# Is it illegal to own the Blind Faith CD? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 28, 2003, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206 "2003-02-28T19:15:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![TomBrooklyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@TomBrooklyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TomBrooklyn)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2017, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/41 "2017-08-05T13:39:52Z")
The girl is Mariora Goschen. She is now a massage therapist and shiatsu practitioner working in London. > **[Natureworks - Danceworks London](https://danceworks.com/natureworks/?r=true)** > > \[vc\_row equal\_height=”yes” content\_placement=”middle” css=”.vc\_custom\_1668891661327{margin-top: 36px !important;}”\]\[vc\_column width=”1/6″\]\[vc\_single\_image image=”19315″ img\_size=”200×52″ css=”.vc\_custom\_1669988021326{margin-bottom: 0px... ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2017, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/42 "2017-08-05T13:58:19Z")
> [@TomBrooklyn](#): > > The girl is Mariora Goschen. > > She is now a massage therapist and shiatsu practitioner working in London. > > [http://natureworks.net/therapists/mariora-goschen](http://natureworks.net/therapists/mariora-goschen) This is a long gone zombie thread, but, amazingly enough, that Angelfire link originally posted still works, and if you go to the link at the bottom of it, it also links to a page naming Mariora Goschen as the subject of the photo. Not sure how everyone missed that 14 years ago, but there ya go, ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2017, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/43 "2017-08-05T14:00:09Z")
Ah, it’s because the article didn’t come out until 2007: [Linky poo.](http://www.angelfire.com/wi/blindfaith/mgoschennewsie99.html) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2017, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/44 "2017-08-05T14:44:18Z")
> [@RM\_Mentock](#): > > Interesting. **aubries** ’s link says that the artist entitled the coverwork, and the band name was derived from that. Since we’re talking about this again, I want to point out that’s almost certainly not true. The claim is taken from promotional writing glorifying the artist. The group had had its name a [long time](http://ultimateclassicrock.com/blind-faith-debut/) before that. > [@](#): > > That machine’s grinding wheels began to whir with the addition of bassist Ric Grech. Clapton’s latent misgivings were embedded in the name he offered for the quickly coalescing group — Blind Faith. > > Not everyone was thrilled with the new moniker but, like everything else, there seemed to an innate momentum to this process that no one person could slow. “I knew it was a hype as soon as it was called Blind Faith,” Winwood recalled in a separate interview with Mojo. “I think the name was largely Eric’s idea, but I felt it had certain negative implications. I went along with it only because, after a while, if a band is successful, the name loses its meaning and just becomes a label.” ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2017, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/45 "2017-08-05T18:59:05Z")
I could have misremembered this, but I recall the band photo of Blind Faith was on the back of the album (vinyl) cover that had the photo of the girl with the model airplane on the front. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2017, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/46 "2017-08-05T19:12:00Z")
She is a old lady now. She was 11 when the image was taken. She’s pushing sixty now. [ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/](http://ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/) ---
**Author:** ![Murph1111](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@Murph1111](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Murph1111)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2017, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/47 "2017-08-06T01:27:03Z")
OK, the album cover appears to show a approx. 30-year-old woman who doesn’t happen to need a bra. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2017, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/48 "2017-08-06T02:42:47Z")
> [@Murph1111](#): > > OK, the album cover appears to show a approx. 30-year-old woman who doesn’t happen to need a bra. You have a very strange head. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/49 "2017-08-07T02:38:22Z")
> [@Casey1505](#): > > No. It does not show an actual underage girl (it would be difficult that the subject of the painting is underage), it is a painting not a photograph, and it is not intended to arouse arousal (is that the right phrase?). You have a fine CD there, and should be commended for you good taste. Well not arousal because someone who is impotent might still get pleasure from child abuse. For the reason that they cant get real sex in any form. So the phrase is usually sexually provocative, or "for sexual gratification or pleasure " when the law requires an intent. Many jurisdictions may have erased excuses such as “older model who looks young” , changed to “isnt too young and doesn’t look too young” and erases the excuse of “not a photograph, its hand drawn or CGI”. But she is holding a phallic symbol in her hand ? Is that representing a sexual act ? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/50 "2017-08-07T04:09:20Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > She is a old lady now. She was 11 when the image was taken. She’s pushing sixty now. > > [ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/](http://ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/) What’s funny about that story is the photographer saying he simply _approached a young girl on a train_ that he thought looked the right age. Heh, could he possibly have gone about this in a more creepy way if he’d tried? You would think he would go to a modelling agency or something. “Hi, girl-on-a-train-who-I’ve-never-met-before, I’m a photographer and want to photograph you naked. Interested?” ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/51 "2017-08-07T04:27:51Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > What’s funny about that story is the photographer saying he simply _approached a young girl on a train_ that he thought looked the right age. Heh, could he possibly have gone about this in a more creepy way if he’d tried? You would think he would go to a modelling agency or something. > > “Hi, girl-on-a-train-who-I’ve-never-met-before, I’m a photographer and want to photograph you naked. Interested?” Even creepier is she was the 14 year old sister. “So sorry, you’re too _old_.” :eek: ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/52 "2017-08-07T05:19:13Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > She is a old lady now. She was 11 when the image was taken. She’s pushing sixty now. > > [ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/](http://ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/) Oh, come on! 60 isn’t that old! ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/53 "2017-08-07T12:26:17Z")
On [the wiki list](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_controversial_album_art#Nudity_and_sexuality) of controversial album covers, it says the she is holding “a silver space ship”, but that is almost certainly [a hood ornament](http://grrm.livejournal.com/439932.html) from a car. Anyone know _which_ car? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/54 "2017-08-07T13:26:54Z")
Read the article. It was made for the shoot. And it symbolised the future that the girl - chosen deliberately as being between childhood and adolescence - was holding in her hand. Ummm. Allegedly. Or something. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/55 "2017-08-07T14:14:43Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Even creepier is she was the 14 year old sister. > “So sorry, you’re too _old_.” > :eek: The older girl turned him down when she learned she’d have to pose naked. She was 12, not 14, but her being older had nothing to do with it according to the photographer’s own story. Similarly, I don’t ever remember anyone talking about the plane being a phallic symbol in the past. That interpretation is something from the 21st century. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/56 "2017-08-07T14:21:05Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > The older girl turned him down when she learned she’d have to pose naked. She was 12, not 14, but her being older had nothing to do with it according to the photographer’s own story. > > Similarly, I don’t ever remember anyone talking about the plane being a phallic symbol in the past. That interpretation is something from the 21st century. From the linked article. > [@](#): > > When he met with her parents **she proved to be too old for his vision** and he ended up using her younger sister Mariora Goschen who was 11 years old at the time. ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/57 "2017-08-07T14:30:08Z")
Very old thread relocated from IMHO to Cafe Society. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/58 "2017-08-07T15:09:48Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > From the linked article. I was using the link given in aubries post #5, ostensibly the photographer’s words. > [@](#): > > She said, “Do I have to take off my clothes?” My answer was yes. I gave her my card and begged her to call. I would have to ask her parent’s consent if she agreed. When I got to Stigwood’s office I called the flat and said that if this girl called not to let her off the phone without getting her phone number. When I returned she had called and left her number… > > Mouse and I made our presentation, I told my story, the parents agreed. The girl on the tube train would not be the one, she was shy, she had just passed the point of complete innocence and could not pose. Her younger sister had been saying the whole time, “Oh Mummy, Mummy, I want to do it, I want to do it.” She was glorious sunshine. Botticelli’s angel, the picture of innocence, a face which in a brief time could launch a thousand space ships. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/59 "2017-08-07T15:58:13Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Ah, it’s because the article didn’t come out until 2007: [Linky poo.](http://www.angelfire.com/wi/blindfaith/mgoschennewsie99.html) Well, that and I figure no one ever got through that dreck of an article to get to the bottom. Christ! That was unreadable! ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206/60 "2017-08-07T17:33:15Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > She is a old lady now. She was 11 when the image was taken. She’s pushing sixty now. > > [ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/](http://ww.feelnumb.com/2011/07/17/the-young-girl-featured-on-the-blind-faith-album-cover/) Please observe the two click rule with links. I’ve broken the link in your post, and all the posts that have quoted it. [/moderating] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-own-the-blind-faith-cd/158206.md?page=4)