# Is it racist to use the term 'Master Bedroom' **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 21, 2022, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613 "2022-10-21T22:47:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2022, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/121 "2022-10-22T22:19:17Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > If my mother moves into the house that my husband and I own and have paid for , calling it the “master bedroom” makes just as much sense as it did when my kids were school-aged. Right. And the room(s) she occupies is often referred to as an “in-law” suite or similar in real estate terms. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2022, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/122 "2022-10-22T22:34:16Z")
> [@Paul\_was\_in\_Saudi](#): > > > [@puzzlegal](#): > > > > There’s a common notion that somehow doing X prevents people from doing Y. > > Among poor leaders, it is common to try to do everything at once. Please decide on your priorities, boss. > > More to the point, silly language-police actions drive off those who might otherwise try to do the important stuff. How often have you seen a worker give up on a project because of side issues? A wise leader knows when adding a side project is too much, and when cleaning up the process actually streamlines things. Eliminating terms like “master bedroom” are the latter. It takes trivial effort, and helps everyone think in less hierarchical ways. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_was\_in\_Saudi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b77776/32.png) [@Paul\_was\_in\_Saudi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_was_in_Saudi)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2022, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/123 "2022-10-22T22:41:21Z")
I suspect, like the Pronoun People, they will drive away our friends. A Will to Rule requires setting priorities. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2022, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/124 "2022-10-22T23:24:58Z")
**Warning** for [Paul\_was\_in\_Saudi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_was_in_Saudi). This appears to be off-topic and an attempt to hijack the thread with the “Will to Rule” bit. Further the use of “Pronoun People” is trivializing people who prefer pronouns other than the standard male=he/females=she. All in all a jerkish a post in several ways. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2022, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/125 "2022-10-22T23:38:39Z")
> [@Paul\_was\_in\_Saudi](#): > > How often have you seen a worker give up on a project because of side issues? Not nearly as often as I have seen projects crash and burn because dickheads think that usability issues are irrelevant “non-functional” requirements and they ship systems and products that are unusable by human beings. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2022, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/126 "2022-10-22T23:40:44Z")
> [@Yookeroo](#): > > They couldn’t be more annoying that someone saying “Asiated”. It’s been a few decades since “Asian” became the preferred term. This was discussed in a previous thread, but “Asian” is not really an acceptable term, nor is “Oriental”, when referring to _people,_ because many have an identity like Chinese, Indian, Persian, or Israeli, and do not really appreciate what being all lumped together implies. (And if they eschew national or ethnic identities, they still want to be human beings rather than the “other”.) On the “master” side, a relatively recent _Star Trek_ episode had someone called Mistress of the Winter Constellations, which was supposed to be funny but also shows the word is not taboo. All this is running far afield, though. Maybe the OP has the professional latitude to stick it to Sears and choose his own terminology. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/127 "2022-10-23T00:00:42Z")
What about Yoda, or Obi-Wan Kenobi? Do we still refer to them as Jedi Masters? ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/128 "2022-10-23T00:14:57Z")
Yes, in two ways. Because their students submit to their instruction and because they have mastered the discipline. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/129 "2022-10-23T01:10:51Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > LOL. I don’t think I was “implying”. I’m not sure what’s funny. However, I am talking about the implications generally created by a term like “master bedroom,” not that I was accusing you specifically of implying something. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/130 "2022-10-23T01:42:30Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > I was sweating bullets looking for that catalog page. I just have to go on record admiring your finding it! ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/131 "2022-10-23T02:08:15Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > > [@TriPolar](#): > > > > And as usual the world is in no way a better place from banning words while actual offensive behavior is unchanged. > > I think you’re right, especially as the sort of people who react to such a banning by saying “oh gosh, I’m sorry, I will adjust my behaviours to avoid it” were probably never the troublemakers in the first place. We can see where the trouble comes from by looking at the OP. Seemingly out of nowhere the term 'Master Bedroom ’ is called racist. It’s never long before someone will say the words and then be called a racist. That’s an unfortunate part of human nature, some people don’t understand the difference between symbols and what they represent. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/132 "2022-10-23T03:55:25Z")
Me, too. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/133 "2022-10-23T04:03:26Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Seemingly out of nowhere the term 'Master Bedroom ’ is called racist. “Seemingly” meaning of course that _you_ had been unaware. The linguistic shift though [began about a decade ago.](https://www.bizjournals.com/washington/blog/2013/04/in-residential-real-estate-bid.html) It has spread more over the last few years, not only in the states but [also in the UK](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8488879/amp/Estate-agents-banned-saying-master-bedroom-allusions-sexism-slavery.html) by two years ago. No question that usage seems to vary by specific market. A poster somewhere above did the legwork googling more master in red regions and more primary in blue. I do not think it is yet at the point that using the term will have one labeled racist. More likely in some circles thought of as … quaint to a bit clueless. Like the person who still says they’re their dog’s master or refers to boys as young master so and so. The aunt who kept saying Negro without intending any offense because that was the accepted word for most of her long life. And was very confused that colored wasn’t okay now when there was a National Association of Colored People still. We all knew she wasn’t racist. Just slow to adjust. > [@TriPolar](#): > > some people don’t understand the difference between symbols and what they represent. We’ll count me among them? It doesn’t really apply here, where the meaning is in flux, but if someone is using a symbol with knowledge of what it represents to others then that is expressing what the symbol represents. Yes a burning cross is just wood on fire. Just a symbol. The act of using the symbol will be correctly interpreted as being what it represents. You think that is incorrect? ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/134 "2022-10-23T04:15:37Z")
> [@Yookeroo](#): > > Easier than the performative outrage of complaining publicly about having to make that substitution. There are performative assholes on both sides. There are people who do performative offense (at hearing a word long in use) and people who do performative outrage (at having to change words long in use). Who is the asshole and who has a point on any particular word depends on how tenuous the connection is from the word to the claimed offense. In the particular case of “master bedroom”, any offense taken is stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/135 "2022-10-23T04:21:33Z")
Although I do not find it offensive, I can understand how some may feel it endorses traditional relationships and the paterfamilias idea. Many societies are still paternalistic. I don’t find masters degrees offensive, nor golf tournaments. Nor Masters of Space and Time nor master debaters (in the privacy of their own home, perhaps the bedroom?). But any alternatives for “master bedroom” should be reasonable. There are many such terms. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/136 "2022-10-23T07:51:04Z")
> [@Polerius](#): > > In the particular case of “master bedroom”, any offense taken is stupid. I think even in the case of IDE disk drives where there could be ‘master’ and ‘slave’ drives, it’s pretty weird to want the terminology banned (it was a pretty apt term - the ‘slave’ drive is subservient to, controlled by and in a sense ‘owned by’ the ‘master’ drive). Slavery is a terrible historical fact. Deleting the word doesn’t make history go away (although it might make it slightly easier for people to forget the history, which is a bad thing). Slavery is a current problem in the world. Deleting the word (or ringfencing it for the literal use alone) doesn’t free slaves. ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/137 "2022-10-23T12:49:56Z")
Of course it would be much better to be talking about, learning about, and re-examining our history of slavery. We could spend real time in the history classes in our schools delving into this important and difficult subject. We could reflect and attempt to understand how this past reverberates in all of our lives today. But when we choose not to do that, we should not be surprised when parts of this past that we wish to bury instead resurface in unexpected and inconvenient ways. ---
**Author:** ![Napier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce73a5/32.png) [@Napier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Napier)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/138 "2022-10-23T13:24:22Z")
I can imagine terms like this having a racist association and don’t mind trying to learn a bit of new usage to avoid bringing that association up when there’s no need to bring it up. It’s not necessary that this be the top priority, or originate in sincerely held beliefs, or have racist origins in the word usage originally. I don’t assume racist intent just because somebody uses the term, though having a racist impact makes a thing racist whether or not there was racist intent per se. For many of us this is a small thing, but an easy accommodation to make. English has a vocabulary of about a million words (if we include technical terms), which I think is a record among languages. Can’t we allow a bit of evolution in their use, especially considering the horrific racist history we have in most of the English speaking world? Do we really expect growing away from that history to be neat, tidy, and easy? ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/139 "2022-10-23T13:56:10Z")
In actual fact (in case anyone is interested in facts anymore), a house used to have several “master bedrooms”. And several “servant bedrooms”. Because this was 1821, a time when having _only one_ servant was perceived as crushing, degrading poverty. (Don’t believe me? Read _Mansfield Park_—or _Little Women_.) Oh, and this was in England, so the servants in question were free, just as in _Cavalcade,_ _Upstairs Downstairs,_ or _Downton Abbey._ ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2022, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613/140 "2022-10-23T13:57:51Z")
Should we even be labelling it as a “bedroom”. Other shit could go in there rather than a bed. Or maybe nothing. Can’t a room just be a room? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-racist-to-use-the-term-master-bedroom/973613.md?page=8)