Is hatred towards EV's due to the belief in a apocalyptic future?

A real gamechanger for apartment dwellers would be an EV with a battery that’s easy to remove and plug into a charging terminal inside. Or standardized batteries that could quickly be swapped out at at charging stations.

Around here, most people do have garages and most of these houses have at least one $40-70K pickup parked out front. I’ve seen houses with 3+ large pickups/SUVs. Folks hate EVs around here.

Here is a normal view of the suburbs around here:

And? What’s you’re point? That such houses exist?

Yeah, and EVs that can fly!

That plenty of folks that have a house with a garage can buy a new car, including those that can cost more than EVs. It’s very usual here.

Why did you choose the $151K Model S for your comparison?

Because the $28K Nissan Leaf owner doesn’t really exist. He did say that is the average household income of an S owner, but he picked it because it is an overly expensive EV.

Or the $30k Chevy Bolt, or the numerous $40k options, not even to mention the used market.

What color tower do I live in? I have a garage but no 240v outlet in it. As I have mentioned, we’re a 2 EV household.

That’s a whole new infrastructure that has to be built. I doubt I’ll live long enough to see more than the very beginning if even that.
All the manufacturers will also have to agree on standard sizes and then design cars around those.

Up until about 2 years ago, I’d have agreed with everything you said. Now I have an EV that is faster than all the sports/muscle cars I’ve owned, yet quieter, more comfortable, and far cheaper to operate than any of them. I’ll never go back.

I used to have a '79 Porsche 911SC. Still kicking myself 23 years after selling it.

Lots of more modern cars can beat it, but damned if it wasn’t a blast to drive. I wish I had it back. (But I’d keep the Prius PZEV.)

Just so you’re clear, the batteries in an EV weigh hundreds of pounds. And always will.

Any solution that involves removing and reinstalling batteries will involve forklifts or cranes. It’s not going to be like lifting a suitcase out of the trunk and wheeling it into your apartment to charge.

Tesla actually offered a battery swap system for the Model S a while back. It worked, and swapped the battery in under 5 minutes. It had a kind of robotic system built into the floor (though I think the early production version used people for some steps).

But it wasn’t very popular. It cost like $60, so not much more than a tank of gas. But the Superchargers are much cheaper, and even well-off Model S owners don’t care to pay $60 to save 20 minutes. You also had to go back to the same station if you wanted your original battery back (which you probably did, since everyone knows how rentals get treated).

For the Model 3 and beyond, they removed the functionality (moving the bolts to inside the cabin instead of outside). And the very latest models use a “structural” battery pack, which doubles as the floor of the car and all cross-bracing, and can only be removed by disassembling half the car.

Regardless, LSLGuy is right. Even if they were removable, the batteries are way too heavy (1200 lbs in some cases) to move without heavy equipment. It’ll always be way easier to install a charger outside.

From an engineering POV this makes no sense.

A conveniently removable battery will require a structure that is at least twice as heavy as a battery integrated into the car.

Not to mention that most houses/apartments are not really laid out to allow maneuvering a 300+kg battery around. (something the size of an big old TV weighing the same as your washer, dryer, fridge, dishwasher and a couch combined.)

I think that ~present disasters are more a concern than future apocalypses. There are plenty of parts of the country where the occasional lengthy power outage or evacuation can be expected.

Of course gasoline has its own supply chain risks in those situations.


Re: the availability of home charging:
http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.trd.2013.10.001

My objection is based on how much of the country is yogs of miles away from everywhere else - same argument I have for being against restriction to owning private vehicles. We own retirement property out west, where we are 45 miles from the nearest hospital/grocery store, and 250 miles from the nearest international airport. Distance per charge, speed during said distance, inability to recharge at the destination before heading home. Lack of public access recharging stations [now, if they mandated each row of parking is rooved over by solar panels with charging stations for the cars parked underneath, that would go quite a ways towards the recharging issue.]

[Recap about public transport - As a wild arsed example, I live in a small town in Eastern Connecticut, and my last job was absolutely 50.4 miles door to door. In my private car, I could manage the drive in 1 hour 15 minutes unless there was an accident blocking traffic somewhere along the way. If I needed public transport, I would need to schlep myself 5 miles into town, to pick up the regional bus to go 15 miles to the next bigger town, to pick up a state level bus that goes to the major city, dropping me off in the city center where I would need to pick up the local bus out to the office building I worked in. Roughly 4 hours if I managed to catch every single bus with no delays at any point. Then 4 hours home, making my day 17 hours between transit and working day. Now, do we see an issue with this? Work locally you say? No jobs locally that would hire military dependent other than convenience store/fast food/mall - which with the body damage I have preventing me from being able to stand, lift and carry and walk for 8 hours were not an option, none of the offices would hire me [either you are going to get pregnant and quit or your husband will be moved and you will leave] Electric vehicle wouldn’t have the ability to recharge during the day, and I may not be able to do the 100 miles each day in a speed ot get me to work on time anyway. [originally the EVs either only had a 100 mile range, or a speed limitation of 45 miles per hour, thankfully those marks have been changed - but the whole recharge issue still is an issue sometimes - my family was 400 miles away - so how do I get that 400 miles in a vehicle with a 250 mile range, stop at a motel half way there and charge overnight?]

There are also grid issues, if we can’t heat/cool the existing buildings we have, how are we going to manage adding a milion EVs?

Wow. I’ve seen gas station/convenience stores, KFC/A&W/Green Burrito, and other combinations. But this is the first I’ve heard of a hospital/grocery store! :clown_face:

I have never been in a financial position to be able to buy a vehicle newer then 10 years old. And there are a lot of us these days. When ICEs become scarce more and more people won’t be able to buy a used car. The EVs that are available will be at the end of their life. Also I live out in the sticks and a trip to the grocery store is a 58 mile round trip. How is the 10 or more year old battery going to hold up? And you can’t just pop into Auto Zone and pick one up.

There is a lot that needs to be done before we get too deep into the world of EVs.

Part of that is the realization that we will never go 100% EV. There will always be a need for ICE vehicles here and there. But replacing 90% or so of the ICE cars with EV’s will make the liquid fuels needed for the rest easier to come by with less environmental damage. So, while there is considerable value in determining for yourself whether an EV is right for you, there is significantly less in determining if an EV is right for someone else.

As far as the used market, it seems as though most EVs will still have most of their battery capacity after 10 years. But even it it’s only half of what it was new, that’s still enough for most people. Even a 58 mile grocery run would be entirely within the range of a used EV.