You can be fairly certain they’re also keeping down the populations of birds that nest on and near the ground.
A human killing such birds would be subject to serious fines or jail time (and quite right, too). What then justifies allowing a cat to do so?
I second that. Much easier to catch one pregnant cat, and both the mother and the kittens will have a much better shot at being healthy (and quickly adopted) if the kittens are born at the shelter.
Solution: shoot the cat, but not with a pellet rifle or a .17hmr but with either a Red Ryder BB gun or a pump gun with only one or two pumps in it. That’s generally not enough to kill something size of a cat, but it IS enough to discourage that cat from coming anywhere near your backyard.
Sure, that works, if you don’t want to *solve * the problem, so much as just make it not *your * problem. And with extra bonus cruelty, just for funsies! :rolleyes:
So then it would be better, in your estimation to kill the cat than to teach it that your yard is not the place for hanging around?
No, it would be better to use live trap and bring it to a shelter.
Wow. I never thought this would be an issue for anyone.
Cats try to kill birds, and are not checking the endangered species list before doing so. I think we all agree there. But at what point does an animal cease to be an invasive species? House cats have been around for what, 6,000 years (OK, a little shorter in the US)?
We own two cats, who venture outside during the day. They’re neutered, so no chance of them creating a ferral gang of bird snatchers. They catch on average 4 or 5 mice slash birds a year.
Big fucking deal. It’s what they do. And for those suggesting the owners feed them better: these two boys are well catered for. They don’t even eat the stuff they kill: they just drag them inside for me to clean up. A present if you will, for their underlings.
So, there’s a ferral cat somewhere in Long Island that’s good at catching birds. It found its niche, the bird feeder. Smart cat. In Kruger Park in South Africa, the lions have figured out that if you chase a giraffe onto a tarmac road, it’ll fall and break its neck. Easy lunch. Damn those evil lions, for using their surroundings to their advantage! They ought to be shot, each and every one of them. :rolleyes:
In the US it would be around 400 years - and feral cats haven’t been plentiful and widespread for even 100 years. They will be an invasive species for quite some time. If current trends continue, in several thousand years, some of the bird species that now nest on and near the ground will have evolved other nesting strategies; many will be restricted to what few remote areas remain - or will be extinct.
Or, just possibly, cat owners will take to the notion that both cats and birds are worth preserving, and cats will be kept indoors. After all, 25 years ago certain human habits had massively reduced population of Bald Eagles and Peregrine Falcons; those habits were changed and those species are now doing well.
Well, yeah. In some cases man decides to undo the damage done by human habitation. I’m not against that per se. But what’s wrong with looking at the world, and accepting that things change? We cannot escape the fact that we, humans, change the world and the habitats of animals, wherever we go.
In some cases, “we” decide to try and revert such a process, such as in your bald eagle example. Nothing wrong with that, but in some cases, our behaviour leads to extinction of a species.
And whether or not keeping domesticated pets is amongst that behaviour is obviously up for debate. At any rate, I don’t feel any less of a “responsible cat owner” for letting our two moderately talented hunters outside our house. As a matter of fact, they spent the first two and a half years of their life in a small apartment, and I’m delighted they get to play outdoors now that we live a little more rural. And frankly, from their killings, I don’t think they’ll be wiping out any particular species anytime soon.
But this should never be taken as carte blance that sanctions any behavior. I’d say it’s tolerably obvious that we need to stay aware of the effect we’re having, and to mitigate it to the extent possible. Just a modicum of care and forethought can make a huge difference.
No - just doing their part to help.
Just for the record, I’m agreeing with the people who say that feral (not “ferrel,” folks) cats are a problem. Just don’t tell me my cats can’t spend a few hours outside in the sun on nice days (they do come in at night).
If you let your cats out after dark around here, the great horned owls are definitely an issue. Believe me, if they can take out a big jackrabbit, they can take out a typical housecat. That’s one of the reasons my cats aren’t allowed out after dark (other reasons include mountain lions, bobcats, foxes, lynxes, coyotes…).
Are you really implying that I should be facing jail time for letting my cats outside? Because that’s what it sounds like.
You are welcome to come over here and point out any protected ground-nesting birds within a reasonable radius of my house, by the way. The only ground-nesters I know of close-by are mallard ducks (and if they were nesting on my property, I’d know it) and Canada Geese (which don’t nest here), and neither one is protected. I also don’t think my cats are stupid enough to mess with Mother Goose.
A NY Times Magazine article about just this sort of thing. Specifically, about the case of Jim Stevenson, referenced earlier in this thread, who shot some stray cats (which may or may not have been “adopted”) to prevent them from feeding on some rare birds.
I’m a cat person, and I’m mostly indifferent to birds. Naturally, therefore, I tend not to see the big deal when cats kill birds. Truth be told, when I hear about that sort of thing, something inside of me smiles, shakes its head, and says, “Heheh – oh, those cats!” I have no trouble believing that if I were a bird person who was indifferent to cats, I’d have a very different opinion on this matter.
That said, I do have some questions. First, what is the virtue of protecting native species against new arrivals? Obviously there are plenty of cases in which there’s a large practical incentive, but in others, it seems like the virtue is mostly aesthetic – is that enough? I’d be much happier to stumble across a pack of feral cats than a group of wrens. Others would disagree but, all else being equal, why should the native/invasive distinction necessarily work against my preference?
What I’m implying is that you should do what’s reasonable to keep your cats from killing protected species. Which basically means keeping them indoors (as links provided above suggest).
Note that all but a few introduced birds species (e.g. House Sparrows, Starlings) are protected. Species in your area include Towhees, Thrashers, Ovenbirds, Dickcissels, Lark Buntings and Bobolinks (and there are certainly many others).
Of course, these may not be found anywhere near to your house - one possible reason being previous cat activity.
I love when we get boblinks coming through our meadow, or when I hear a whip-poor-wil out in the distance. However, I think we should put in context what exactly cats are killing around here. They are not nailing the grouse, or bobolinks or ground nesters, not even the cavity nesters really, they are snaging the house sparrows and juncos and the occsional wren. Theya re also hunting on the borderlands, not in the woodland.
I think we can all agree it is healthier for a cat to stay inside…don’t cats that live indoors live exponentially longer than those who go outside?
I just want to be real about the birds and their actual populations and how significant or non-significant the cat population is in decreasing their numbers.
The indoor cat option avoids the need to choose sides - you can enjoy both birds and cats.
One way to get at the answer is to look at the results produced by the introduction of non-native species - it’s rarely good and often dreadful. It’s almost impossible to predict the full effect or even to guess at all the unintended consequences. IOW, much bitter experience has shown the wisdom of presuming that native species should be preserved.
I live on a small farm in rural Alberta. Last year I got a pregnant cat from the neighbour to deal with the mice in the barn and the house. Cat had 4 kittens. I found another kitten some moron had dropped off on the road. I now had 6 cats. I took them to the vet and got them all fixed, cost me damn near $1,000.00. Fast forward to now, I have 2 of those cats left. I figure the coyotes around here have had a good winter. I just got 3 more cats from the neighbour. All boys, not going to fix any of them, I can’t afford to! Go ahead and call me a moron.
Around here everything is the circle of life. Small things eat smaller things, big things eat small things. I’m the biggest thing 
Perhaps if one cared that much, but an invasive pest that’s on your property that you don’t want there anymore isn’t worth that much effort. Better I guess just to shoot it like any other varmint.
Word.
Even if one feels the same way about, say… birds?