# Is it time to bring the Fairness Doctrine back? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 2, 2011, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236 "2011-03-02T17:46:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/61 "2011-03-02T20:18:30Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The fairness doctrine is based on a few people chosen to vote on the content of a radio station. We already have a system like that in place. It’s done through an audience rating system. The public chooses what it wants to listen to and not a couple of people. Post #37. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/62 "2011-03-02T20:24:21Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > I don’t see how that system is workable in other media. There’s no simple way in the wide world to separate fact from fiction. How true to does a news story have to be? Must every sentence be true when considered in isolation? Must the story as whole avoid giving the wrong impression? What about omissions? > > And there’s no fair way to review how well all news stories. Do we really want to give each story its own review panel to judge it, like is done in scientific journals? Or a fixed panel that reviews many stories? Or simply depend on public complaints, so that whichever side can marshal the most supporters dominants what is considered “fair and balanced”? Well…a minute with Google and… > [@](#): > > Fox News’ Sean Hannity apologized last night for using footage of a much bigger 9/12 rally during a segment about Rep. Michele Bachmann’s tea party rally at the Capitol last week – apparently in an attempt to make the tea party look much bigger than it actually was. > > SOURCE: [http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/cold-day-in-hell-fox-news-sean-hannity-apologizes-to-jon-stewart.php](http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/cold-day-in-hell-fox-news-sean-hannity-apologizes-to-jon-stewart.php) > Yesterday, Fox News aired footage from the 2008 campaign trail during a segment about the crowds to see Sarah Palin on her book tour – just a week after Fox’s Sean Hannity was forced to apologize to Jon Stewart for a similar faux pas. > > SOURCE: [http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/fox-explains-wrong-video-in-palin-segment-it-was-a-mistake.php](http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/fox-explains-wrong-video-in-palin-segment-it-was-a-mistake.php) > During an interview with Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas) on Feb. 15, Fox News correspondent Bill Hemmer jokes with the Congressman about the crowd’s > reaction to the announcement that he won the 2011 CPAC straw poll. However, the video played was from the 2010 poll; in it you could hear crowd members booing Rep. Paul. In the 2011 video, the announcement receives a mix of both positive and negative responses to the announcement. However, supporters of Rep. Paul quickly posted proof of what they refer to as Fox News’ deception. Fox admits that they made a mistake with the video and intend to issue a correction to the report. > > SOURCE: [http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/7764132/fox\_shows\_wrong\_cpac\_video\_during\_ron.html?cat=9](http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/7764132/fox_shows_wrong_cpac_video_during_ron.html?cat=9) Seeing a trend? ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/63 "2011-03-02T20:26:57Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Seeing a trend? A trend of three articles about a news source **not affected by the Fairness Doctrine**. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/64 "2011-03-02T20:30:51Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Allowing outright falsehoods in the broadcast news media is important to us how? Generally, the FCC already disallows outright falsehoods. See these factsheets: [http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/journalism.html](http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/journalism.html) [http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/falsebroadcast.html](http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/falsebroadcast.html) but if you go much beyond that in terms of regulation, you’re running into a first amendment thing. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/65 "2011-03-02T20:32:10Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > Generally, the FCC already disallows outright falsehoods. See these factsheets: > > [http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/journalism.html](http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/journalism.html) > [http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/falsebroadcast.html](http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/falsebroadcast.html) > > but if you go much beyond that in terms of regulation, you’re running into a first amendment thing. Are there examples of these regulations being enforced? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/66 "2011-03-02T20:34:48Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > If this is a gateway to government censorship then it should not be hard to show it. I am not sure how easy it is to demonstrate a chilling effect. Doubly so in Canada, which has a much stronger public broadcasting system in the first place. > [@](#): > > The ill effects of the lies media are manifest. I cited two polls above where a substantial portion of the public are misinformed. Not on a matter of opinion but literally believing the opposite of what is true. The press hasn’t taken the Birthers seriously in years, and most media outlets never took them seriously. The truth about that story has been out there for a very long time. The reason their numbers have increased is not because there’s a lack of equitable, balanced, and honest coverage: the coverage is honest but not balanced or equitable because their views have been proved to be false. (Which means the doctrine might present a problem.) Their poll numbers are up because their activities were covered so extensively, and because of pure partisanship. It’s pretty much the same with the death panels story, with the added complication that the Democrats failed to answer the bell until the story turned into a big problem for them. > [@](#): > > Allowing outright falsehoods in the broadcast news media is important to us how? Because lying means speech that is more free and therefor ok? Because I don’t trust a panel of five political hacks to be impartial arbiters of who is lying and who is providing fair news coverage. The fact that you’re willing to expand this beyond individual reports and into things like “patterns of dishonesty” does not help. > [@](#): > > Because you cannot trust the government That’s pretty much what the First Amendment is about. It’s not 1987. There are more media outlets than ever, which is likely to make your plan either useless or an enormous expansion of the FCC (into cable, satellite and online media) that nobody is likely to support. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/67 "2011-03-02T20:35:01Z")
> [@villa](#): > > A trend of three articles about a news source **not affected by the Fairness Doctrine**. I also mentioned Canada’s law against lying. If the Fairness Doctrine does not cover this I would explicitly want a rule against lying added to it. Its what I have been on about for most of this thread. As to a trend do you really want me to get a laundry list of FOX lies and post them here? There are abundant sources for this all over the place. Want it all copied and pasted here? ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/68 "2011-03-02T20:38:27Z")
No, I want you to find me legal support for the concept that the Federal Government is permitted to regulate the content of cable channels in this fashion. And Canadian law, oddly enough, isn’t controlling. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/69 "2011-03-02T20:39:00Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Well…a minute with Google and… > > Seeing a trend? I see a trend of you ignoring my question. No one here is denying Fox News is biased. Please answer: exactly how do you propose enforcing the Fairness Doctrine? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/70 "2011-03-02T20:42:31Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Why does demanding the news media be factual in their reporting count as censorship? The fairness doctrine had nothing to do with the reporting of news. It is aimed at radio broadcast only and that is because the Democratic Party wants to silence Rush Limbaugh for his opinion. He is an entertainer and not a news organization. And you seem to confuse discussion of something like government health care limits (IE death panels) as a [Fox network generated lie](http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504763_162-20027668-10391704.html). If it bothers you that a news group reports on the financial limitations of a government financed health care system that is not a lie. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/71 "2011-03-02T20:43:08Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > As to a trend do you really want me to get a laundry list of FOX lies and post them here? We know Fox News (not the same as Fox) is full of crap. Do you think an FCC lead by Michael Powell and two of his closest cronies would have suspended their license or fined them? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/72 "2011-03-02T20:47:12Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > It is aimed at radio broadcast only and that is because the Democratic Party wants to silence Rush Limbaugh for his opinion. Then why didn’t they try to bring it back when they controlled both houses of Congress and the White House? No legislation on the doctrine has been introduced since 2005, and most prominent Democrats indicated they didn’t want to touch the issue. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/73 "2011-03-02T20:47:27Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > For me, the issue requires digging one layer deeper than “all speech should be free”. > > My issue is - what is “equitable and balanced”? Who decides? Is it balanced to give 10 minutes to a KKK member, and 10 minutes to Jesse Jackson? Perhaps. What about 10 minutes to a KKK member, and 10 minutes to a Fillipino cross-dressing pole dancer? Or 10 minutes to Jesse Jackson, and 10 minutes to Linday Lohan? I could go on… > > A big issue to me about our current media environment is the editorial narrowmindedness that pre-selects the 2 sides (and only 2) of any issue. I do not see expanding that editorial decision making to the government to be solving anything. This is an excellent post, particularly the final paragraph. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/74 "2011-03-02T20:48:34Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Then why didn’t they try to bring it back when they controlled both houses of Congress and the White House? No legislation on the doctrine has been introduced since 2005, and most prominent Democrats indicated they didn’t want to touch the issue. They were too busy fighting The War On Christmas. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/75 "2011-03-02T20:52:47Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > There are more media outlets than ever, which is likely to make your plan either useless or an enormous expansion of the FCC (into cable, satellite and online media) that nobody is likely to support. You realize that most media companies are owned by one of six companies don’t you? ``` * AOL Time Warner * Disney * General Electric * News Corporation * Viacom * Vivendi Universal ``` ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/76 "2011-03-02T20:55:02Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > You realize that most media companies are owned by one of six companies don’t you? > > ``` > * AOL Time Warner > * Disney > * General Electric > * News Corporation > * Viacom > * Vivendi Universal > > ``` I don’t see a problem, as long as half of these corporations lean to the left. Which ones would those be? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/77 "2011-03-02T20:56:05Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > This is an excellent post, particularly the final paragraph. **sigh** I’ll repeat… The Fairness Doctrine _is not_ the Equal Time rule. They are different things. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/78 "2011-03-02T20:56:36Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Are there examples of these regulations being enforced? I don’t think it’s often enforced, because the standard is pretty high. I see one case of something being endorsed in 1991, where radio station KSHE was fined $25,000 after one of their on air hosts played the Emergency Broadcast System siren and a fake civil defense notice that the country was under nuclear attack (although I think the $25,000 fine was specifically for false use of the EBS siren, and then in the same year, WALE being formally warned after they reported, as a hoax, that their overnight guy had been shot in the head and killed. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/79 "2011-03-02T20:58:39Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > You realize that most media companies are owned by one of six companies don’t you? Yes, I realize that extremely well publicized and elementary point. I also realize it doesn’t respond to what I said: the FCC doesn’t regulate satellite TV, blogs, podcasts, Twitter and Facebook. (You might remember that a politician started the whole death panel thing on a social networking site.) Unless you want it to do that, there are a ton of media outlets that will not be affected at all by your new Fairness Doctrine. Fewer people watch the broadcast networks than ever. That includes the evening news. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236/80 "2011-03-02T21:04:24Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Yes, I realize that extremely well publicized and elementary point. I also realize it doesn’t respond to what I said: the FCC doesn’t regulate satellite TV, blogs, podcasts, Twitter and Facebook. (You might remember that a politician started the whole death panel thing on a social networking site.) Unless you want it to do that, there are a ton of media outlets that will not be affected at all by your new Fairness Doctrine. Fewer people watch the broadcast networks than ever. That includes the evening news. Then I propose a rule/law that covers news media that ends up on a TV whether it get there via cable or satellite or broadcast. Again, Canada apparently does it without much trouble and they seem a pretty free people to me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-time-to-bring-the-fairness-doctrine-back/573236.md?page=5)