# Is it illegal to tape TV shows? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 23, 2003, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033 "2003-02-23T23:31:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Gjorp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c4cdca/32.png) [@Gjorp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gjorp)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2003, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/1 "2003-02-23T23:31:26Z")
AFAIK, it is illegal to tape songs off the radio. So, why isn’t it illegal to tape TV shows? Is it just because so many people do it? Or is it really not illegal to tape songs off the radio? ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2003, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/2 "2003-02-23T23:37:25Z")
No. See [SONY CORP. v. UNIVERSAL CITY STUDIOS, INC., 464 U.S. 417 (1984)](http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=464&invol=417) ---
**Author:** ![N9IWP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/n9iwp/32/3154_2.png) [@N9IWP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N9IWP)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2003, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/3 "2003-02-23T23:50:43Z")
It is legal to tape TV shows for the purpose of time shifting. It falls under fair use, so says SCOTUS, Sony vs Universal > **[FindLaw's United States Supreme Court case and opinions.](https://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/464/417.html)** > > FindLaw's searchable database of United States Supreme Court decisions since (more precicely, VCRs are not illegal beacsue they have a non infinging use, ie time shifting) Brian ---
**Author:** ![Rabid\_Squirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Rabid\_Squirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rabid_Squirrel)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2003, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/4 "2003-02-23T23:51:25Z")
I think the general concensus is that it’s OK to copy music and TV for your own personal use, but not for distribution or public display. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/5 "2003-02-24T01:26:10Z")
I’m not a lawyer, but I’d WAG that, while time-shifting is allowed, archiving technically is not. Of course, I doubt anyone will bust into your house because you made a broadcast-quality tape of _X-Men_ or anything. ---
**Author:** ![Bob55](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Bob55](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bob55)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/6 "2003-02-24T04:04:20Z")
I recall one network executive saying something to the effect of “it’s ok to record television shows so long as you DO NOT fast forward through the commercials - skipping the ads is stealing TV” ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/7 "2003-02-24T04:55:33Z")
**Bob55** : [The Dreaded Fast-Forward Button](http://bbs.bbc.org/newsletter/aug02nl/skala.html) > [@](#): > > This April [2002], twenty years after the hearings mentioned above, Jamie Kellner of Turner Broadcasting described the fast-forward button like this: “It’s theft. Your contract with the network when you get the show is you’re going to watch the spots. Otherwise you couldn’t get the show on an ad-supported basis. Any time you skip a commercial or watch the button you’re actually stealing the programming.” ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/8 "2003-02-24T05:03:40Z")
That the silliest thing I’ve ever heard. So, if I run to the bathroom or go make a sandwich during the commercials, I’m stealing the programming? Give me a break. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/9 "2003-02-24T05:09:33Z")
Sure it’s silly. But there’s currently a case running to determine whether it’s just silly _de facto_ or actually silly _de jure_. [Newmark, et al., v. Turner Broadcasting System, Inc. et al.](http://www.eff.org/IP/Video/Newmark_v_Turner/) ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/10 "2003-02-24T05:20:45Z")
I don’t know as the entertainment industry has much of a leg to stand on here. Commercial Advance is a feature found on many VCRs (mine has it), yet AKAIK, no on has filed a similar suit against VCR makers. Yes, I understand that commercials pay for broadcast TV programming, but since the dawn of television people have left the room during commercials, which is inherently no different than fast-forwarding through them. Ok, for the former you have to actually get up off your ass, whereas for the latter you don’t, but you get my point. Surely sponsors don’t expect that every viewer will sit through ever commercial. Clearly enough people see enough of the commercials to make TV advertising worth billions annually to the various advertisers who pay to air them. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/11 "2003-02-24T05:27:13Z")
Well, the suit against the VCR makers was filed and lost 20 years ago. Note that the suit I referred to above was a pre-emptive strike against Turner, not the other was around. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/12 "2003-02-24T05:34:27Z")
Yes, I realize that. I was commenting on the statements made by the representatives of the televison industry. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/13 "2003-02-24T05:43:12Z")
IIRC, the Millenium Copyright Act, essentially says that it’s _illegal_ to tape HDTV broadcasts for _any_ reason. RIAA was trying to get a provision included in a bill that would allow them to write computer virus programs which would _wipe out any “improperly owned” MP3’s you might have on your computer!_ Nice, huh? Ironically enough, some of the anti-terrorism legislation passed after 9/11 has put the lid on _that_ idea for awhile. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/14 "2003-02-24T06:09:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tuckerfan \* > **IIRC, the Millenium Copyright Act, essentially says that it’s _illegal_ to tape HDTV broadcasts for _any_ reason.** No, it doesn’t say that. But the _Broadcast Protection Discussion Group_ does want a “broadcast flag” added to transmissions which would be recognised by digital copying equipment and by digital-to-analog conversion equipment. More info: [Industry Plans to Restrict Use of HDTV Broadcasts, Harming Innovation](http://www.eff.org/IP/Video/HDTV/20020117_eff_bpdg_overview.html) ---
**Author:** ![Dunmurry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d2c977/32.png) [@Dunmurry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunmurry)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/15 "2003-02-24T11:52:28Z")
You might want to check out my thread on this subject: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=128903](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=128903) ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/16 "2003-02-24T12:12:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dunmurry \* > \*\*You might want to check out my thread on this subject: > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=128903](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=128903) \*\* Yes. That’s an excellent example of a question that gets four replies, all from people that haven’t got a clue. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/17 "2003-02-24T12:16:44Z")
I retract my last comment. **Duckster** correctly answered _this_ OP in six minutes, and the (now) broken link in **Duckster** ’s answer to **Dunmurry** ’s OP may well have done the same. ---
**Author:** ![spione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@spione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spione)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/18 "2003-02-24T13:03:04Z")
For own personal use its illegal…For giving to public its legal,hmm…or is it vice versa? ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/19 "2003-02-24T16:29:42Z")
Public performance of captions is not permitted without written permission. They usually say that in the captions…so I guess a private showing is legal. I love my Commercial Advance, but it seems to be in very few NEW vcrs these days & I’m not sure why. Did you guys see this guy on the news whose trying to get commercials to be part of a program? So like the star would be talking to someone & then sip some coke (soda) & say what a wonderful soft drink it is. … oh, no. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2003, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-illegal-to-tape-tv-shows/157033/20 "2003-02-24T16:33:38Z")
Didn’t they do something similar to that sort of thing years ago, when commercial broadcast TV was beginning to emerge as a major entertainment medium, **handy**?