# Is it too early to say Romney has lost? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 18, 2012, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066 "2012-09-18T13:26:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/342 "2012-09-30T17:31:23Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Examples? - says he was born in Hawaii - claims not to be a socialist - denies that he’s going to put his detractors in FEMA concentration camps - won’t reveal that the media is all paid off by him to only report good things - will not admit that he is single handedly responsible for destroying the economy - killed a man in Reno just to watch him die - is hiding the fact he’s actually the illigitimate son of Fidel Castro ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/343 "2012-09-30T19:48:57Z")
Obama and Romney both get fact checked frequently. It’s just that, Obama’s results come out as being way more truthful than Romney. There are two possibilities. Romney is way more dishonest than Obama, or the fact checkers have all conspired together to make Romney look bad. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/344 "2012-09-30T20:37:30Z")
> [@Face\_Intentionally\_Left\_Blank](#): > > Well played. Well played indeed. 😃 > [@adaher](#): > > …It’s as good a strategy as any. I hope it works for him. The media sure isn’t going after Obama for lying the way they go after Romney. The media has a liberal bias… > [@adaher](#): > > Contempt for fact checkers, not fact checking. Fact checkers have a liberal bias. > [@adaher](#): > > Obama is a serial liar. The media just chooses to portray him a lot better than he is. At least SNL seems to get it these days. They ripped Obama last night. The media (other than SNL or any other outfit that criticizes liberals (see foxnews)) has a liberal bias. > [@drewtwo99](#): > > Obama and Romney both get fact checked frequently. It’s just that, Obama’s results come out as being way more truthful than Romney. > > There are two possibilities. Romney is way more dishonest than Obama, or the fact checkers have all conspired together to make Romney look bad. They are replaying old debates on CSPAN and is amazing. Republicans have been accusing anyone who disagrees with them or undercuts their premises of having a liberal bias. It wasn’t just the media, it was economists, the CBO, scientists, I mean it was how they explained away expert opinions by accusing them of being in the tank for the other side. Its been working pretty well so far, if I were them, I’d keep doing it and count on the ignorance of the masses. > [@Pashnish\_Ewing](#): > > Plus if the general gets out of hand, Obama’s coattails could grow enough to counter the down-ticket money bomb effect. If I started getting emails from Obama asking me to donate $5 or $10 to particular congressional or senate races, I’d click the OK button as loong as I didn’t get more than a couple of them a day. Remember, my $10 microdonation to some congressman in Texas is worth about $50 Carl Rove SuperPAC dollars. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/345 "2012-09-30T20:48:59Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Contempt for fact checkers, not fact checking. You are getting desperate, aren’t you? Polls bad, it is bias. Romney is caught lying, it is the fact checkers. Remember, Romney couldn’t even knock out the collection of clowns and boobs he ran against in the primaries. No chance he’s going to do it here. Obama has two simple zingers: where are the tax returns, and which loopholes does he propose to close to make his tax plan work? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/346 "2012-09-30T21:24:07Z")
It’s still a close race. Romney is an objectively strong debater – though when taken outside of his talking points, he improvises in weird ways. That’s not because he’s conservative, it’s just the way he is. Sort of like Joe Biden, except with greater background intelligence. I expect Romney to give 3 solid performances. He also has to force Obama into a bad error, without looking like a total fool. Attacking Obama for inaccuracies is a solid Rovian move – it’s bogus on a factual basis, but it could work. If Romney can’t perform up to expectation, it will be a total humiliation for the Republican Party and their supporters. This concerns me. I express my commiseration to **adaher** in advance. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/347 "2012-09-30T21:36:06Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Its been working pretty well so far, if I were them, I’d keep doing it and count on the ignorance of the masses. I 100% agree. Let the republicans continue to shout liberal bias at everyone who disagrees with them, but at the same time, I want to see the media stop being so careful to not offend them. It seems like in recent times the media has developed some sort of a disease where they feel they must not be perceived as biased, so they don’t stand up to republican bullshit like they should. They always try to present a balanced approach to issues, even when a balanced approach is not appropriate. I think the old classic example is, if a republican claimed the moon were made of cheese, the mainstream media would report it as, “Consensus not yet reached on composition of lunar surface and substrata” when they should be reporting it as, “Batshit insane politician claims that moon is made of mother-fucking cheese” ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/348 "2012-09-30T22:26:32Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Obama is a serial liar. The media just chooses to portray him a lot better than he is. At least SNL seems to get it these days. They ripped Obama last night. You do realize that last night’s SNL was a repeat from last season, right? So if they ripped Obama last night, it was actually in May (5/19 to be precise) when that ripping took place. This is just the break the McCain campaign has been waiting for!!! ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/349 "2012-09-30T22:31:51Z")
**Adaher** - Your buddy **OMG** hasn’t posted here in four whole days. Perhaps he’s finally given up. It might be time for you to follow his lead. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/350 "2012-09-30T22:39:46Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > You do realize that last night’s SNL was a repeat from last season, right? So if they ripped Obama last night, it was actually in May (5/19 to be precise) when that ripping took place. > > This is just the break the McCain campaign has been waiting for!!! I think that he means [Thursday’s](http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/weekend-update-thursday-sept-27/1418963/) show. They do these through the election season. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/351 "2012-09-30T22:42:38Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > - is hiding the fact he’s actually the illigitimate son of Fidel Castro No, no, [different](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=667174) [Communist.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=652186) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/352 "2012-09-30T22:44:00Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > Obama and Romney both get fact checked frequently. It’s just that, Obama’s results come out as being way more truthful than Romney. > > There are two possibilities. Romney is way more dishonest than Obama, or the fact checkers have all conspired together to make Romney look bad. And the RW is already going with the latter narrative. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/353 "2012-09-30T23:10:43Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > According to rumors, Romney’s goal isn’t to make Obama look like an idiot, but like a liar. He intends to be a fact checker to everything Obama says. > [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > As long as we’re allowing rumors to substitute for reality, the [NYTimes](http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/29/us/politics/cramming-and-pruning-for-first-presidential-debate.html?_r=1) is reporting that Romney is going to rely on one-liners - zingers. So Romney is going to “Fact check” Obama in between reading from “The GOP’s Great Joke Book”? Sounds as though the Romney debate plan is to do anything except discuss the Romney governing plan. ---
**Author:** ![Catballou](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Catballou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catballou)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/354 "2012-10-01T00:12:21Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > I 100% agree. Let the republicans continue to shout liberal bias at everyone who disagrees with them, but at the same time, I want to see the media stop being so careful to not offend them. It seems like in recent times the media has developed some sort of a disease where they feel they must not be perceived as biased, so they don’t stand up to republican bullshit like they should. They always try to present a balanced approach to issues, even when a balanced approach is not appropriate. > > I think the old classic example is, if a republican claimed the moon were made of cheese, the mainstream media would report it as, “Consensus not yet reached on composition of lunar surface and substrata” when they should be reporting it as, “Batshit insane politician claims that moon is made of mother-fucking cheese” lmao ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/355 "2012-10-01T01:09:55Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > I think that he means [Thursday’s](http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/weekend-update-thursday-sept-27/1418963/) show. They do these through the election season. Wait – I watched that show. They went after Obama because the unemployment rate is still high. While that may be a legitimate criticism of his administration, it has nothing to do with him being a liar. He has repeatedly talked about the problem of the high unemployment rate. I too would be interested in hearing some of these lies that Obama has told (not campaign promises that he failed to fulfill, but actual untruthful statements that he has made). ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/356 "2012-10-01T01:34:49Z")
Romney now behind Obama by nine points in Ohio: [Ohio Presidential Polls: Obama Leads Romney By 9 Points, Columbus Dispatch Poll Finds | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/30/ohio-presidential-polls_n_1927109.html) ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/357 "2012-10-01T01:52:21Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > I 100% agree. Let the republicans continue to shout liberal bias at everyone who disagrees with them, but at the same time, I want to see the media stop being so careful to not offend them. It seems like in recent times the media has developed some sort of a disease where they feel they must not be perceived as biased, so they don’t stand up to republican bullshit like they should. They always try to present a balanced approach to issues, even when a balanced approach is not appropriate. > > I think the old classic example is, if a republican claimed the moon were made of cheese, the mainstream media would report it as, “Consensus not yet reached on composition of lunar surface and substrata” when they should be reporting it as, “Batshit insane politician claims that moon is made of mother-fucking cheese” Claiming liberal bias serves multiple functions: It works the refs. As you point out, the media has been reluctant to present right wing quackery as right wing quackery for fear of being called biased. It adds additional weight to any objective facts that work in their favor. For example, the CBO is widely respected and non-partisan but the right has been claiming that it is liberal because it keeps insisting that tax cuts result in decreased revenue. So when the CBO comes out with a report that they like (increasing taxes during a recession is bad), they say “See, even the CBO thinks this is a bad idea” And most importantly it gives you permission to ignore any facts that don’t comport with your views. > [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Romney now behind Obama by nine points in Ohio: [Ohio Presidential Polls: Obama Leads Romney By 9 Points, Columbus Dispatch Poll Finds | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/30/ohio-presidential-polls_n_1927109.html) If they can get Virginia into the leans Obama column, it will be time to start donating to down-ticket candidates. ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/358 "2012-10-01T10:38:20Z")
Here is a ringing Romney endorsement: > **[Mitt: Ruling-class hero](https://www.salon.com/2012/09/28/mitt_ruling_class_hero/)** > > Bill Marriott saw Mitt drowning and threw him an anchor "Both Mitt and I have summer places up in New Hampshire on Lake Winnipesaukee. And a few summers ago I was taking my grandchildren and children to town in the boat for ice cream. And we got into the docks and they were all full and I looked around, there was no place to park, so we stopped at the end of a dock. They all jumped off and ran up the dock. And I realized there was nobody in the boat to help me dock the boat, handle the ropes, do anything – they just left me out there at sea. So I finally found a place to park after about 20 minutes, and I pulled in, I said, ‘Who’s going to grab the rope?,’ and I looked up and there was Mitt Romney. So he pulled me in, he tied up the boat for me. He rescued me just as he’s going to rescue this great country.’ " Marriott International Chairman Bill Marriott. Oh, the horror! Could you only imagine this man’s distress to be ‘at sea’ with only dozens or perhaps hundreds of people around to help him? What if he were out there long enough to get a sunburn? What if he began to sweat and soiled his shirt? Who would help him, then, I ask? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/359 "2012-10-01T10:44:34Z")
> [@Ca3799](#): > > Here is a ringing Romney endorsement: > > [http://www.salon.com/2012/09/28/mitt\_ruling\_class\_hero/](http://www.salon.com/2012/09/28/mitt_ruling_class_hero/) > > "‘Who’s going to grab the rope?,’ and I looked up and there was Mitt Romney. So he pulled me in, he tied up the boat for me. He rescued me just as he’s going to rescue this great country.’ " I’m assuming Mittens was limned in a shining light and a choir of angels provided background music? Because that’s what I’m hearing. What a guy. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/360 "2012-10-01T11:04:00Z")
> [@Ca3799](#): > > Here is a ringing Romney endorsement: > > [http://www.salon.com/2012/09/28/mitt\_ruling\_class\_hero/](http://www.salon.com/2012/09/28/mitt_ruling_class_hero/) > > "Both Mitt and I have summer places up in New Hampshire on Lake Winnipesaukee. And a few summers ago I was taking my grandchildren and children to town in the boat for ice cream. And we got into the docks and they were all full and I looked around, there was no place to park, so we stopped at the end of a dock. They all jumped off and ran up the dock. And I realized there was nobody in the boat to help me dock the boat, handle the ropes, do anything – they just left me out there at sea. So I finally found a place to park after about 20 minutes, and I pulled in, I said, ‘Who’s going to grab the rope?,’ and I looked up and there was Mitt Romney. So he pulled me in, he tied up the boat for me. He rescued me just as he’s going to rescue this great country.’ " > Marriott International Chairman Bill Marriott. > > Oh, the horror! Could you only imagine this man’s distress to be ‘at sea’ with only dozens or perhaps hundreds of people around to help him? What if he were out there long enough to get a sunburn? What if he began to sweat and soiled his shirt? Who would help him, then, I ask? Wait - why is he looking for a (literal) handout? Isn’t he one of the great self-made men of this country? He’s supposed to be self-reliant. If he can’t manage his boat properly, let him drift. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2012, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066/361 "2012-10-01T12:00:47Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > I’m assuming Mittens was limned in a shining light and a choir of angels provided background music? Because that’s what I’m hearing. > > What a guy. Makes you cry. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-early-to-say-romney-has-lost/635066.md?page=19)