# Is it appropriate for news organizations to "fact check" books? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 18, 2009, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029 "2009-11-18T15:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/141 "2009-11-20T00:45:48Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I don’t know anybody except the really partisan morons who expect Sarah Palin to get a fair break from the media. That’s my point - the media pretense is that they are objective. The trouble is maintaining the pose in the teeth of examples like this one. > > If AP wants to be the unpaid propaganda wing of the Democratic party, they should admit it up front. > > Regards, > Shodan Let me get this straight. You are more upset at the AP spending resources to fact check her book than you are that she lied her ass off in her book? In obvious ways? If you have two shipments coming in, one from a supplier who rarely screws up and one from a supplier who often sends the wrong parts of bad parts, which do you inspect more closely. Did the AP do a number on McCain’s campaign bio? Why not - is he a secret liberal - or did the AP know that he isn’t a lying buffoon, and thus there was less likely to be crap in the book. There was an article in the Times that this reminds me of. Meat packing plants object strenuously to stores like CostCo checking for E coli infestations, because if they find some it will be expensive to clean up. (CostCo checks anyway - some don’t.) Wouldn’t it have been nice if all those fact checkers only found trivial errors? Why don’t you blame the source of the lies, not those who found them? ---
**Author:** ![Dorothea\_Book](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/da6949/32.png) [@Dorothea\_Book](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorothea_Book)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/142 "2009-11-20T01:45:53Z")
> [@Kolga](#): > > Every single one of the people interviewed said, in their discussion of her, that one of the things they admired about her was her honesty, and how she was completely honest and forthright in everything she did and said, when no other politician was that way. Every. Single. One. > > I thought “are you people living on the same planet as the rest of us?” Well here’s another one **Kolga** to add to your WTF-sentiment. From today’s Talking Points Memo, a majority of Republicans, according to a recent poll from Public Policy Polling, [believes that Obama stole the election with the help of ACORN.](http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/poll-gop-base-thinks-obama-didnt-actually-win-2008-election----acorn-stole-it.php) > [@](#): > > Among Republicans…only 27% say Obama actually won the race, with 52% – an outright majority – saying that ACORN stole it, and 21% are undecided. Among McCain voters, the breakdown is 31%-49%-20%. By comparison, independents weigh in at 72%-18%-10%, and Democrats are 86%-9%-4%. ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/143 "2009-11-20T04:07:40Z")
Pointing out a liar’s lies is not evidence of bias. Refusing to do so is. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/144 "2009-11-20T10:35:56Z")
> [@Dorothea\_Book](#): > > Once again, where is the evidence of lack of fact-checking into Obama’s writings? I got your evidence [right here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11740824&postcount=622). ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/145 "2009-11-20T13:58:04Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > …for every “gotcha” question that Palin was asked, there was someone spouting off about Rev. Wright and Bill Ayers\*. Could you provide a cite that Palin was asked any “gotcha” questions? ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/146 "2009-11-20T14:41:41Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Could you provide a cite that Palin was asked any “gotcha” questions? Much as I think the woman is a walking disaster and the biggest threat to this country outside of a resurrected HitlerStalinPotEnstein, the newspaper one could be considered a “gotcha” question. If she names the Wasilla Wailer (or whatever), she looks provincial. If she doesn’t, she is snubbing her home town. If she names the WSJ, she’s an elitist snob (ie. Democrat). If she doesn’t, she’s ignorant of financial matters. If she names Life, it’s because she only looks at the pictures. Etc. Again, not defending her, but because a politician’s statements are going to be spun negatively by the opposition there is no safe statement. And if you can’t take the heat, you provincial ignorant bitch, don’t get in the political arena! I’m surprised we haven’t seen any stories about how Obama is advocating having all cats killed - you know, since he got a dog instead. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/147 "2009-11-20T14:53:38Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Could you provide a cite that Palin was asked any “gotcha” questions? I should have said “supposedly ‘gotcha’ question” (which is kind of implied by the scare quotes around gotcha). Please note that the post of mine that you quoted from was attempting to refute the “liberal media” meme by pointing out that for every softball question that the Republicans considered a gotcha to Palin, there was at least one story pointing out Obama’s supposed links to Bill Ayers or his secret sympathy for Rev. Wright’s theology (accompanied by an utterly leeeeaning “explanation” of what Rev. Wright’s theology consists of). ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/148 "2009-11-20T14:58:14Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Much as I think the woman is a walking disaster and the biggest threat to this country outside of a resurrected HitlerStalinPotEnstein, the newspaper one could be considered a “gotcha” question. I disagree. It’s possible to get the WSJ, or the NYT, or the Washington Times, in Wasilla. They deliver subscriptions all over the place. There’s no reason that a politician with some national ambition couldn’t be receiving papers from the lower 48 in order to keep up. And I seriously doubt that Palin was worried about looking provincial when she answered that question. Frankly, I’m guessing she was way too desperate to try to remember the name of a newspaper…any newspaper…to worry about looking provincial. Most of the early interviews (Gibson, Couric) were intended to be softball. When questions that most politicians would have sent Gibson and Couric fruit baskets for asking hit Palin, her reaction had to have stunned those two. They were about the easiest questions they could have asked without looking like they were on the campaign’s payroll…how much easier could they have possibly made them? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/149 "2009-11-20T15:15:35Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Again, not defending her, but because a politician’s statements are going to be spun negatively by the opposition there is no safe statement. And if you can’t take the heat, you provincial ignorant bitch, don’t get in the political arena! That’s politics. Damn near every politician gets asked questions about abortion, the death penalty, and war. Palin had no problem saying she was pro-life, pro-death penalty, and pro-Iraq war. The idea that she can say those things and piss off 53% of Americans, but her answers to what newspapers she reads is too politically sensitive, is not realistic. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/150 "2009-11-20T15:20:02Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > And I seriously doubt that Palin was worried about looking provincial when she answered that question. Frankly, I’m guessing she was way too desperate to try to remember the name of a newspaper…any newspaper…to worry about looking provincial. Whoops, forgot this point. Actually, her rambling answer touched upon things like, Alaska isn’t the moon, they get all sorts of newspapers in Alaska, and one shouldn’t think that just because someone is in Alaska they can’t get any news and therefore is a provincial hick, blah blah blah, and I read “all” the newspapers and magazines that are out there. She took a simple question and turned her answer into a defense against a non-existent charge of provincialism. She was ULTRA concerned about appearing provincial. In reality, it seems that she reads “all” the newspapers and magazines out there, from “People” on one side of the spectrum, all the way over to “Us Weekly” and “Runners World” on the other. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/151 "2009-11-20T15:21:34Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Much as I think the woman is a walking disaster and the biggest threat to this country outside of a resurrected HitlerStalinPotEnstein, the newspaper one could be considered a “gotcha” question. > > If she names the Wasilla Wailer (or whatever), she looks provincial. If she doesn’t, she is snubbing her home town. > > If she names the WSJ, she’s an elitist snob (ie. Democrat). If she doesn’t, she’s ignorant of financial matters. > > If she names Life, it’s because she only looks at the pictures. Etc. > > Again, not defending her, but because a politician’s statements are going to be spun negatively by the opposition there is no safe statement. And if you can’t take the heat, you provincial ignorant bitch, don’t get in the political arena! > > I’m surprised we haven’t seen any stories about how Obama is advocating having all cats killed - you know, since he got a dog instead. > > -Joe This is a complete load. No one would have cared what she said she read, and no one would have called that a “gotcha” question if it had been asked of Obama, or Hillary, John McCain, or pretty much any other politician on earth. “What do you like to read” is soft as butter. Couric was trying to be kind, and made the mistake of assuming that Palin had some kind of normal, base level intelligence, education and acumen appropriate to a candidate for major political office. Palin fumbled the question not because she was afraid of how the evil liberal media would spin her answer (which would still be an incredibly lame excuse even if it were true), but because she doesn’t read _anything_, and was stuck to even _name_ a newspaper or magazine that exists in the world. In the 2000 election, I remember GWB being asked a very similar question during an interview (“what book are you reading right now?”) and Bush handled it fine, instantly naming a credible sounding title (a biography of Dean Acheson). Nobody thought it was a “gotcha” question for Bush, and the evil liberal media didn’t give a crap about his answer. Jesus, compared to Palin, GWB actually looks like a person of substance and intellect. Is there any chance at all that anybody would think Barack Obama was being victimized if somone asked him what he liked to read? Would they even think it about any other Republican but Palin? No. She’s a special, fragile case. Poor Sarah. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/152 "2009-11-20T15:30:42Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Um, no. Sarah Palin is not currently a candidate for President or Vice-President. > In exactly the same way that Obama was not running for President or Vice-President when his book came out. He was widely and correctly suspected of preparing for such a run when the book was published. Just like some suspect that Sarah Palin nay declare for the Presidency sometime in the next three years. > > And yet, the AP puts a bunch of people to the task of debunking the one, but never the other. > The only obvious fact is the one you are trying desperately to deny - there is a rather clear double standard. > > Actually, that is not quite correct - the standard is that the opposition is expected to debunk any book that a candidate from the other party writes. In Obama’s case, that debunking comes from Republicans. In Palin’s case, it comes from the MSM. In both cases, it comes from people who oppose the other party on partisan grounds. > > Regards, > Shodan Ya know, I do think that the MSM is biased against Sarah. You know what makes me think this? Well its really kinda obvious doncha know - they are anti athletics, and she is a hockey mum so obvioulsy likes sport Whoops sorry, I got confused, its actually because they just can’t stand alaskans. Hold on a moment, actually they are paternalist and upset with her for breeding daughters instead of sons, No no wait a moment, I think they hate her because she is a lady… I mean, after all, the AP is biased right, the real reason they fact check her book really truely can’ty have been that they expected to find lies. Oh and also, if they hadn’t found lies I am sure they would have just made up lies to find right ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/153 "2009-11-20T15:33:47Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Whoops, forgot this point. Actually, her rambling answer touched upon things like, Alaska isn’t the moon, they get all sorts of newspapers in Alaska, and one shouldn’t think that just because someone is in Alaska they can’t get any news and therefore is a provincial hick, blah blah blah, and I read “all” the newspapers and magazines that are out there. She took a simple question and turned her answer into a defense against a non-existent charge of provincialism. She was ULTRA concerned about appearing provincial. > > In reality, it seems that she reads “all” the newspapers and magazines out there, from “People” on one side of the spectrum, all the way over to “Us Weekly” and “Runners World” on the other. This is one of the major deflection tactics used by Palin. Any question or criticism of her personally is instantly turned into an attack on something else. If you ask her what she likes to read, you hate Alaska. Other criticisms are deflected as attacks on the troops, on women, on Jebus, etc. Classic NPD. A pathological inability to self-examine or accept responsibility. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/154 "2009-11-20T15:46:50Z")
[http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born\_in\_the\_usa.html](http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html) here is just one of many sites that fact check everything politicians say and write. The problem with Palin is not that she was fact checked. The problem was that what she wrote was false. She should have written an honest book and defied anybody to find anything wrong. There are strings of falsehoods and distortions in Palin’s book. It should be put in the fiction department at the book store. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/155 "2009-11-20T15:53:20Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > In the 2000 election, I remember GWB being asked a very similar question during an interview (“what book are you reading right now?”) and Bush handled it fine, instantly naming a credible sounding title (a biography of Dean Acheson). Nobody thought it was a “gotcha” question for Bush, and the evil liberal media didn’t give a crap about his answer. Jesus, compared to Palin, GWB actually looks like a person of substance and intellect. Now, Bush being given an impromptu round of “Name That World Leader” - _those_ were “gotcha” questions, and I thought them quite unfair (even if he did at other times struggle to remember Tony Blair’s name when Blair was in the room with him). ---
**Author:** ![haymarketmartyr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/35a633/32.png) [@haymarketmartyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/haymarketmartyr)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/156 "2009-11-20T16:59:01Z")
Here is some really good news for us Democrats who hope and pray Palin gets the 2102 Republican nomination > [@](#): > > As Sarah Palin blankets the media on a whirlwind book promotion tour, the former vice-presidential contender is clearly back on America’s radar screen. Despite being characterized by many as a divisive force in her party and the nation, Americans are much more likely to give Palin a positive rating (47 percent favorable) than another prominent female leader — Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi (28 percent favorable). Moreover, about six in 10 Americans (61 percent) think Palin has been treated unfairly by the press, according to the latest Fox News poll. > > The national telephone poll was conducted for Fox News by Opinion Dynamics Corp. among 900 registered voters from Nov. 17 to Nov. 18, 2009. For the total sample, the poll has a margin of error of plus or minus 3 percentage points. > Palin has been mentioned as a possible presidential candidate in 2012, along with a host of other Republicans. Among self-identified Republicans in the survey, Palin gets the highest favorable ratings (70 percent) amid a group of other possible contenders for the GOP nomination, including Mike Huckabee (63 percent), Mitt Romney (60 percent) and Newt Gingrich (58 percent). Palin’s favorable score among all voters is 47 percent, up nine percentage points over last July’s reading of 38 percent. With thousands lining up at every book tour stop plus popularity going up, I can only hope Sarah and her advisers are taking notice. I would favor an independent third party run for her as a presidential candidate but having her run as the Republican nominee would be the next best thing. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/157 "2009-11-20T17:06:07Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Now, Bush being given an impromptu round of “Name That World Leader” - _those_ were “gotcha” questions, and I thought them quite unfair (even if he did at other times struggle to remember Tony Blair’s name when Blair was in the room with him). _Unfair?_ What countries’ leaders was he going to deal with more consequentially than those of Chechnya, Taiwan, India and Pakistan? What sort of topic, or forum, would have been more relevant to an applicant for the job of Leader of the Free World? We do know how that story ended, btw. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/158 "2009-11-20T17:06:21Z")
Daly showed a New York bookstore that ordered 8 copies of her book. He asked how many were left. The response 8. She is carefully picking her locations to create the idea her book is selling like crazy. I got an email offering it for $4.95. I will wait til it is in a dollar bin. That should be in about 1 month. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/159 "2009-11-20T17:39:26Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > That’s politics. Damn near every politician gets asked questions about abortion, the death penalty, and war. Palin had no problem saying she was pro-life, pro-death penalty, and pro-Iraq war. > > The idea that she can say those things and piss off 53% of Americans, but her answers to what newspapers she reads is too politically sensitive, is not realistic. She knows the “safe” answers to talking-point her way through an interview that asks question for which she’s been given the answers. It’s thinking on her feet that screwed her. Again, don’t think I actually even believe this crap I’m saying here - I pretty much playing the Devil’s Advocate here. Fact of the matter is that woman is a threat to intelligence and sanity on a scale I’m not comfortable contemplating. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2009, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029/160 "2009-11-20T17:42:06Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I should have said “supposedly ‘gotcha’ question” (which is kind of implied by the scare quotes around gotcha). Please note that the post of mine that you quoted from was attempting to refute the “liberal media” meme by pointing out that for every softball question that the Republicans considered a gotcha to Palin, there was at least one story pointing out Obama’s supposed links to Bill Ayers or his secret sympathy for Rev. Wright’s theology (accompanied by an utterly leeeeaning “explanation” of what Rev. Wright’s theology consists of). That’s why I asked for the cite. Sometimes these threads take a premise like “Palin was attacked” or “Palin was asked gotcha questions” and everyone divides into camps to argue about how Palin is responding. I’m trying to make sure that the flawed premise doesn’t become accepted as true. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-appropriate-for-news-organizations-to-fact-check-books/518029.md?page=9)