# Is Fox news for real? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 19, 2011, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933 "2011-04-19T05:41:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/101 "2011-05-11T01:12:20Z")
> **[FAIR](https://fair.org/?page=4148)** > > FAIR is the national progressive media watchdog group, challenging corporate media bias, spin and misinformation. The Sunday News shows have been dominated by rightys for over a decade. The idea that we have a left wing bias in the news is so outdated. The corps took care of that problem a long time ago. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/102 "2011-05-11T01:36:14Z")
I watch it when I’m feeling overly calm and want something to piss me off beyond belief. But Glenn Beck is hilarious - I’ll miss that guy. ---
**Author:** ![graceful1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c67d28/32.png) [@graceful1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/graceful1)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/103 "2011-05-11T06:33:03Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > And why should they require a license? Do we want the state to decide what constitutes proper news and what does not? Yes. In all seriousness. Yes. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/104 "2011-05-11T10:01:36Z")
> [@graceful1](#): > > Yes. > > In all seriousness. Yes. No we do not. Why is it not enough for you to simply not watch Fox News or any other news program that you dislike? Why do you feel a need to force other people to do likewise or to comply with some centrally defined standard? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 10:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/105 "2011-05-11T10:15:13Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > No we do not. Why is it not enough for you to simply not watch Fox News or any other news program that you dislike? Why do you feel a need to force other people to do likewise or to comply with some centrally defined standard? Why is it necessary for the quality of food and medicine to be centrally regulated? Why is it not enough for you to avoid foods and medications you think may be dangerous or whose qualities are fraudulently advertised? Let \*caveat emptor \*rule! ---
**Author:** ![NiceGuyJack](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/niceguyjack/32/3069_2.png) [@NiceGuyJack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NiceGuyJack)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/106 "2011-05-11T10:39:22Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > No we do not. Why is it not enough for you to simply not watch Fox News or any other news program that you dislike? Why do you feel a need to force other people to do likewise or to comply with some centrally defined standard? I may not necessarily think that a license should be required, but I do understand the concern. Fox is not a news show, it’s pure opinion and frankly propaganda. If they would name themselves Fox Propaganda Channel, then fine, because that’s what they do. But they promote themselves as News which is not true. You and I know it really isn’t news, but there are too many gullible people who don’t realize this. It would be for their protection, because frankly, if they believe the lies on Fox, they may vote accordingly which would probably end up hurting them. They don’t realize that Fox is a tool of big corporations and simply have no interest other than ensuring votes from the ignorant and misinformed through outright false information. The sad thing is, they would likely have just as many viewers even if they were to rename themselves Fox Propaganda ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/107 "2011-05-11T10:44:30Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Why is it necessary for the quality of food and medicine to be centrally regulated? Why is it not enough for you to avoid foods and medications you think may be dangerous or whose qualities are fraudulently advertised? Let \*caveat emptor \*rule! Those are both things I favour abolishing. However you didn’t answer the question and by this reasoning everything could be put under state control. How about online discussion forums? When food and medication are centrally regulated, surely SDMB must be so too. And in any case news are not what it used to be. It’s much more fuzzy these days. What about blogs. Wikinews. Etc. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/108 "2011-05-11T10:57:51Z")
> [@NiceGuyJack](#): > > You and I know it really isn’t news, but there are too many gullible people who don’t realize this. It would be for their protection I’ve always had a particular dislike for the “gullible sheeple” argument. I don’t know about Fox because I haven’t watched it, and I have no pretensions of being morally or intellectually superior to the masses, and I certainly will not restrict anyone’s freedom for his own good. Because it is morally wrong and because it is a policy that can real quick come back and bite you in the ass. It already has. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/109 "2011-05-11T11:08:10Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > I’ve always had a particular dislike for the “gullible sheeple” argument. I don’t know about Fox because I haven’t watched it, and I have no pretensions of being morally or intellectually superior to the masses, and I certainly will not restrict anyone’s freedom for his own good. Because it is morally wrong and because it is a policy that can real quick come back and bite you in the ass. It already has. And I’ve always had a particular dislike for “government control is bad; much better to let corporations control the populace”. Because, frankly, that’s what happens in reality. And at present in Western democracies the threat of corporations doing things detrimental to society for their own benefit is much higher than for politicians to do the same. It’s easier to get the government to watch the corporations and for us to watch the government than for us to keep track of what the corporations are doing, given who controls the media. I don’t trust the government but I trust the private sector even less. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/110 "2011-05-11T11:31:30Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > And I’ve always had a particular dislike for “government control is bad; much better to let corporations control the populace”. Because, frankly, that’s what happens in reality. Do you feel that corporations control you? In what way do you feel that corporations control you with regard to media? I think the trend is the complete opposite. The Internet is undermining the control which states previously held over news and media with an iron fist. If somewhat exaggerated then it is still not for nothing that the revolutions in the Middle East are being called Facebook or Twitter revolutions. I think it is pretty funny that state in China has banned all crime, spy and romance shows for the coming months, building up to Communist Party’s 90th anniversary. Good luck with that. And good luck with corporations trying to do what states cannot. ---
**Author:** ![NiceGuyJack](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/niceguyjack/32/3069_2.png) [@NiceGuyJack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NiceGuyJack)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/111 "2011-05-11T11:43:20Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > I’ve always had a particular dislike for the “gullible sheeple” argument. I don’t know about Fox because I haven’t watched it, and I have no pretensions of being morally or intellectually superior to the masses, and I certainly will not restrict anyone’s freedom for his own good. Because it is morally wrong and because it is a policy that can real quick come back and bite you in the ass. It already has. You have never watched Fox News… Perhaps you should make an effort to try catching a program or two before forming an opinion. Do you support Propaganda? It is effective on the gullible sheeple. As for freedom, this is not a question of restricting anyone’s freedom. It’s about what should be rightfully defined as news. It is morally wrong to report outright lies and falsehood as fact. Gullible or not, some people will believe it is truth because those lies are presented as fact from what is perceived as a respectable news channel. Foxnews reporting consists of lies, exaggerations, over-reactions to non-issues and outright patriotic propaganda which would make Joseph Göbbels proud. Complete lack of moral integrity. I would not want to restrict Fox’s rights to broadcast, I just question if they should be allowed to call themselves a news channel. Because it is not. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/112 "2011-05-11T11:46:03Z")
Imagine if Fox were allowed to run whatever they like, as long as they included (and read out) disclaimers like: “The following opinion piece has no supporting evidence and should be considered entertainment and not news. The previous opinion piece on this subject included demonstrably false assertions. A full report on these errors can be found at [www.fox.com/errors/blah](http://www.fox.com/errors/blah)” ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/113 "2011-05-11T12:21:13Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > Do you feel that corporations control you? In what way do you feel that corporations control you with regard to media? I think the trend is the complete opposite. The Internet is undermining the control which states previously held over news and media with an iron fist. If somewhat exaggerated then it is still not for nothing that the revolutions in the Middle East are being called Facebook or Twitter revolutions. I think it is pretty funny that state in China has banned all crime, spy and romance shows for the coming months, building up to Communist Party’s 90th anniversary. Good luck with that. And good luck with corporations trying to do what states cannot. And the corporations are running wild trying to control the Internet. Just look up the term “net neutrality.” It’s taken government regulation to keep the Internet free from corporate control. This is something we see over and over again. Why do you think the food laws you dislike got passed in the first place? It sure wasn’t because the average person had easy access to food that wouldn’t hurt them. You want to go backwards. Of course none of the news media controls me. The fact that I am aware helps to make immune. But the fact that so many conservatives I run into believe the lies originally propagated by Fox News (often using their exact words) means that a significant portion of our population is being controlled. We the People are our government. It is far better for the organization we have inherent control over to be in charge than for a random business owner. It’s not perfect: I’d love to live in your libertarian ideal, too. But pure libertarianism is as practical as communism. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/114 "2011-05-11T12:36:56Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > Why is it not enough for you to simply not watch Fox News or any other news program that you dislike? Why do you feel a need to force other people to do likewise or to comply with some centrally defined standard? The U.S.A. now has a dysfunctional government. The dysfunctional government is caused in part by hugely stupid voters. A major source of the stupidity is FoxNews propaganda. I am _not_ particularly an advocate of restricting free speech, but any pragmatist should understand that FoxNews propaganda is now a very real problem; we should look for some solution. > [@Rune](#): > > I don’t know about Fox because I haven’t watched it, … It is so preciously amusing how the strong supporters of FoxNews in these threads are people who’ve never watched it! 😃 That’s like defending restaurants that sell maggot-infested cow shit on the grounds that: “I’ve never eaten there, but they call it food and who am I to say my taste in food is better than the masses.” Thanks for the laughs, **Rune**! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/115 "2011-05-11T14:51:01Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > Stupid request. It all depends on where you put your center. I’d probably consider Fox News left-wing. In any case you seem to misunderstand. If there is not a left wing analog of Fox News, then that is a missing element of your media landscape, and you should take steps to address that deficiency. As for size. It matters not, as long as it is available to a sizable portion of the population. So, you got nothing. Check. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/116 "2011-05-11T15:11:24Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Here’s the thing: Fox News (on television; their website is pretty much straighforward news) is decidedly biased toward the right, much moreso than any other station is toward the left. But the thing is, it’s virtually the ONLY rightwardly-biased news organization in the country. So, yes, it’s aggressively right-wing, but it has to try to counter the overwhelmingly large number of news organizations in this country that have a left-wing bias, albeit less agressively so. > In this country you have Fox News vs. ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, MSNBC, the New York Times, the Los Angeles Times, The Washington Post, and Time and Newsweek magazines. Then in the entertainment media, you have the Fox Network which carries Bill O’Reilly, Sean Hannity and Glenn Beck, plus radio personality Rush Limbaugh vs. MSNBC’s commentary, Vanity Fair magazine, Playboy magazine (or hell, just throw in the whole lot of entertainment magazines), most Hollywood movies and television programs, including the nutjobs on The View (and Joy Behar on HLN), plus Oprah Winfrey, 60 Minutes, and all the major network morning programs like The Today Show. > > So in other words, as strident and aggressively pro-right as Fox News and Fox political programming may be, the pro-left side in aggregate far outweighs it. So, looking at it objectively and from a distance, Fox and Limbaugh are but two lonely voices crying out into the hurricane winds of left-wing news and entertainment media, trying and succeeding in their own little way to have at least some influence on the way people in this country get their information. You left out all the right wing hate radio programming. Pretty much dominates the airwaves, with Rush in the lead, but plenty of wannabes and also rans along with him. In radio, it’s NPR on one side and right wing hate radio on the other. And … care to guess which side is biased as hell and lies a lot? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/117 "2011-05-11T15:32:34Z")
> [@NiceGuyJack](#): > > You have never watched Fox News… > Perhaps you should make an effort to try catching a program or two before forming an opinion. Do you support Propaganda? It is effective on the gullible sheeple. > As for freedom, this is not a question of restricting anyone’s freedom. It’s about what should be rightfully defined as news. It is morally wrong to report outright lies and falsehood as fact. Gullible or not, some people will believe it is truth because those lies are presented as fact from what is perceived as a respectable news channel. > > Foxnews reporting consists of lies, exaggerations, over-reactions to non-issues and outright patriotic propaganda which would make Joseph Göbbels proud. Complete lack of moral integrity. > > I would not want to restrict Fox’s rights to broadcast, I just question if they should be allowed to call themselves a news channel. Because it is not. Much as I hate to find myself on Rune’s side here, the thought of a government agency charged with declaring what is a lie and what is truth, especially in the area of politics, gives me the shivering flibbertijibbets. Can you imagine what a fellow like Karl Rove would do if he had a tool like that? ---
**Author:** ![NiceGuyJack](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/niceguyjack/32/3069_2.png) [@NiceGuyJack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NiceGuyJack)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/118 "2011-05-11T16:25:59Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Much as I hate to find myself on Rune’s side here, the thought of a government agency charged with declaring what is a lie and what is truth, especially in the area of politics, gives me the shivering flibbertijibbets. Can you imagine what a fellow like Karl Rove would do if he had a tool like that? I don’t disagree. Mainly I was trying to explain to Rune what Fox News was since he had never seen it. I would have similar issues in that respect. Still have to question it though. I had already mentioned that licensing would probably not the way to go. ---
**Author:** ![FarmerChuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/13edae/32.png) [@FarmerChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FarmerChuck)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/119 "2011-05-11T16:41:27Z")
uh so MSNBC shows like rachel madow… and when that idito olberman was on… and CNN has no bias at alll? yes… No bias at all… also GLENN BECK NEVER CLAIMS TO BE A NEWS MAN. a news person would be shepard smith… oreily, hannity, beck, vansutren, stossel etc etc etc… are talking heads… they are not NEWS also GLENN is leaving fox b/c they wont let him say the crazy shit he wants 2… and as far as his “crazy” stuff… him looking at past history… then looking at what our country is doing now, and having economists on and backing his stuff up with fact how is that crazy… back when gold was 600 he said it would get this high or higher… people said he was crazy… when the stock market was at 14000 and he said its gonna collapse people called him crazy… he was agian RIGHT… you cannont COMPARE becks show to BBC… thats NEWS fox news should have a seperate channle called Fox “hot talk” or something… as well as CNN and MSNBC should have… but they dont, and all of them say crazy shit that make peoples heads on the left and right pop… i listen to glenn yes… but when he says… hey prepare b/c our system is unsistianable… 14 trillion in debt… borrowing .43 on every dollar… i tend to agree as most people would… that is glenns message, prepare b/c if it goes south our way of life could end…BUT HE ALWAYS FOLLOWS THAT WITH I HOPE IT NEVER HAPPENS … im so tired of people attacking him… BOTH sides do it… so if we have a post about fox then we need to have one about MSNBC…glenn also calls out alot of BS on the republican side… and furthermore HE IDENTIFYS HIMSELF AS A LIBERTARIAN…and if you listen too him you will understand that he is not a card carrying republican… ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2011, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933/120 "2011-05-11T16:45:58Z")
There is no left wing analog to Fox. The other nets are not liberal. The liberal “MSM” is the sheerest right wing fantasy. Most of those things that righties think are “liberal,” are actually just facts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fox-news-for-real/578933.md?page=7)