# Is it possible to live in the US without a bank account? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 3, 2023, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545 "2023-11-03T19:21:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/41 "2023-11-04T01:58:30Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Instead, the most likely speculation is that assets are in trust or some other form of “asset protection”, A congressperson earns $174,000/year. $223,500 as Speaker of the House ($4,300/week). I don’t think the government is paying them in cash. I do not know the Speaker’s finances but that is the minimum he earns. Can he tell the government to pay that to a corporation he runs? Can the corporation then pay him in cash that he stuffs in his mattress? ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/42 "2023-11-04T02:10:52Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I do not know his finances but that is the minimum he earns. Can he tell the government to pay that to a corporation he runs? I’m thinking that the only critical boxes on the pay direct deposit form are routing number and account number. The bank may not check other information, even if provided. So, probably, yes. If he owns more than $1,000 or so in the corporation, he has to report that asset. He did not. If he manages the corporation but isn’t a significant owner, they have to pay him at least the minimum wage, and outside income is reportable. His main source of outside income is teaching at Liberty University. ---
**Author:** ![martyg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f475e1/32.png) [@martyg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/martyg)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/43 "2023-11-04T02:11:21Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > How do you get paid in cash? Most companies have a “pay card” that works like a gift card through a third party credit card processing company that partners with a credit card company such as Visa for processing. People who don’t have bank accounts have this as the option for getting paid generally. It’s like reloading a gift card on pay day. I used one for a short period of time but I tried to buy an adult product with it, and the processor didn’t allow that. My reaction was “you don’t belong in my bedroom” so I opened a bank account, and the first thing I asked the bank was “are there any product restrictions?” The first that said no got the business. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/44 "2023-11-04T02:11:46Z")
I have bank accounts that don’t earn any interest. ---
**Author:** ![md-2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@md-2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md-2000)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/45 "2023-11-04T02:13:44Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > The Congressional reporting requirement includes non-blind trusts. If the checking account is titled Johnson Family Trust, that’s just as reportable as if titled joint tenants, or in the spouse’s name, or a child’s name. That was my thought - a trust which operates like a chequing account at his (or wife’s or immediate family’s) discretion is effectively their chequing account. I don’t think semantics (“what is the meaning of ‘is’?”) will protect it from being reportable. If it walks like an bank account, looks like a bank account, and quacks like a bank account - in dollars - it’s a bank account. Perhaps the only exception is the need for bearing interest. But seriously, this guy has no savings or investments? Does he take the “no interest” Biblical admonishment literally? Does his retirement account cosnist of gold bars buried in the back yard? (Would gold bars be required reportable? The articles on Menendez never mentioned that aspect.) > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > A congressperson earns $174,000/year. $223,500 as Speaker of the House ($4,300/week). > [@Pardel-Lux](#): > > Nitpick: $4,000. Yes, I vaguely recalled the congressional pay (thanks to a recent George Santos article) as being almost $180K/year so I rounded. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/46 "2023-11-04T02:19:53Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > But seriously, this guy has no savings or investments? The area of the board here is Factual Questions. We have no factual information on that. It’s a fact that the vast majority of members of congress have many more entries in their financial disclosures than Mike Johnson does. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/47 "2023-11-04T02:37:45Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Is there a good reason to do this other than to evade the IRS and public scrutiny? I very much doubt the IRS looks at congressional financial disclosure forms. As for public scrutiny, maybe. He was on the Armed Services committee. Would he be scrutinized if he listed himself as owning Boeing stock? That’s the whole idea of these disclosures — publicize conflicts of interest. However, lots of members disclose dozens of stocks owned, and I doubt it is often publicized. I do not say this is a good reason, but — laziness. Looking at the disclosures, I am struck by the large number of small investments held by the typical member of congress. It probably took them hours to fill out the form properly, and the more ethical members may not think detailing their personal finances should be made a staff responsibility. Some may pay an accountant, but that costs money. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/48 "2023-11-04T02:53:46Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Electric bills (and several others) can be paid in cash around here at dedicated utility service centers. Admittedly, these centers were easier to find 20+ years ago but they’re still around. I believe places like Walmart and major supermarkets will handle local utility payments at their service desks. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/49 "2023-11-04T05:57:09Z")
Come on, even Jack Reacher has a bank account. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/50 "2023-11-04T07:21:44Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I am not sure it is easy to manage to live as a poor person without a bank account in the US. It can be. You get paid by check. You go to a check cashing place (Money-Service-Business=MSB) that offers free bill paying with your business. You pay rent by MO or cash. For migrant farm workers this is common. > [@ZipperJJ](#): > > I know a guy who’s banned from having a checking account… Any bank can ban you, but that doesnt mean you cant try at another. > [@Pardel-Lux](#): > > Nitpick: $4,000. Pretty close to the $5,000 declaring limit. How often do Congressmen get paid? Weekly? OK. Monthly? He’s already over the limit. All Feds get paid every two weeks. > [@nearwildheaven](#): > > How do you get banned from having a checking account? What would stop you from going to another bank, or credit union, and opening an account there? Nothing. But banks can report you to other banks - that doesnt mean they cant open an account, but they likely wont choose too. a CU may be the answer. > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > A congressperson earns $174,000/year. $223,500 as Speaker of the House ($4,300/week). I don’t think the government is paying them in cash. But how much is that after taxes? say he maxes out his Thrift Saving plan= 10%, plus Soc-sec, Medicare, tax withholding, his take home could be half that. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/51 "2023-11-04T07:33:18Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > But how much is that after taxes? I think for purposes of this discussion we need to go with gross income. Net income is a rabbit hole that will only confuse things. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/52 "2023-11-04T09:00:24Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > How do you pay a credit card bill with cash? you’d have to walk into that bank branch. Yes, that’s exactly how it’s done. I have occasionally done that, but the bank in question having a branch on my way to/from work makes that convenient rather than a hassle for me. Store credit cards can still be paid at the store that issued them. If you don’t have a bank account you can cash a check at what we here around Chicago call a “currency exchange” for a fee. You’d have to use cash, money order, and pre-paid cards for a lot of things. > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > FWIW my employer will not pay in cash…will the IRS even allow that? Yes, it will. For the years I was in desperate financial straits I was being paid largely in cash and the IRS didn’t care, they just cared about my reporting my income and paying any taxes due. If anyone is wondering why I bothered reporting cash-only income, it’s because I had to prove I had a job of some sort to keep getting the food stamps that were keeping us fed. And, oh yes, I’m an honest person but some people don’t seem to believe that explanation but they’ll accept the first. (Truth is both were a factor in my honesty). > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I am not sure it is easy to manage to live as a poor person without a bank account in the US. It’s not, but it is possible. It’s not that easy to live as a poor person _with_ a bank account, either. > [@md-2000](#): > > I find it hard to believe someone could live paycheque to paycheque on $3500 a week and not accumulate anything close to $5000 unless your expenses included powdered products. Something is not right. Yeah, that’s suspicious. I have some reason to believe that some of the customers of my store have very high incomes but no bank account and live cash-only lifestyles via sketchy “jobs”, but as long as they’re not breaking the law in our store it’s don’t ask don’t tell (even criminals have to eat, right?). A Speaker of the House living cash-only strikes me as…very very odd. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/53 "2023-11-04T11:02:57Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > The Congressional reporting requirement includes non-blind trusts. If the checking account is titled Johnson Family Trust, that’s just as reportable as if titled joint tenants, or in the spouse’s name, or a child’s name. I thought whether a trust was blind or non-blind had to do with who controls and has knowledge of the investments, not the name of the trust. The conflict of interest isn’t created by the name of the trust - it’s created by who controls the investments of the trust. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/54 "2023-11-04T12:03:57Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > I thought whether a trust was blind or non-blind had to do with who controls and has knowledge of the investments, not the name of the trust. This is true. And there is no blind trust here. It would have been announced by now. ---
**Author:** ![md-2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@md-2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md-2000)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/55 "2023-11-04T12:29:46Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > > [@md-2000](#): > > > > But seriously, this guy has no savings or investments? > > The area of the board here is Factual Questions. > > We have no factual information on that. > > It’s a fact that the vast majority of members of congress have many more entries in their financial disclosures than Mike Johnson does. I was just pointing out that people who make $200K-plus per year in a job that could disappear any other year, probably would be doing what Suzie Ormand would suggest, and have at least 6 months’ of emergency savings, not to mention some provision for old age. (But then, he probably wouldn’t listen to Suzie) Politics aside, from what little we see, he does not strike me as the type who blows his money on fancy clothes and cars before he even gets it… Particularly since he seems focussed on eigning in spending of the federal government. Anyway, does the disclosure form also require disclosure of serious debts, if an excessive lifestyle were the case for a member? (Isn’t an undisclosed loan one thing Clarence Thomas is being criticised for?) I would imagine loans as much as the stocks one owns are an important factor for disclosure wrt conflicts of interest. As for the size of the form, I would hope most of those details a member can leave to the personal assistants, which congress thoughtfully pays for. Anyone who owns a couple hundred thousand in specific stocks, probably also has an accountant to help with the forms. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/56 "2023-11-04T13:03:38Z")
Seems to be two intertwined convos here: “How can ordinary folks operate with no bank account?” And “How could a congressman operate with no bank account?” As many have said, it’s easy enough (although expensive) to do that as a low-end laborer in rented accommodations. The more money you make or have, the harder it is to live the life appropriate to your station while still unbanked, but also the less necessary it is unless you’re a real fraudster the banking industry is already wise to. As to the latter, there are two explanations. Lying by omission on the disclosure form, or careful use of trusts plus careful rules lawyering that trusts don’t need to be reported. I can certainly imagine an ethical disclosure rule created by Congress to police Congress has lots of built-in ways to legally evade the intent. It was intended as virtue signalling far more than it was intended as actual anti-corruption Augean stable hoeing out. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/57 "2023-11-04T13:04:58Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > FWIW my employer will not pay in cash…will the IRS even allow that?. Check or direct deposit is it. I had a part time employee who didn’t have a bank account. On pay day I’d give her a paycheck, she’d endorse it, then I’d give her cash in exchange for the check. I’d deposit the check later that day. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/58 "2023-11-04T13:40:51Z")
How did you know the check was good? 😀 ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/59 "2023-11-04T13:44:30Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > Anyway, does the disclosure form also require disclosure of serious debts, if an excessive lifestyle were the case for a member? Yes. Here is the [most recent annual disclosure.](https://disclosures-clerk.house.gov/public_disc/financial-pdfs/2022/10055641.pdf) Rep. Johnson shows three loans and no assets. Not showing equity in the family house is I think allowed, but someone else may want to check. Not showing a non-interest-bearing checking account is allowed, but other members include them. After all, the bank or credit union could start paying interest tomorrow. Having no reportable assets is factually possible but just doesn’t seem likely. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2023, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545/60 "2023-11-04T14:25:27Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > As many have said, it’s easy enough (although expensive) to do that as a low-end laborer in rented accommodations. A great many people have found that for them this is less expensive than having a checking account. They are not careful to keep track of how much money they still have in their account or misjudge when a deposit will arrive and end up with multiple $30 or so insufficient funds fees. A similar situation happens with credit cards. For some the availability of credit cards has no bearing on how much they spend; they pay the statement balance in full every month and they get a cashback or rewards for their expenditures. For others they perpetually carry a several thousand dollar balance at high interest rates and sometimes miss paying the minimum payment and get $30 or so late fees. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-possible-to-live-in-the-us-without-a-bank-account/992545.md?page=4)