# Is ironical a word?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [January 18, 2004, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091 "2004-01-18T10:21:12Z")
**Posts on this page:** 15
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Me6669](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Me6669)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/1 "2004-01-18T10:21:12Z")
By God, someone please answer this question.
We all know that by adding the suffix (al) makes the word an adjective but ironic is already an adjective so why does the word ironical exist? It appears in Webster’s dictionary under ironic as “also ironical” is this because so many people miss use the word, that Webster just put it in the dictionary to appease the masses? I have gotten in many an argument with friends over this subject and need to know. Is ironical a word? Which of the two, ironic or ironical, was used first? What is officially the correct word to use? And does ironical have any advantages over ironic a.k.a. is there a sentence that would benefit from the use of ironical over ironic?
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### Author:  [@Ozymandius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ozymandius)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/2 "2004-01-18T10:35:40Z")
he would be hounded mercilessly.
I would guess that “ironical” was added to the dictionary after ironic. I can’t imagine ironical developing as the natural adjective form of irony.
However, it is easy to see the uninformed misusing the word frequently enough that it eventually found its way into the dictionary.
Just the semi-educated guess of a former English major turned Political Science/History grad.
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### Author:  [@critter42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/critter42)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/3 "2004-01-18T15:15:21Z")
From Merriam-Webster:
> [@](#):
>
> Main Entry: iron·ic
> Pronunciation: "I-'rä-nik also i-'rä-
> Variant(s): or iron·i·cal /-ni-k&l/
> Function: adjective
> Date: 1576
> 1 : relating to, containing, or constituting irony
> 2 : given to irony
> synonym see SARCASTIC
>
> - iron·i·cal·ness /-ni-k&l-n&s/ noun
We looked this up last week 'cause of those !$@!% Chrysler commercials with Celine Dion - every time we here her sing the line “it’s ironical” critterwoman and I both cringe. We thought for sure it was an improper word…unfortunately, it doesn’t appear to be. 😛
critter42
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### Author:  [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/4 "2004-01-18T15:37:26Z")
The Merriam-Webster _Collegiate_ lists it as a variant of “ironic.” It looks to me like an unnecessary word. I can’t think of any use for it where “ironic” wouldn’t serve just as well.
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### Author:  [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/5 "2004-01-18T15:39:30Z")
Ironically, I’ve always considered the word ‘ironical’ to be a joke word…
you know, it’s ironic(cough, cough)_al_ in tone.
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### Author:  [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/6 "2004-01-18T15:52:57Z")
The fact that it’s in the dictionary doesn’t mean the word makes sense, and I agree with **David Simmons** that it shouldn’t be necessary in any situation. It just means people say it a lot, and I do think Ms. Dion is an idiot for saying “ironical” in that commercial.
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### Author:  [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/7 "2004-01-18T16:01:03Z")
Yeah, _mathematical_ is also an unnecessary word because we have _mathematic_. It’s not a huge flaw in the language.
The way I use it, situations are ironic (M-W sense 1), and people are ironical (M-W sense 2). It seems a useful distiction to me, but I know that it’s one that only exists in my head. I don’t think it’s _necessary_ in any situation; I just like how it sounds.
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### Author:  [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/8 "2004-01-18T17:11:56Z")
> [@Marley23](#):
>
> The fact that it’s in the dictionary doesn’t mean the word makes sense, and I agree with **David Simmons** that it shouldn’t be necessary in any situation. It just means people say it a lot, and I do think Ms. Dion is an idiot for saying “ironical” in that commercial.
Actually I think “ironical” was originated by a crossword puzzle maker who needed a word with two more letters.
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### Author:  [@Quint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quint)
#### Post date: [January 18, 2004, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/9 "2004-01-18T17:34:56Z")
> [@David Simmons](#):
>
> Actually I think “ironical” was originated by a crossword puzzle maker who needed a word with two more letters.
Is this comment meant to be sarcastical, or sardonical?
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### Author:  [@Me6669](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Me6669)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2004, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/10 "2004-01-19T10:51:32Z")
According to Robert K. Barnhart in his dictionary of etymology the word ironical predates ironic by more than fifty years (1576) and (1630) respectively. Ironic is shortened from ironical. Bryan A. Garner says in his Modern American Usage “Ironic is standard. Ironical is a needless variant that used to be the preferred form; it is still often seen in BrE.” It would appear that ironical is a proper word, if a bit archaic.
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### Author:  [@Shade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shade)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2004, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/11 "2004-01-19T14:56:36Z")
> [@David Simmons](#):
>
> The Merriam-Webster _Collegiate_ lists it as a variant of “ironic.” It looks to me like an unnecessary word. I can’t think of any use for it where “ironic” wouldn’t serve just as well.
Thinking on it, I get the feeling that one aught to be used to mean “pertaining to ‘ironic’” and the other to mean “ironic” but I can’t decide which which probably means I’m wrong.
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### Author:  [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2004, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/12 "2004-01-19T16:19:36Z")
> [@coven](#):
>
> Is this comment meant to be sarcastical, or sardonical?
Comical? - ness(These last four letters brought to you courtesy of SDMB which has a rule that if you can’t say anything in 10 letters or more, you can’t say it at all.)
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### Author:  [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2004, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/13 "2004-01-19T16:33:48Z")
> [@David Simmons](#):
>
> Comical? - ness(These last four letters brought to you courtesy of SDMB which has a rule that if you can’t say anything in 10 letters or more, you can’t say it at all.)
Hilarious!
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### Author:  [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2004, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/14 "2004-01-19T17:01:43Z")
> [@gluteus maximus](#):
>
> Hilarious!
Hilarical, too.
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### Author:  [@rkts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rkts)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2004, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-ironical-a-word/225091/15 "2004-01-19T18:46:43Z")
I am not an etymologist but I have always understood it to be a general rule that _-ic_ = _-ical_. The latter is not somehow a doubling or compounding of the former. Which one a word ends up with is apparently pretty arbitrary, but most words end up using one form or the other; occasionally, however, a word survives with both. Hence _ironic_ and _ironical_. The former is to be preferred, since it is the more common form, but I wouldn’t accuse someone of ignorance for using the latter; most likely they are exercising poetic license, albeit rather ineffectively.