As an example of that, I declined the built-in car alarm when I bought my 2010 Honda Fit, so they had someone go into the engine compartment and remove something to disable it.
I grant all the hardware is possibly there on every car shipped. Even back in the very much not comupterised 1970s it was common that cars had all the wiring harnesses for every optional accessory, even if the fancy radio with stereo (woot!) speakers was not.
What of it? A physical cell receiver (software on a teeny computer really) that never receives a wakeup command is just a lump of idle and maybe even unpowered silicon.
Are you asserting Kia will be telling the customers they’re not tracking, but do it anyhow? Are you asserting somehow the government can reach into the car and do [whatever].
Obviously different folks here are concerned different amounts about different threats. Some real, some plausible, some fanciful.
No, buy any car.
See, that was the concern from the OP. OnStar no longer does that, in fact it is being mostly discontinued, So, any new car you buy today will not be sending out info to be sold to your insurance company. That is now banned.
Yes, many new cars have computers and that info can be downloaded. But it wont be shared with your insurance company.
You seem to be saying that, because OnStar no longer exists, the ability to trace (or even control) your vehicle cannot exist. Is this a proper interpretation of your posts?
There was also a news item several years ago about the FBI(?) using the services of some company similar to OnStar to eavesdrop on conversations in cars by certain targeted alleged organized crime figures. IIRC, it was not OnStar but some rival company. The concern was that the services are sold on the premise they can also detect car crashes (air bags etc.) and immediately send help - however, by hijacking the channel and directing it to a recorder, this service which was the reason for the service could not happen. Since it was likely recorded for future review, nobody was monitoring it live. The concern was, at what point does the desire to listen for evidence override personal safety bought and paid for?
Googling for a cite (since you didn’t provide one), I found Consumer Reports says
General Motors was penalized in January for allegedly using its Smart Driver program to collect and sell its customers’ driving data without their knowledge or permission. The Federal Trade Commission ordered the automaker to not sell driver data for five years to consumer reporting agencies (or credit bureaus) such as Experian, Equifax, and TransUnion. But a Consumer Reports investigation finds that nearly every automaker that sells cars in the U.S. is similarly collecting and sharing so-called “driver behavior data” with other companies and continues to do so.
The end result is that your driving data often winds up in the hands of multiple companies and can be used to influence the insurance premiums and auto loan terms you’re offered online.
I’m simply saying that it’s possible. I have no reason to think that it’s happening, and in fact I highly doubt that it is. But I think the subject of this thread is determining how to buy a car that CANNOT track you. A car that contains cellular hardware doesn’t meet that criterion, even if in practice the tracking never happens.
Understood and agree w your assessment.
The OP, and the other various posters are all over the place on what criteria they’re using. As always, to decide what is “secure enough”, one has to decide what the threat is and what the adversary is.
If someone wants a car that is flat physically impossible to track, they need one that sits in a fully enclosed windowless garage with dead battery/ies and doesn’t move. Any less stringent precautions are just debating which threat(s) you’ve become vulnerable to.
For sure along the continuum from impossible-to-track vs easy-to-track, there are a couple of big jumps in the shades of gray. Having/not having a license plate and having/not having a cell modem installed are two big watershed jumps.
That was GM, not Kia.
If the car has a functional cellular modem, then it can be used to track you. Someone will have to pay for the data activation, though.
The only way to be sure the car can’t track you is to buy one without a cell modem, or one where the cell modem can be physically disabled. External tracking through cameras, or devices fit to the car are still possible.
That rule applies for today though. Ebikes can now be bought with builtin bluetooth “Airtag” trackers. I’m sure it won’t be long before they come pre-installed on cars. That only provides occasional location updates, not a live data stream.
Not quite, but the convo was getting multithreaded there and who was talking to who about what isn’t always obvious.
GM of course were the OnStar people who got their wrist slapped.
But if you follow that quote of mine backwards enough steps you get to post 41 quoting post 40. Which was @PhillyGuy talking about Kia and whether they were tracking if you didn’t activate the Kia Connect service.
Tracking is not what I said. Read carefully- no longer can any car send infor on a basis to be sold to your insurance company.
THAT is what the OP asked about. OnStarTracking info sold to insurance companies.
GM was reprimanded, and OnStar no ;longer exists in that form.
Yes, there are other ways to have your data shared. In many cases, now you can Opt out”
In 2020, California became the first state to require companies to let their customers opt out of having their data collected, shared, and sold. Since then, 15 other states have followed California’s lead, enacting similar privacy laws and three more have laws set to go into effect in 2026.
But every car now has a computer, and while many auto companies deny they sell that info, especially on a individual basis-
In response to questions from CR about their privacy policies, many of the 15 automakers said they oftentimes share “deidentified” driving data—without names, addresses, and Social Security numbers—to limit the amount of personal information being sent, seek consent before sharing driving data with third-party companies, and, in most cases, limit sharing to just their company affiliates and service providers.
Thus indeed, you can Opt Out, and especially not agree to share.
But the ONLY way to be sure, is not buy a modern car. Still, the problem is not as rife as it once was.