My apostrophe slipped. “cousins.”
I think it’s about as hypocritical as an atheist calling San Francisco or Los Angeles his/her home.
If you go into the history, you will find that its roots are firmly planted in Christianity. But despite all that, the presence of the religious aspect ranges from muted to non-existant in most day-to-dayinstances.
Obviously this isn’t a perfect parallel- I’d guess there are more people who know that Christmas is a celebration of Christ’s bithday than people who know that San Francisco started as a Mission (or that it was named for Saint Francis). But you get the idea.
If “celebating” christmas is simply about giving presents, then there’s no hypocrisy at all. Very Cartman-esque. If you’re an atheist and you feel the need to go to church and stick a nativity scene on your front lawn, then I’d say there’s a problem. Just because one is an atheist doesn’t mean he has to close his eyes to the religious babble that is going on around him. Giving and accepting a christmas present says nothing more than “I’m a consumer, let’s stimulate this economy.” It’s not an implied admission that jesus did this or that.
I am 100% atheist and I celebrate christmas right down to the nativity scene and angel on top of the tree.
Even if I thought that the Jesus character was completely fictional (which I don’t), I would celebrate christmas because the message from the gospels is, on the whole, an uplifting one and offers many wonderful lessons for all of us.
I want my children to know the story of the birth of Jesus because it is a beautiful story and because they will have a hard time understanding the culture that they live in without some knowledge of one of the central themes of the last 2000 years.
I have never considered that someone might think that hypocritical before. Now that I have considered it a little, I am sure that it is not.
Count me as another atheist that celebrates Christmas. For me, it’s a celebration of showing my family that I appreciate them and love them. I even go to church every christmas eve. Not for any religous reason, but because it makes my mother happy. I think Christmas has a big enough secular elemant to it, that anyone can celebrate it without being hypocritical.
So, kevlaw, you’re an atheist yet you’d teach your kids such perceived falsehoods? I wouldn’t teach my children material that I perceive as fiction, as fact anyday.
As for me, I am agnostic (leaning towards atheist more and more), yet I hardly celebrate Christmas in the sense that I don’t think of a god on the holiday. I celebrate gift-giving and spending time with my loved ones, nothing more. They have something else in mind, but I surely do not.
If you are suggesting that teaching fiction is the same as teaching falsehoods then I am guilty as charged. Just last weekend, I took my kids to see Finding Nemo. They loved it.
I happen to think there is a lot that my children can learn from fiction… but there is something extra special about legends and mythology … Robin Hood, the Knights of the Round Table, the Odyssey and Illiad come immediately to mind. All of those stories provide an interesting framework for discussing moral issues and the fact that parts of them may have some basis in history makes them all the more attractive.
I certainly try to avoid teaching fiction as fact though.
I’m now forming an image of Santa’s broken, bleeding body on the cross, the blood just a slightly darker shade than his suit. At the end all the elves and reindeer gather together and lay him in an igloo-tomb, wrapped in colorful Christmas paper with a little bow tied over his face.
To any fundies reading: I know, I’m going to hell for that one.
How would you teach your kids the morals taught in the lessons? The lessons give moral guidelines set by God. How would you justify their value? In the gospels, the real reason for strict obedience is because you want to please God. What would you tell your kids? “Follow these lessons because a God that doesn’t exist says so.” See?
Well, I consider many of the lessons to have value in their own right - regardless of whether other people think they are divinely inspired.
How do I teach them ? We read a little of the story and then discuss the moral implications … same as we do for any story that may have some broader moral value.
We read Lao-Tzu too. I guess I just don’t see the contradiction.
Okay, humor me – cite?
Because from where I’m sitting, those mistletoe and trees are leftovers from the Pagans, who were getting all excited in the dead of winter long before anyone even used the term “Christian.”
I’d say probably not. It might be hypocritical to be an atheist and proclaim Christ as your savior, but I assume what you mean is just having a good time with family. If the contradiction (or difference in beliefs, whatever you might want to call it) doesn’t trouble you, I’d say don’t worry about it.
Most of my family is Jewish, thus my being an atheist isn’t much more of an issue at Christmastime than it is any other time. I told my parents years ago that they should stop getting me presents for Hanukkah, but they refused. What am I supposed to do? 
They never do anything religious around the house anyway, and years of raising 2 atheists means they don’t go to temple, so basically it’s just present-giving. Seeing as how much we normally fight on the other holidays (especially when family comes around), I pretty much let it be. At least on this holiday, everybody’s getting presents.
I’m not an atheist, but I don’t see why they shouldn’t join in the fun, if they want to, and if they consider it fun. How much out of all the stuff we do at Christmas is really Christian/religious anyway?
Sure, the holly and berries has been said to symbolise the crown of thorns and blood (wouldn’t that be easter, anyway), the tree with decorations has been said to represent heaven etc - these are all post-hoc Christian rehashes on traditions that people would have been doing around that time of year anyway.
Hypocrisy is whatever other people do.
Christmas? It’s just another name for Hogswatch, which I celebrate even though I don’t believe in the Hogfather. (Which is fine, because he doesn’t believe in me either)
Nah, there’s no hypocrisy. Christmas, as has been stated before, has become very secular and is, to me, just a time to share with family and friends and trade gifts as tokens of affection. And, yes, it’s great to watch the kids open theirs.
Now, this year I want a GI Joe with kung-fu grip, a Captain Carrot action figure and a chemistry set.
Ohhhh kay…
You want cites for Christmas or the Spanish Missions?
I would like to see cites that “its roots are firmly planted in Christianity” – because, as I wrote previously, I believe the roots of the holiday go back even before Christianity was founded, to the Winter Solstice celebration recognized by the Pagans.
Since an atheist doesnt believe in god, he can only be a hyporcrite if he acts like a religious person to make people think he is religious. Since you celebrate religious holidays out of the goodness of your heart, you are not giving a false appearance You can have the spirit of christmas whether youre religious or not. The whole point of christmas is to be good to your fellow man, I ve never heard anyone say christmas is all about being christian.
Sure, there has been a Holiday around the Solstice for likely a thousand years before Jesus. But- Christmas just happens to be near the Solstice, not ON the Solstice. Seems to be a coincidence? And, there has always been a Spring holiday around Easter, too. Of course, since Easter is linked to Passover that sorta explains that.
What does “roots are firmly planted in” mean? Sure, many of the exteriour trappings were borrowed from Sol Invictus, Yule & Saturnalia. But we wouldn’t be celebrating any significant Holiday if some early Church Father hadn’t figured Jesus was born around Dec 25. Pre introduction of Christianity- were there much merrymaking @ Dec 21>25th in non-Western cultures? (Even though many likely recognized the Solstice and marked it as a special day). No. Do we have any big holiday for the Summer Solstice (which was also celebrated)? No.
Even though Christmas’s ROOTS (as opposed to exteriour trappings) are firmly set in Xtianity, Christmas today is primarily a secular holiday. We have few symbols of Christ- many of Santa, Rudolph, Frosty, etc.
If you want to have an atheist Christmas, that’s fine. Nothing hypocritical about that. Downplay (very easy) the religous aspects, playup the cultural aspects. And no reason to come up with a silly new name, either. “Yule” is non-Christian, you know.
Of course, there is a big jump from being an athiest and not beleiveing Jesus was the “Son of God” to> “Jesus never existed”. I don’t belive in Communism, either, but that doesn’t mean Marx & Mao were totally mythical, either.
I’m afraid you have it backwards.
Without the significant Pagan holidays there wouldn’t have been an early church father to invent Dec 25 as the birthday of Jesus.
You’re forgetting that some days have been added to our modern calander. So yes, there would have been rejoicing and merrymaking on that day because that was the actual day of the solstice.
Huh? I suppose yes, without there being humans & around & civilization, there wouldn’t have been Christianity, but I don’t see what you’re getting at.
The days added were NOT from Dec 21st to Dec 25th. Although the Solstice was not always on the 21st, the adoption of the Gregorian Calendar did not move it from the 21st to the 25th. Xmas is current not on the Solstice, nor was it on the Solstice back in the early days of the Church when the fixed the date to the 25th. No scholar thinks today that Saturnalia was tied to the date set for Christmas. There is some contention that Xmas was set on Dec 25th to compete with Sol Invictus.