# Is it ok to dismiss someone for watching FOX? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 13, 2010, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593 "2010-07-13T21:21:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2010, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/381 "2010-07-16T20:29:07Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Rare indeed. What I’m saying is that when you talk of what is on Fox News, you cannot separate the hard news and the commentary-the vast majority of viewers certainly don’t, and there is hard evidence that the 10% that is news is designed to support the 90% that is commentary. I agree. I’ve seen the pattern and the way they manipulate the info and blur the lines enough to conclude it’s a plan of action dictated by the powers that be. When the plan is to feed a double dose of distorted info to thier audience then it’s impossible for me to give the channel any real credibility. Bias I willingly accept as part of the human condition but I want to hear opposing views from people who have some real concern about what is true or not true. There is some kind of real line where understandable bias stops and intentionally consistent dishonesty becomes the overriding identity. ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2010, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/382 "2010-07-16T20:43:27Z")
Sounds like we’ve resolved this. Well done gentlemen, well done. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2010, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/383 "2010-07-16T22:31:00Z")
> [@emacknight](#): > > Sounds like we’ve resolved this. Well done gentlemen, well done. High five all around. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/384 "2010-07-17T00:13:55Z")
> [@villa](#): > > OK - frankly I’m getting sick and tired of the general “if a white person did this to a black person” line and in particular this instance of it. > > It’s not the same thing, you know. Until you can show me a history of white people being beaten and murdered for trying to vote, I’m not going to look at it in the same light. This isn’t ancient history you know - its in many people’s life times. A single isolated incident doesn’t carry anywhere near the same import. > > You want to know the major difference? Here the police were called and the situation was dealt with. if the colors were reversed, and it was Klansmen trying to prevent black people from voting, when the police were called they aided in the voter intimidation, up to and including participation in the murder of blacks seeking to exercise their franchise and whites seeking to aid them. > > So drop this odious comparison. It makes you look either racist or ignorant of history. Sorry, not buying that. Civil rights are supposed to apply equally to both sides. I think deep down you know that. I guess you are just trying to get a rise out of me; I’m neither racist nor ignorant of history. Of course there was a terrible history, and yes the civil rights and voting rights laws were put in place to change things (with more Republicans than Democrats pushing it, by the way). But, as some have said in this thread, the end does not justify the means, good for the goose, etc. It’s a slam dunk case. It’s on [Youtube](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU) for God’s sake. The self-described ‘security’ guy has a weapon at the polling place. Breaks federal law. Holder overrules the career attornies, who know it’s open and shut. The case was dropped (not narrowed, as some are suggesting; the only thing they got an injunction for was something that’s _already_ against federal law) I’d suggest that it’s the Obama administration acting racist here. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/385 "2010-07-17T00:22:35Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > You set certain requirements in order to make a point and there’s nothing wrong with an equal and valid comparison , but let’s compare that to the larger picture. > IMHO that one incident with Rather pales in comparison to Fox being so consistent in distorting the facts. > > Also, as far as the importance of impacting a presidential election is concerned do you think a serious news anchor has a lot more weight with the average voter than the bombardment of distortion we see from Fox? > They know what they are doing. They’re loking for an emotional reaction rather than an informed one. > > While we’re here, please tell me who you think are the straight news anchors on FNC and who are the opinion mongers. If you were going to recommend straight news shows which would they be? What left leaning shows do you think are valid comparisons? Again, you keep talking as if it’s stipulated that the Fox news people (not the commentators/entertainers) have engaged in a distortion or smear campaign, as drastic and possibly history-changing as what CBS News tried to do, against the the president or his party. I know that that’s Conventional Wisdom on Kos or HuffPo, but I’m still waiting for the proof. Send a link if you have one. I’ve said several times in this thread (yes, I know it’s long and I accept TL/DR as an answer) that there is no one source a person can turn to, in either the lefty or righty media. As a moderate indy it’s pretty easy for me to see this. I get most of my news from about 6 different sources, including lefties like WaPo and MSNBC (the interwebs, not TV), and righties like WSJ and WaTimes. About the only middle-of-the-fairway sources I can think of are CNBC and ESPN (lol), but they are hardly into politics. ---
**Author:** ![Stoneburg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@Stoneburg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoneburg)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/386 "2010-07-17T00:22:38Z")
Oy, it’s resolved. Read back. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/387 "2010-07-17T00:25:12Z")
> [@Stoneburg](#): > > Why? So that you can ignore it and keep parroting your message? As you have done every time in this thread where you’ve been proven wrong. > > It’s completely unnecessary. You’ve already helped prove to me in this very thread what I asked about in the OP. Intentionally or not, your participation in this thread has been the strongest argument for me that it is indeed reasonable to dismiss people who think FOX is “fair and balanced”. > > On a positive note I it swings both ways. If I see a conservative who says “FOX isn’t a serious news outlet” I will read his arguments more carefully, assuming this is likely to be an intelligent conservative with the capacity for critical thinking. Which makes that persons arguments very interesting to me. Um… so you’re saying you don’t have any links/proof to share? Well then, I guess your opinion should shut the discussion. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/388 "2010-07-17T00:31:57Z")
> [@emacknight](#): > > I know you don’t, that’s why this thread is on page 8. > > … > But it needs to be acknowledged how they did it: by blurring the line between boring stuffy news reporting, and fast paced in your face entertainment. Well, I guess we’re going to 9. Please provide the proof/links that the FNC/newsies/non-commentators-‘n’-entertainers did something that rose to the shenanigans CBS News tried to do. I’ve asked this question a million times in this thread, and all people send me are harangues by Hannity. As per your statement, he doesn’t count (nor does Maher). FWIW, I thought Chris Wallace was actually a Democrat - it came up when Clinton got all huffy with him during his interview, the Kos crowd immediately seized on the idea that it was a hatchet job, then it came out (but not sure where I saw that). The link someone posted earlier, of Chris taking Fox n friends to task for hammering Obama unnecessarily, should provide some weight to FNC’s straight shooting I would think. Maybe not, I guess he needs to go spike trees or blow up a Hummer dealership to get his lefty street cred. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/389 "2010-07-17T00:37:46Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > So, I take it that the opposition here agrees that \*\*All \*\*of FOX can not be defended and it is OK then to dismiss anyone that still thinks that they are fair and balanced or objective? They can’t be defended because there’s nothing to defend. Nobody expects the non-news sections, the O’Reilly’s and Hannity’s, to be objective. Nor would I suggest objectivity from Keith O. Now as for CNN, I harken back to the link I posted earlier about Anderson Cooper ridiculing the tea party; I thought he _was_ supposed to be an ‘objective’ anchor for that network. I thought once Kaplan left (he of the Lincoln Bedroom rentals) that they were going to knock off the blatant lefty stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/390 "2010-07-17T00:39:00Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > You are incorrect. The individual who made racist comments and carried a baton recieved and injunction from the civil case filed that prevents him from carrying any sort of weapon near a polling place through 2012. It was dealt with by legal action being taken over a relatively minor infraction. That’s more than we saw in the recent and not so recent past. That’s like punishing a bank robber by making him sign a paper saying he won’t rob any more banks. What he did, and promised not to do anymore, is already against federal law. Edit to add: apologies, I see **Shodon** already made this point in post 376 ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/391 "2010-07-17T00:44:16Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > Well, I guess we’re going to 9. Please provide the proof/links that the FNC/newsies/non-commentators-‘n’-entertainers did something that rose to the shenanigans CBS News tried to do. Of course there’s no proof. All they do is keep viewers informed of the constant sleaze perpetrated on the good people by their duplicitous [del]Republican [/del]Democrat Congressmen! They’d never tell an out-and-out lie! ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/392 "2010-07-17T00:44:35Z")
> [@Stoneburg](#): > > Oy, it’s resolved. Read back. OK fine. I got on a response spree, as part of my neverending mission to educate those in need, before I got down to the ‘we are done’ part. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/393 "2010-07-17T01:44:10Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > It’s a slam dunk case. It’s on [Youtube](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU) for God’s sake. The self-described ‘security’ guy has a weapon at the polling place. Breaks federal law. Holder overrules the career attornies, who know it’s open and shut. The case was dropped (not narrowed, as some are suggesting; the only thing they got an injunction for was something that’s _already_ against federal law) > > I’d suggest that it’s the Obama administration acting racist here. Wow! What a gross misrepresentation of the truth. We’ve gone over this in detail in the other thread and what you present here has several glaring and very misleading errors that are excactly the kind of crap Fox has eagerly supported in this story and repeatedly does for story after story. 1. Perhaps you could cite the federal law against carrying any weapon near a polling place. Maybe it exists but I couldn’t find it using google. It appeared to me that it was the states who determined that. In all the articles I’ve read on this story not one mentions a violation of federal law. So cite please! Other than that a few pertinent details. I said there were no criminal charges and that’s a fact. The Bush DOJ filed civil charges because they felt the case did not warrent criminal charges. That includes the attorny/ GOP mouthpiece who is creating the furor now and making his accusations about racism. Open and shut is a matter of opinion and hyperboyle. Several attornies in the DOJ and several Members of the Civil rights commission claimed there just wasn’t much of a case. The DOJ did win their civil case , not by the evidence but by default, when the accused didn’t show up. After winning they had to review the evidence to determine what the sentence would be. No jail time was ever on the table because the Bush DOJ had only filed a civil case. What they decided was to get an injunction against the man who had actually committed offenses, {the weapon and the racist remark that was aimed at a poll watcher not a voter} The other guy in the video was a registered poll watcher who lived in that neighborhood so no action was taken against him. There simply wasn’t enough evidence to support charges of attempted voter intimidation. The whole thing is overblown dishonesty political hackery. It’s too bad you seem to have swallowed it without doing any research. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/394 "2010-07-17T01:49:23Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > That’s like punishing a bank robber by making him sign a paper saying he won’t rob any more banks. No it isn’t because nobody charged this man with a crime concering this incident. What’s it’s like is realsitically dealing with a civil case. > [@](#): > > What he did, and promised not to do anymore, is already against federal law. I’ve asked for a cite on this specific. Not claiming it’s wrong but surprised I couldn’t verify it when I checked. > [@](#): > > Edit to add: apologies, I see **Shodon** already made this point in post 376 yeah he did, which means you’re both wrong and regurgitating the very misleading talking points that Fox has been spouting. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/395 "2010-07-17T01:59:17Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > Well, I guess we’re going to 9. Please provide the proof/links that the FNC/newsies/non-commentators-‘n’-entertainers did something that rose to the shenanigans CBS News tried to do. > > I’ve asked this question a million times in this thread, and all people send me are harangues by Hannity. As per your statement, he doesn’t count (nor does Maher). > > FWIW, I thought Chris Wallace was actually a Democrat - it came up when Clinton got all huffy with him during his interview, the Kos crowd immediately seized on the idea that it was a hatchet job, then it came out (but not sure where I saw that). > > The link someone posted earlier, of Chris taking Fox n friends to task for hammering Obama unnecessarily, should provide some weight to FNC’s straight shooting I would think. Maybe not, I guess he needs to go spike trees or blow up a Hummer dealership to get his lefty street cred. Only if Chris was doing it on behalf of FNC instead of in spite of them because he just couldn’t take it anymore. What Chris was critisizing happens on a very regular basis on FNC. Some Fox employee doing what Chris did happens very rarely. There’s clip of one of the Fox and Friends trio storming off stage as well. He made a rare attempt at defending Obama and his two “friends” jumped on him so hard that he stormed off. That doesn’t wash away all those mornings he shovels it with them. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/396 "2010-07-17T02:01:17Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > They can’t be defended because there’s nothing to defend. Nobody expects the non-news sections, the O’Reilly’s and Hannity’s, to be objective. Nor would I suggest objectivity from Keith O. > > Now as for CNN, I harken back to the link I posted earlier about Anderson Cooper ridiculing the tea party; I thought he _was_ supposed to be an ‘objective’ anchor for that network. I thought once Kaplan left (he of the Lincoln Bedroom rentals) that they were going to knock off the blatant lefty stuff. As \*\*cosmosdan \*\*noticed you are not paying attention, incidentally I already posted evidence that it is not only the non-news section of FOX that is misleading the American people. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2010, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/397 "2010-07-17T17:29:05Z")
Sure Fox has to present the “news”, the missing white girl ,the oil spill and the extremely hot weather not connected to global warming. Their slant does leak into the news too. But then they have Beck to explain. Of course Kristol who has not been right about anything in a decade is a resident expert. Dick Morris who lost his Clinton job for cavorting with prostitutes ,is another defender of ethics and morality. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2010, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/398 "2010-07-18T02:51:30Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > Now as for CNN, I harken back to the link I posted earlier about Anderson Cooper ridiculing the tea party; I thought he _was_ supposed to be an ‘objective’ anchor for that network. I thought once Kaplan left (he of the Lincoln Bedroom rentals) that they were going to knock off the blatant lefty stuff. But objectively one _should_ make fun of the tea party. They make no sense, they have no coherent political position, their name is a sexual entendre, their spokespeople spout nonsense and lies, and they were created by a news network to boost ratings. Treating them seriously is not objective any more than treating Bozo the Clown seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2010, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/399 "2010-07-18T03:43:16Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > Well, I guess we’re going to 9. Please provide the proof/links that the FNC/newsies/non-commentators-‘n’-entertainers did something that rose to the shenanigans CBS News tried to do. I don’t know why I bother. But here we go. CBS trusted a document that was not true and for two weeks, a month before the election, held to their guns and said that Bush went AWOL from his National Guard duty during the Vietnam War. Okay, let’s contrast that with what FNC did. They repeated over and over again that Obama “palled around with terrorists” for six months. They reported over and over that his priest was a black supremacist racist. Both of those are by far worse than playing hooky thirty years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2010, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593/400 "2010-07-18T04:19:18Z")
Bush actually did go AWOL. That story was not dependent on the document. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-ok-to-dismiss-someone-for-watching-fox/546593.md?page=21)