# Is Galt's Gulch real? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 1, 2013, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901 "2013-06-01T23:11:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![dataguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eada6e/32.png) [@dataguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dataguy)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2013, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/1 "2013-06-01T23:11:48Z")
I came across [this article](http://dollarvigilante.com/blog/2013/5/27/ayn-rands-vision-of-galts-gulch-has-become-reality-as-of-tod.html) about someone creating an actual version of Galt’s Gulch in Chile. After reading the article, it struck me as primarily a real estate sales scheme, but I was wondering what others think about it. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/2 "2013-06-02T06:01:13Z")
I wonder how many will be disappointed to find that their ‘Galt’s Gulch’ is still subject to Chile’s laws, taxation, and [universal health care](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Chile). ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/3 "2013-06-02T09:52:11Z")
Not real. I know several people who’d be there if it were, and they’re not. And besides, now that the entire world knows about it . . . doesn’t that kinda defeat it purpose? ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/4 "2013-06-02T18:04:29Z")
> [@wevets](#): > > I wonder how many will be disappointed to find that their ‘Galt’s Gulch’ is still subject to Chile’s laws, taxation, and [universal health care](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Chile). I know I would be disappointed to find out that there were no mirage-creating heat beams keeping it concealed. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/5 "2013-06-02T18:12:47Z")
Gullible Gulch ---
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/6 "2013-06-02T18:16:08Z")
This isn’t a real-estate scam in the sense that you really are purchasing the land. And the guy doing it may actually believe his shtick. But no, this is never going to turn into Galt’s Gulch, because if very many wealthy people move there, Chile will tax the crap out of them. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/7 "2013-06-02T19:10:19Z")
I thought it was so absurd, I actually had to post a comment to the web site. Since it may not get approved by the admins, it basically went something like this: This sounds like time-share scheme for Ayn Rand fanatics. If they are looking to evade taxes from the Western nations whose taxpayer funded infrastructure afforded them the stability and security to build their businesses in the first place, why don’t they move to the Bahamas, Aruba or Cayman Islands or hide their money in Swiss banks like a normal rich person? For all the big talk, this venture still requires an “economic environment conducive to productive business opportunities, with a government that allows people to create and keep the majority of their wealth” as well as “legal and secure ownership of land by foreigners”, provided by the government of Chile. If they are so “anti stateist”, why don’t they pick some failed state like Somalia or the Sudan to build their enclave in? Possibly because all property rights must ultimately be protected by a system of laws enforced by a legitimate governing body with the ability to maintain a monopoly of violence? Based on the comments, I would be really curious to see what sort of right wing Utopia a group of rich people, Libertarians, gold bugs, gun nuts, and bitcoin traders come up with. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/8 "2013-06-02T20:41:24Z")
> [@appleciders](#): > > This isn’t a real-estate scam in the sense that you really are purchasing the land. Most real estate scams involve people really purchasing the land. It’s just that it turns out that the land is isolated, without necessary amenities (roads, a water system, electricity), and the promised “community” doesn’t exist. I am not a Randian, but if I were, I would not be purchasing in Galt’s Gulch until I was convinced that a thriving community with all of the necessary support services existed there. Until then, I look forward to seeing the story of the collapse of this scam on _American Greed_. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/9 "2013-06-02T20:47:39Z")
> [@hogarth](#): > > I know I would be disappointed to find out that there were no mirage-creating heat beams keeping it concealed. I, too, am disappointed at any lack of heat-beams. It is a depressingly underutilized technology. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/10 "2013-06-02T21:30:28Z")
> [@appleciders](#): > > This isn’t a real-estate scam in the sense that you really are purchasing the land. And the guy doing it may actually believe his shtick. But no, this is never going to turn into Galt’s Gulch, because if very many wealthy people move there, Chile will tax the crap out of them. If this is their website then it looks as if they are indeed selling land or at least claiming to do so. > **[Welcome to Galts Gulch Chile! - Galts Gulch Chile](http://galtsgulchchile.com)** > > Galt's Gulch Chile is a serene and secluded valley, enveloped with scenic mountains, offering organic farming, copious amounts of fresh clean water, off-grid energies, endless vistas, beautiful sunsets and complete privacy from the outside world! > [@](#): > > As future residents of Galt’s Gulch Chile take ownership of their dream lots, and subsequent dream homes, the numerous amenities of the community will be incorporated, including a championship-caliber golf course, community clubhouses, tennis facilities, spa and fitness centers, hiking trails, horse facilities and trails, vineyards, underground storage facilities, downtown main street shopping, farmer’s market, 24-hour guard-gated security and many others. > [@](#): > > Residential lots at Galt’s Gulch Chile will be offered at much more affordable price points than one would expect for a community of this caliber. Oddly, it sounds sort of like a hippie commune. > [@](#): > > Galt’s Gulch Chile is being designed to be a fully self-sustaining community, affording those who live there an abundant and unending supply of fresh drinking water from the natural springs located throughout the mountains and valleys of the community, clean and renewable energy from hydroelectric and solar power generation, organic fish from the scenic manmade lakes…and a plethora of organic fruits, vegetables and nuts, born from the fertile soil and the ideal year round climate of the region. I wonder… will there be _regulations_ to make sure that the owners of the lakes maintain their “organic” status? The lakes will be individually owned right? None of this community owned nonsense. It is Galt’s Gulch, after all. What about the water systems. What if the owner of those springs finds it more profitable to bottle it and export it? The springs will belong to an individual or company right? Or maybe the power plant owner will find if more profitable to burn coal or use nuclear, or frack near their water supplies. The title of the website even uses the word “community”. Damned communists! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2013, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/11 "2013-06-02T23:23:11Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > Most real estate scams involve people really purchasing the land. It’s just that it turns out that the land is isolated, without necessary amenities (roads, a water system, electricity), and the promised “community” doesn’t exist. I am not a Randian, but if I were, I would not be purchasing in Galt’s Gulch until I was convinced that a thriving community with all of the necessary support services existed there. Until then, I look forward to seeing the story of the collapse of this scam on _American Greed_. A true Objectivist (the actual term for a follower of Rands teachings) wouldn’t need all that stuff. They would just go about building it themselves! ---
**Author:** ![dataguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eada6e/32.png) [@dataguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dataguy)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/12 "2014-09-15T14:05:13Z")
Well, here’s an [update](http://www.alternet.org/books/what-happened-when-some-libertarians-went-build-ayn-rands-vision-paradise?akid=12243.225201.rG_oTr&rd=1&src=newsletter1019358&t=5&paging=off¤t_page=1#bookmark)on the Galt’s Gulch Chile project. Not surprisingly, it did not go well–at least for the investors. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/13 "2014-09-15T14:24:21Z")
Too pathetically funny, and totally expected. ---
**Author:** ![GrumpyBunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc8723/32.png) [@GrumpyBunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrumpyBunny)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/14 "2014-09-15T15:34:49Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > I am not a Randian, but if I were, I would not be purchasing in Galt’s Gulch until I was convinced that a thriving community with all of the necessary support services existed there. Well, if no one creates those support services, they obviously aren’t needed. The Randian handbook for these communities, _Great Capitalism Will Provide Opportunities for All Worthy Enterprises_, told me so. I guess they can put house fires out with their giant piles of gold. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/15 "2014-09-15T16:00:33Z")
Wasn’t there a plan a few years back to build a floating libertopia? Some libertarians were going to build a big ocean liner, sail it out into international waters, and declare their independence. Is that still in the works? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/16 "2014-09-15T16:05:15Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Wasn’t there a plan a few years back to build a floating libertopia? Some libertarians were going to build a big ocean liner, sail it out into international waters, and declare their independence. Is that still in the works? They’re having trouble with the permits. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/17 "2014-09-15T16:08:31Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Wasn’t there a plan a few years back to build a floating libertopia? Some libertarians were going to build a big ocean liner, sail it out into international waters, and declare their independence. Is that still in the works? [Oceania-The Atlantis Project.](http://oceania.org/) It failed miserably. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/18 "2014-09-15T16:48:39Z")
Is everything based on Rand’s works full of fail? ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/19 "2014-09-15T17:07:30Z")
I knew it was in trouble when I saw this. > [@](#): > > The community is based on freedom principles, but in the world in which we live, there are zoning restrictions and will be some guidelines of the community, such as not being able to rezone, sub-divide lots, build apartments, etc. With regard to your double wide question, residents can have temporary housing for a set period (12 months) while building their homes. I’ve been in the real estate industry for many years and there does need to be assurances that some residents won’t violate others space, real estate values, etc. In line with what we are doing, we would hope that such rules wouldn’t be needed, but in the real world of investments, real estate and longevity of a project, it is a necessity to have enforceable guidelines, which will be logical…and that we feel all will agree with to keep GGC around for many years to come and a safe and secure place to live. Zoning? Enforceable guidelines? Sounds like the choking grasp of regulations to me. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2014, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901/20 "2014-09-15T17:14:36Z")
How is Glenn Beck’s Independence USA going? I just did a cursory Googling, but I don’t see any news since the announcements back in early in 2013. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-galts-gulch-real/659901.md?page=2)