Hope and Spiro Agnew presciently pointed out about a previous generation of raggedy ass rabble! You know there is a difference between refining models of reality by employing the scientific method and arguing by feelings and intimidation? ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/166 "2017-06-09T01:32:30Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I read both of these articles. Fascinating stuff. I know very little about postmodern thought, so it was educational. A lot about the argument is problematic, though. In the first, Pluckrose makes a vast number of sweeping assertions while providing zero evidence for them… or even, examples, really. So I’m not really sure how to evaluate her argument. In fact, she kind of undermines her own argument in that specific act of negligence. > > In the second, in addition to completely misrepresenting what happened at Evergreen, the author doesn’t seem to understand what he’s arguing against. His definition of ‘mansplaining,’ for example, is inaccurate. > > You’re talking with someone who has spent a great deal of time with these so-called postmodernist professors, in their classrooms, hanging out with my so-called postmodern colleagues, and I have noticed a rift forming between me and them, but I also don’t buy this narrative pushed by the right because I’ve lived with these people, and I understand their motivations and their reasoning far better than either of the writers of these articles. I’ve made the same arguments as my peers have at times; maybe I still would, I don’t really know because my own ideology is shifting. The bottom line is, as a classical Liberal with postmodern influences it appears to me that these writers don’t have as firm a grasp on their subject as they think they do. I graduated with my MSW in 2011 - surely not _that_ much has changed in five years? > > Weinstein sounds like one interesting dude, though. > Would you mind providing some concrete examples, please? The articles provided virtually none. > > ETA: If you have any recommended reading on this, let me know. It’s truly fascinating. I came across this example of Post-Modernist influenced rot a few months ago: > [@](#): > > [“Historically, white supremacy has venerated the idea of objectivity, and wielded a dichotomy of ‘subjectivity vs. objectivity’ as a means of silencing oppressed peoples. The idea that there is a single truth–’the Truth’–is a construct of the Euro-West that is deeply rooted in the Enlightenment, which was a movement that also described Black and Brown people as both subhuman and impervious to pain. This construction is a myth and white supremacy, imperialism, colonization, capitalism, and the United States of America are all of its progeny. The idea that the truth is an entity for which we must search, in matters that endanger our abilities to exist in open spaces, is an attempt to silence oppressed peoples.”](http://archive.is/Dm2DN#selection-87.116-87.834) What can you do with people like that? The link came from this article [We Few, We Miserable Few](https://www.city-journal.org/html/we-few-we-miserable-few-15145.html), in it there’s a link to another interesting one: The [Microaggression Farce](https://www.city-journal.org/html/microaggression-farce-13679.html). > [@](#): > > The school, which trumpets its “social-justice” mission at every opportunity, is a cauldron of simmering racial tensions. Students specializing in “critical race theory”—an intellectually vacuous import from law schools—play the race card incessantly against their fellow students and their professors, leading to an atmosphere of nervous self-censorship. Foreign students are particularly shell-shocked by the school’s climate. “The Asians are just terrified,” says a recent graduate. “They walk into this hyper-racialized environment and have no idea what’s going on. Their attitude in class is: ‘I don’t want to talk. Please don’t make me talk!’ ” Important to note what the students in question are preparing for _“The Ph.D. candidates who authored this statement are at the threshold of a career in academia—and not just any career in academia but one teaching teachers.”_ ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/167 "2017-06-09T01:56:05Z")
> [@Ale](#): > > I came across this example of Post-Modernist influenced rot a few months ago: > > What can you do with people like that? What happened at UCLA sounds similar to what happened at Evergreen. Terrible. This quote however – > [@](#): > > The school, which trumpets its “social-justice” mission at every opportunity, is a cauldron of simmering racial tensions. Students specializing in “critical race theory”—an intellectually vacuous import from law schools—play the race card incessantly against their fellow students and their professors, leading to an atmosphere of nervous self-censorship. Foreign students are particularly shell-shocked by the school’s climate. “The Asians are just terrified,” says a recent graduate. “They walk into this hyper-racialized environment and have no idea what’s going on. Their attitude in class is: ‘I don’t want to talk. Please don’t make me talk!’ ” I took an entire year-long track on critical race theory with a curriculum developed by “Black Men at Penn”, and my experience was nothing like that. This description seems like a gross distortion of what is actually taught and how the dynamics typically play out. Critical race theory has been around for a long time, there is nothing inherently irrational about it – indeed, the historical and statistical realities we examined were quite concrete. There is nothing ‘‘intellectually vacuous’’ about critical race theory. The study of race itself is not the problem. This is my point. It’s really, _really_ hard to take these arguments seriously when they keep setting up and knocking down straw men. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/168 "2017-06-09T02:08:32Z")
BTW, the statistical risk for rape is so much higher for a woman in college than at virtually any other time in her life that I think it’s reasonable to say campuses are (relatively) unsafe for women. There is some academic-sexism bullshit too, but that’s not being ‘‘unsafe’’ so much as having to put up with sexist bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/169 "2017-06-09T05:07:25Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > It’s worth noting that this board is full of people that conservatives might label ‘‘liberal elite’’ and very few, if any of us, have rushed to defend the students’ actions. > > I think we’re all pretty grossed out by their behavior. > > Which leaves us with only one thing left to debate: Is this representative of most, or a significant portion, of liberals? > > It is my view that the extremists on both sides are dominating the mainstream media, but that doesn’t mean they are an accurate representation of the majority. It’s that extremism generates clicks, and likes, and shares. We, as a culture, are addicted to being self-righteously pissed off, and the media exploits that shamelessly. It is my opinion that the vast majority of Americans want to do the right thing and vote the right way. But alienate them and they’ll fuck off. Or at least enough to let someone like Trump win. This Evergreen thing WILL…well, if it were closer to an election,WOULD cost votes. Who wants to be associated with that? And you can scream til your blue in the face about holding your nose and voting, and you’ll just push people further away. There was some thread about a Slate interview recently and the interviewer asked, “Well what do we say to the millions of people that voted for a horrible racist bigot?” Is that really a question??? You say what you have to, to get their goddamn vote!! And you stop lecturing the people who sat out the last election. That was a general rant, not directed at anyone. ---
**Author:** ![Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/aca169/32.png) [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inbred_Mm_domesticus)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/170 "2017-06-09T11:23:54Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Really? The remainder of the student body, faculty and administration at Evergreen do not see themselves as part of/representatives of Evergreen? > > Hard to see how posters here are part of an all-encompassing group that must apologize for the actions of students at that college, but those who are actually there arguably have some obligation to speak out for decent behavior and encourage penalties for those who transgress. I wouldn’t be surprised if a poll of the overall Evergreen student body thought the protesting students were somehow not part of the Evergreen student body. And if asked if they regarded themselves as representative of Evergreen, you’d get a resounding “No”. I don’t know what your experiences in life are, but my experience of college was not one where students identified with the school. Certainly, a percentage of the students did, but it was a minority. Students develop a closer identity to their school’s football team or their fraternity or their acapella group than the school itself. You are going to always be disappointed if you expect a group you’ve defined in your head to “have some obligation to speak out for decent behavior and encourage penalties for those who transgress”. You don’t really know much of anything about the composition of that group or how they view themselves. You’ll just have to assume they’re decent people who view this harassment with as much disdain as you do. As far as the faculty and administration go, penalizing misbehaving students is their role no matter what they identify with, and if they hesitate in that role then they are simply not doing their job and can be criticized for that. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/171 "2017-06-09T12:34:25Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > BTW, the statistical risk for rape is so much higher for a woman in college than at virtually any other time in her life that I think it’s reasonable to say campuses are (relatively) unsafe for women. I’d like to see a cite for this - specifically that women in college (in the US) are at higher statistical risk for rape than women of the same age who are not in college. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/172 "2017-06-09T14:24:31Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > When I was a student I did not in any way see myself as a representative of the college. Why should I? I merely attended school there. Next thing you’re going to tell me is that I should consider myself a representative of Wal-mart. This comparison would have a prayer of validity if Wal-Mart shoppers wore clothing bearing the company name, put Wal-Mart stickers on their vehicles, listed “Shopped at Wal-Mart” on their CVs, donated money to Wal-Mart, went to Wal-Mart reunions etc. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/173 "2017-06-09T14:30:24Z")
It’s probably a different story if one goes to Generic Community College, but the place I attended for four years had a tradition of political activism and (at the time, at least) controversial free speech, and most students identified with and were proud of that.\* \*along with getting blasted on various legal and illegal substances and semi-daring acts of nudity and sexual expression. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/174 "2017-06-09T14:57:37Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > It’s probably a different story if one goes to Generic Community College, but the place I attended for four years had a tradition of political activism and (at the time, at least) controversial free speech, and most students identified with and were proud of that.\* > > \*along with getting blasted on various legal and illegal substances and semi-daring acts of nudity and sexual expression. Cal? Did you attend at same time as Naked Guy? [Andrew Martinez - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Martinez) ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/175 "2017-06-09T15:37:18Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I’d like to see a cite for this - specifically that women in college (in the US) are at higher statistical risk for rape than women of the same age who are not in college. > > Regards, > Shodan Well, [here’s a cite](https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/rsavcaf9513.pdf) indicating I’m wrong. [QUOTE=U.S. DOJ Special Report] From 1997 to 2013, females ages 18 to 24 consistently experienced higher rates of rape and sexual assault than females in other age brackets (figure 2). In 2013, college age females had a similar rate of rape and sexual assault regardless of enrollment status (about 4.3 victimizations per 1,000), while the victimization rate for not college-age (ages 12 to 17 and 25 or older)females was 1.4 victimizations per 1,000. For both students and nonstudents ages 18 to 24, the 2013 rates of rape and sexual assault were not significantly different from their respective rates in 1997. [/QUOTE] It’s a dangerous age for women, but it appears to be dangerous regardless of whether you are enrolled in school. I did, however, find this interesting little tidbit: > [@](#): > > College-age male victims accounted for 17% of rape and sexual assault victimizations against students and 4% against nonstudents. However, the rate of rape and sexual assault victimization for nonstudents 0.3 per 1,000) was a fifth of the rate for students (1.4 per 1,000). We’re talking about a very small sample of males here so I would hesitate to generalize too much, but it suggests that either a) _males_ are at a higher risk of sexual assault when they are in college, or b) that they are more likely to report it if they are college students. (if we go with ‘‘b,’’ we have to allow the possibility that female college students are less likely to report than nonstudents.) I suspect the answer is A. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/176 "2017-06-09T16:45:50Z")
> [@Ale](#): > > I came across this example of Post-Modernist influenced rot a few months ago: > > > [@](#): > > > > [“Historically, white supremacy has venerated the idea of objectivity, and wielded a dichotomy of ‘subjectivity vs. objectivity’ as a means of silencing oppressed peoples. The idea that there is a single truth–’the Truth’–is a construct of the Euro-West that is deeply rooted in the Enlightenment, which was a movement that also described Black and Brown people as both subhuman and impervious to pain. This construction is a myth and white supremacy, imperialism, colonization, capitalism, and the United States of America are all of its progeny. The idea that the truth is an entity for which we must search, in matters that endanger our abilities to exist in open spaces, is an attempt to silence oppressed peoples.”](http://redirect.viglink.com/?format=go&jsonp=vglnk_149702606448812&key=ce270d38103a630c3181db372a25a052&libId=j3q2iwmm010004p6000DLh5491mji&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fboards.straightdope.com%2Fsdmb%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D827560%26page%3D4&v=1&out=http%3A%2F%2Farchive.is%2FDm2DN%23selection-87.116-87.834&ref=http%3A%2F%2Fboards.straightdope.com%2Fsdmb%2Fforumdisplay.php%3Ff%3D7&title=Is%20Evergreen%20State%20College%20the%20canary%20in%20the%20coal%20mine%2C%20foretelling%20the%20death%20of%20higher%20education%3F%20-%20Page%204%20-%20Straight%20Dope%20Message%20Board&txt=%22Historically%2C%20white%20supremacy%20has%20venerated%20the%20idea%20of%20objectivity%2C%20and%20wielded%20a%20dichotomy%20of%20%E2%80%98subjectivity%20vs.%20objectivit...) > > What can you do with people like that? This is a bit of a sidebar, but I’ve had a gnawing question for some time now: **What’s with the use of the word “bodies”?** When I was in college a decade ago, admittedly I wasn’t hanging out in the African-American studies classes, but I didn’t see it used like this, but now I see repeated use of the word in strange contexts, like this: > [@](#): > > … the oppression and degradation of marginalized bodies … speech that projects violence onto the bodies of its marginalized students and oppressed peoples … I feel like a missed a memo / dare somewhere in which students were instructed to repeatedly use the word “bodies” in a sentence. Does anyone know when this came into vogue? Or why? It’s especially bizarre when it comes up in the context of _speech_ which isn’t projected so much onto one’s _body_ as onto one’s _mind_. Here are some additional (off-the-cuff) examples: > [@](#): > > [… the purpose of this article is twofold. First, the authors aim to provide a cultural analysis of the ways in which implicit bias, and subsequently, institutional racism, have placed a negative cloud over Black bodies in the US.](http://digitalscholarship.tsu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1028&context=rbjpa) > [@](#): > > [Last year was a difficult time for many black people in America. We saw now-President Donald Trump making his way to executive power through sheer racist, sexist vitriol. We witnessed the continued state of institutional violence against black bodies](http://www.theroot.com/get-out-proves-that-nice-racism-and-white-liberalism-1792955235) > [@](#): > > [In the slim volume, fewer than two hundred pages, the word “body” or “bodies” appears more than three hundred times. “In America,” he writes, “it is traditional to destroy the black body.”](https://jacobinmag.com/2017/05/ta-nehisi-coates-racism-afro-pessimism-reparations-class-struggle) ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/177 "2017-06-09T17:13:29Z")
> [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](#): > > I wouldn’t be surprised if a poll of the overall Evergreen student body thought the protesting students were somehow not part of the Evergreen student body. And if asked if they regarded. When I went there, I had friends who turned into acquaintances over stuff like this: they’d go to Exxon stations and call people murderers if they got gas there, or they’d go to a business school and write FUCK AMERIKKKA with Sharpies on the statues, or they’d engage in a pointless environmental action that accomplished nothing other than getting a few dozen folks arrested for trespassing, and they’d count it all as a victory. In my experience, most of the other students rolled our eyes and changed the subject and kept on with our educations. I never heard anyone say they weren’t part of the Evergreen community; they were just as much a part of our community as douchebro fratboys are part of the community at other colleges. But just as douchebro fratboys don’t sound the death knell of public education, neither do asshole radicals. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/178 "2017-06-09T17:18:18Z")
I suspect it all ties into the idea of objectification and physical exploitation. Black bodies were literally used to generate profit during the slavery era and many have argued that they still are (see: our fucked up prison system.) Then there’s all the death by cop going around. I think there is a lot of legitimacy to these complaints (though I will not debate them right now) but the overarching idea is that black people have historically been treated like things rather than people, and the word ‘‘bodies’’ is meant to affirm their humanity. That’s just a guess. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/179 "2017-06-09T17:37:43Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I’d like to see a cite for this - specifically that women in college (in the US) are at higher statistical risk for rape than women of the same age who are not in college. > > Regards, > Shodan I see she responded to you below, but you’re distorting what she said. She said: “the statistical risk for rape is so much higher for a woman in college than at virtually any other time in her life” You said: “women in college (in the US) are at higher statistical risk for rape than women of the same age who are not in college” These are not remotely the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2017, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914/180 "2017-06-09T17:44:44Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > … the overarching idea is that black people have historically been treated like things rather than people, and the word ‘‘bodies’’ is meant to affirm their humanity. Thanks for your thoughts. From my perspective, the emphasis on physical bodies would seem to have the opposite effect, but maybe I’m the one thinking about it backwards. 😕 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-evergreen-state-college-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine-foretelling-the-death-of-higher-education/787914.md?page=10)