# Is Fred Phelps a Plant? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 29, 2010, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700 "2010-04-29T01:49:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![waterj2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@waterj2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waterj2)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/21 "2010-04-30T02:04:51Z")
> [@Tethered\_Kite](#): > > Thanks for the references. Reading and then reading. > > I’m not surprised that of his thirteen children some of them have spoken out about unhappy childhoods. But it doesn’t really address the idea of whether he could have begun his career as a gay rights plant. > > I kinda like that term. Plant. Hee. > > The article I referenced talked about legal and Democratic background. I find that interesting and out of synch. Still in search of material which could explain his continued freakshow. > > Mental illness? Adrenaline junkie? Enjoying the limelight like the kid who thinks negative attention is better than none at all? Masochist? Sadist? Megalomania? Is he making big bucks? From where? > > The mind boggles. Certainly there’s more here than meets the eye. Which is plently enough. > > The suggestion that he would no longer serve a purpose to LGBT folks hardly seems sufficient. One could just as well make the argument that no more Gay Pride marches are necessary. The whole story of Fred’s disgusting, pathetic existence can be found here: [Addicted to Hate](http://www.blank.org/addict/) He really is that crazy. But, really, though isn’t the idea of him being a plant absurd simply on the face of it? I mean, he’s got his whole huge family in on the act too? He’s pissed off pretty much his whole hometown to make homophobes look bad? ---
**Author:** ![Tethered\_Kite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a5b964/32.png) [@Tethered\_Kite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tethered_Kite)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/22 "2010-04-30T04:17:58Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > Follow the money if you can. Phelps is a disbarred lawyer and yet is able to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars annually. Someone or some organisation is paying for it. Well, this is what I’m thinking. Where’s all the money coming from? His daughter is a practicing lawyer, I believe. Thanks for the further references. Still reading. I’ve always dismissed him with a shrug but now I’ve become fascinated. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/23 "2010-04-30T04:57:57Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > Follow the money if you can. Phelps is a disbarred lawyer and yet is able to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars annually. Someone or some organisation is paying for it. > [@Tethered\_Kite](#): > > Well, this is what I’m thinking. Where’s all the money coming from? His daughter is a practicing lawyer, I believe. > > Thanks for the further references. Still reading. I’ve always dismissed him with a shrug but now I’ve become fascinated. 11 of Phred’s 13 kids are or were practicing attorneys. Phred is disbarred, but is still a partner in the Phelps Chartered law firm, where some of his kids work. What’s really going to blow your mind is that before becoming a crazy asshole he was a civil rights attorney and was honored by the Kansas NAACP and other African-American groups for his anti-discrimination legal work. He was also a booster for Al Gore in the 80s, back when Tipper ran the Gore household and Al was still making public statements about the evils of teh ghey. He’s (obviously) since turned on Gore. ---
**Author:** ![Tethered\_Kite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a5b964/32.png) [@Tethered\_Kite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tethered_Kite)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/24 "2010-04-30T17:49:46Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > What’s really going to blow your mind is that before becoming a crazy asshole he was a civil rights attorney and was honored by the Kansas NAACP and other African-American groups for his anti-discrimination legal work. Yes, I did learn of his Democratic background prior to posting here. That’s the puzzling part. I suppose it’s possible for a disillusioned or mentally ill person to do a 180 particularly if the point isn’t issues but rather amassing power. Nonetheless his bizarre story leaves many unanswered questions. It would help if I could find more information which was neutral. Some of the things I’ve been reading nearly rival his hateful rants and as such, are subject to question for me. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/25 "2010-04-30T18:05:50Z")
It’s not really that puzzling. In the eighties, neither the Democrats nor the Republicans were particularly sympathetic to LGBT issues. Gore was a socially conservative Senator from Tennessee, at a time when Democratic candidates still occasionally won the white Southern vote. I’m not going to link to it, but you can read about Phred on the Phelps Chartered website. Obviously, that’s not exactly unbiased, either, but at least you know which way the bias goes. The WBC and Phred Wikipedia pages are remarkably neutral. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/26 "2010-04-30T19:29:48Z")
Most of the money comes from lawsuits. The Phelps clan shows up to picket something, somebody punches one of the Phelps clan, they sue. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/27 "2010-04-30T19:41:36Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Most of the money comes from lawsuits. The Phelps clan shows up to picket something, somebody punches one of the Phelps clan, they sue. Physical assault isn’t even necessary. They sue for violation of their First Amendment rights if they’re not allowed to picket wherever they want, whenever they want, however they want. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/28 "2010-05-01T02:56:24Z")
I am inclined to the idea that he’s a sociopath and meglomaniac. He’s comments are so over the top and ridiculous that they can be explained by only one of the following 1) parody, 2) insanity, or 3) daemonic possession. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/29 "2010-05-01T03:30:33Z")
> [@Tethered\_Kite](#): > > The article I referenced talked about legal and Democratic background. I find that interesting and out of synch. Well, did you look at the site you referenced? It’s clearly a right-wing Republican fundamentalist site. Enough to question it’s neutrality & credibility, certainly. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/30 "2010-05-01T03:41:08Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > Well, did you look at the site you referenced? It’s clearly a right-wing Republican fundamentalist site. Enough to question it’s neutrality & credibility, certainly. It’s confirmed by Wikipedia. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred\_Phelps](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps) > [@](#): > > Democratic Party > > Phelps has run in various Kansas Democratic Party primaries five times, but has never won. These included races for governor in 1990, 1994, and 1998, receiving about 15 percent of the vote in 1998.[55] In the 1992 Democratic Party primary for U.S. Senate, Phelps received 31 percent of the vote.[56] Phelps ran for mayor of Topeka in 1993[57] and 1997.[58] > Support for Al Gore > > Phelps supported Al Gore in the 1988 Democratic Party primary election.[59] In his 1984 Senate race, Gore opposed a “gay bill of rights” and stated that homosexuality was not something that “society should affirm”.[60] Phelps has stated that he supported Gore because of these earlier comments.[61] According to Phelps, members of the Westboro Baptist Church helped run Gore’s 1988 campaign in Kansas. Phelps’ son, Fred Phelps Jr., hosted a Gore fundraiser at his home in Topeka and was a Gore delegate to the 1988 Democratic National Convention.[13] Gore spokesman Dag Vega declined to comment, saying “We are not dignifying those stories with a response.”[62] ---
**Author:** ![Tethered\_Kite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a5b964/32.png) [@Tethered\_Kite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tethered_Kite)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/31 "2010-05-01T16:10:27Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > Well, did you look at the site you referenced? It’s clearly a right-wing Republican fundamentalist site. Enough to question it’s neutrality & credibility, certainly. I caught this yesterday evening and intended to answer this morning. I had assumed that you had read the references so I was puzzled by your assumption. Edit for clarity: Despite the fact that the publication leans right it was the statement of his former commitment which was of interest. Or were you implying that because the publication leaned right you call into question whether he was a former Democrat? I see Curtis LeMay has replied. As far as reading all the references, one of them is a book. Got it on my favorites and am skimming. It’s a whole nest of anti-hatred hatred to wade through and I need to consider care of my pleasant disposition its response to overload of unpleasantries. 😉 I am beginning to think that the easiest solution to “From Whence Fred Phelps?” is to write him off as a megalomaniac and let it go at that. But there is definitely some jarring dissonance here. ---
**Author:** ![dhkendall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a9adbd/32.png) [@dhkendall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dhkendall)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700/32 "2010-05-01T16:19:38Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > 11 of Phred’s 13 kids are or were practicing attorneys. Phred is disbarred, but is still a partner in the Phelps Chartered law firm, where some of his kids work. > > What’s really going to blow your mind is that before becoming a crazy asshole he was a civil rights attorney and was honored by the Kansas NAACP and other African-American groups for his anti-discrimination legal work. > > He was also a booster for Al Gore in the 80s, back when Tipper ran the Gore household and Al was still making public statements about the evils of teh ghey. He’s (obviously) since turned on Gore. Why is it all the completely batshit insane nutbars that even those who share ideologies with them won’t touch with a million-foot pole are lawyers? The other example that came readily to mind is Orly Taitz, lawyer. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-fred-phelps-a-plant/537700.md?page=1)