# Is it illegal to impersonate a lawyer if you are representing yourself?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [September 13, 2009, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922 "2009-09-13T16:47:00Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@TheMadHun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheMadHun)
#### Post date: [September 13, 2009, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/1 "2009-09-13T16:47:00Z")
I’m not talking about practicing law.
Say I want a debtor to think I have turned his case over to a lawyer.
Can I make up stationery with a random alias, with the word Esq at the end, and a lawyerly “company line” in the title?
John Jacob Doe, Esq.
Higgens, Figgens, & Wiggens, Partners
re: Debt owed to ThMadMax …
I have such letters, collected in my callow youth, so I know what to say.
Anything illegal about that?
Do I have to pass the bar to call myself Esq?
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### Author:  [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)
#### Post date: [September 13, 2009, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/2 "2009-09-13T17:03:41Z")
It’s illegal to practice law without a license in all US states. If what you are doing makes people think you are practicing law, and they respond to you, pay you or otherwise do business with you based on this representation you are breaking the law.
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### Author:  [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)
#### Post date: [September 13, 2009, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/3 "2009-09-13T18:06:19Z")
In your particular scenario, you are also committing mail fraud and violating the Fair Credit Collections Act (or whatever it’s name is).
As a matter of language usage, a lawyer is a person familiar with and studies law. An attorney is an agent for another. People who have gone to law school but not passed the bar are “lawyers” if they so style themselves. But without the license, the cannot represent others as “attorneys at law”. Using a power of attorney form, people can act as agents for others, but not before the courts.
Obviously, don’t do this.
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### Author:  [@Camus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Camus)
#### Post date: [September 13, 2009, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/4 "2009-09-13T20:35:56Z")
Not to mention that many state bars have online search-able member databases. For the ones that don’t, a simple phone call can verify whether a given person is licensed within a state. In addition, signing and sending such a letter may constitute forgery, depending on the given state statute.
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### Author:  [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)
#### Post date: [September 13, 2009, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/5 "2009-09-13T20:42:59Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#):
>
> In your particular scenario, you are also committing mail fraud and violating the Fair Credit Collections Act (or whatever it’s name is).
>
> As a matter of language usage, a lawyer is a person familiar with and studies law. An attorney is an agent for another.
Just as a point of information, I raised this same point a bit less than a month ago, and was gently corrected. While the distinction was historically relevant, and in pedantic usage still is, common usage has blurred it to the point that they are considered full synonyms. I should regard **Gfactor** , with whom I have never established an attorney-client relationship, as an attorney, just not my attorney.
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### Author:  [@Campion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Campion)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/6 "2009-09-14T01:32:22Z")
> [@TheMadHun](#):
>
> I’m not talking about practicing law.
>
> Say I want a debtor to think I have turned his case over to a lawyer.
> Can I make up stationery with a random alias, with the word Esq at the end, and a lawyerly “company line” in the title?
>
> John Jacob Doe, Esq.
> Higgens, Figgens, & Wiggens, Partners
>
> re: Debt owed to ThMadMax …
>
> I have such letters, collected in my callow youth, so I know what to say.
>
> Anything illegal about that?
> Do I have to pass the bar to call myself Esq?
Under California law, at a minimum, you would be guilty of a misdemeanor under Cal. Bus. & Prof. Code section 6126(a): “Any person advertising or holding himself or herself out as practicing or entitled to practice law or otherwise practicing law who is not an active member of the State Bar, or otherwise authorized pursuant to statute or court rule to practice law in this state at the time of doing so, is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by up to one year in a county jail or by a fine of up to one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by both that fine and imprisonment.”
You’d probably also be guilty of fraud (criminal), as well as various other civil torts.
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### Author:  [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/7 "2009-09-14T01:51:40Z")
Same in Ohio. Don’t do it! A layperson may represent herself in any kind of case at all (even when you’d be stoopid to do so), but pretending to be a lawyer when you’re not, even out of court, is always a bad idea.
An agent for a local collections company around here used to be notorious for allowing uneducated, scared, poor debtors to _think_ he was a lawyer by dressing well, carrying a briefcase, throwing around a lot of legal jargon and talking about filing this or that, but he was always careful, when asked point-blank, to admit that he wasn’t, in fact, a lawyer.
I’ve had several people appear before me in court who identified themselves as lawyers, which I doubted because of their obvious incompetence or just an odd vibe I got from them, so I checked with the Supreme Court of Ohio’s attorney registration office. Wouldn’t you know it, they all _were_ lawyers!
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### Author:  [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/8 "2009-09-14T04:11:37Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#):
>
> As a matter of language usage, a lawyer is a person familiar with and studies law.
As always, answers to this type of legal question depend on the jurisdiction. In the jurisdiction in which I practise, calling yourself a “lawyer” without being a member of the Law Society would be contrary to _The Law Society Act_.
YMMV, depending on where you live and what the local law is.
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### Author:  [@Cunctator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cunctator)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/9 "2009-09-14T05:12:41Z")
> [@Northern Piper](#):
>
> > [@The\_Second\_Stone](#):
> >
> > As a matter of language usage, a lawyer is a person familiar with and studies law. An attorney is an agent for another. People who have gone to law school but not passed the bar are “lawyers” if they so style themselves.
>
> As always, answers to this type of legal question depend on the jurisdiction. In the jurisdiction in which I practise, calling yourself a “lawyer” without being a member of the Law Society would be contrary to _The Law Society Act_.
Ditto. I have a law degree, but I’m not a “lawyer”. If I held myself out as one, I’d be in breach of the _Legal Profession Act_ 2004 (NSW).
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### Author:  [@Randy\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randy_Seltzer)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/10 "2009-09-14T05:18:25Z")
> [@TheMadHun](#):
>
> Do I have to pass the bar to call myself Esq?
No. There is no actual legal significance to that honorific in America.
Except, of course, when one uses it to hold oneself out as a lawyer. Then one is breaking the law in most states.
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### Author:  [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/11 "2009-09-14T05:30:34Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#):
>
> Same in Ohio. Don’t do it! A layperson may represent herself in any kind of case at all (even when you’d be stoopid to do so), but pretending to be a lawyer when you’re not, even out of court, is always a bad idea.
So Ohio doesn’t have small claims court? Or is it only for “stoopid” people? 😕
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### Author:  [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/12 "2009-09-14T07:03:45Z")
In addition to subjecting you to penalties for the unauthorized practice of law (by fraudulently holding yourself out as a lawyer), you would also in particular violate § 807(3) of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act (codified at [15 U.S.C. § 1692e](http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/15/usc_sec_15_00001692---e000-.html)) which states:
> [@](#):
>
> A debt collector may not use any false, deceptive, or misleading representation or means in connection with the collection of any debt. Without limiting the general application of the foregoing, the following conduct is a violation of this section:
>
> * * *
>
> (3) The false representation or implication that any individual is an attorney or that any communication is from an attorney.
Now, you might think that because FDCPA § 803(6) (codified at [15 U.S.C. § 1692a(6)](http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/15/usc_sec_15_00001692---a000-.html)) generally defines a “debt collector” as “any person who uses any instrumentality of interstate commerce or the mails in any business the principal purpose of which is the collection of any debts, or who regularly collects or attempts to collect, directly or indirectly, debts owed or due or asserted to be owed or due another,” you would be exempt from this restriction. However, that section continues and states “the term [debt collector] includes _ **any creditor who, in the process of collecting his own debts, uses any name other than his own which would indicate that a third person is collecting or attempting to collect such debts.** _”
By using a fictitious name, you needlessly transform yourself from a creditor collecting a debt into a plain old debt collector and thereby take on much greater burdens under the FDCPA. Including, as mentioned, a ban on misrepresenting the nature of the legal personnel working on the account.
In other words: Don’t do it.
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### Author:  [@Claude\_Remains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claude_Remains)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/13 "2009-09-14T07:31:11Z")
My letterhead would read- From the law offices of Dewey,Cheatem and Howe…
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### Author:  [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/14 "2009-09-14T12:03:26Z")
In Virginia, it’s a misdemeanor to hold yourself out to another person as qualified or authorized to practice law in the Commonwealth of Virginia. This would almost certainly include the implications offered in the OP.
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### Author:  [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/15 "2009-09-14T13:28:37Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#):
>
> So Ohio doesn’t have small claims court? Or is it only for “stoopid” people? 😕
By “even when” I meant if you had a particularly complex civil case or a felony criminal case but insisted, as a layman, on representing yourself. Those are not the typical small claims case.
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### Author:  [@SCSimmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCSimmons)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/16 "2009-09-14T13:38:36Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#):
>
> So Ohio doesn’t have small claims court? Or is it only for “stoopid” people? 😕
He said ‘even when’, not ‘even though’. I saw no implication that representing yourself is always ‘stoopid’. I think anyone would agree that it’s at least sometimes ‘stoopid’; the points of disagreement on this are usually whether the range of ‘sometimes’ is more like ‘nearly always’, or ‘in rare instances’.
[Edit–too slow, **EH** already defended himself! But maybe he’d like to pay me to represent him in this thread. 🙂]
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### Author:  [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/17 "2009-09-14T13:40:11Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#):
>
> By using a fictitious name, you needlessly transform yourself from a creditor collecting a debt into a plain old debt collector and thereby take on much greater burdens under the FDCPA. Including, as mentioned, a ban on misrepresenting the nature of the legal personnel working on the account.
>
> In other words: Don’t do it.
That’s a great point.
Here’s my state’s unauthorized practice statute:
> [@](#):
>
> 600.916 Unauthorized practice of law.
>
> Sec. 916.
>
> (1) A person shall not practice law or engage in the law business, shall not in any manner whatsoever lead others to believe that he or she is authorized to practice law or to engage in the law business, and shall not in any manner whatsoever represent or designate himself or herself as an attorney and counselor, attorney at law, or lawyer, unless the person is regularly licensed and authorized to practice law in this state. A person who violates this section is guilty of contempt of the supreme court and of the circuit court of the county in which the violation occurred, and upon conviction is punishable as provided by law. This section does not apply to a person who is duly licensed and authorized to practice law in another state while temporarily in this state and engaged in a particular matter.
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### Author:  [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/18 "2009-09-14T14:47:57Z")
> [@TheMadHun](#):
>
> I’m not talking about practicing law.
>
> Say I want a debtor to think I have turned his case over to a lawyer.
> Can I make up stationery with a random alias, with the word Esq at the end, and a lawyerly “company line” in the title?
What about the case of a fake cc? We did this once with a Japanese publisher which was waffling on payment for an article we had done. After a few gentle reminders to pay, we sent one last one with the cc: of a non-existant, but official looking, law office in the email header, along with a firm demand for payment and threat of legal action. They called us the next day and wired us all our money.
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### Author:  [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/19 "2009-09-14T15:05:54Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#):
>
> I’ve had several people appear before me in court who identified themselves as lawyers, which I doubted because of their obvious incompetence or just an odd vibe I got from them, so I checked with the Supreme Court of Ohio’s attorney registration office. Wouldn’t you know it, they all _were_ lawyers!
Sometimes, incompetence is no bar. 😃
---
### Author:  [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)
#### Post date: [September 14, 2009, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-impersonate-a-lawyer-if-you-are-representing-yourself/509922/20 "2009-09-14T15:12:02Z")
> [@Randy\_Seltzer](#):
>
> [QUOTE=TheMadHun]
>
> Do I have to pass the bar to call myself Esq?
No. There is no actual legal significance to that honorific in America.
Except, of course, when one uses it to hold oneself out as a lawyer. Then one is breaking the law in most states.
[/QUOTE]
Previous thread on the issue of “Esquire” - [Use of ‘esquire’ illegal?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=246479)
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