# Is it too late for America to Save Itself?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-late-for-america-to-save-itself/1000023
**Category:** Politics & Elections
**Created:** [April 8, 2024, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-late-for-america-to-save-itself/1000023 "2024-04-08T21:16:35Z")
**Posts on this page:** 5
**Page:** 4
### Author:  [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2024, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-late-for-america-to-save-itself/1000023/61 "2024-04-11T12:33:51Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#):
>
> So your thesis is that there are military personnel who are active within the body politic and are the ultimate determiners of what represents the best interests of the USA … and you are saying it like it’s a good thing?
>
> Not to mention the 1/6 insurrectionists, Proud Boys, Oathkeepers and similar lifeforms who, if nothing else, consider themselves as “loyal to the United States”.
It’s not quite that sense I was trying to convey. It’s that I think Trump probably did give top military officials illegal orders to support the insurrection, but that they refused. Part of that refusal likely included someone telling Trump that if he tried to proceed with his plan that they would order those under their command to not participate and to stop anyone that did. By that I mean that if Trump ordered, say, ICE or DEA to support the insurrection that the military would stop them from participating. They would have been reacting to Trump’s actions, not being proactive.
ETA. Think about it this way. We know the military didn’t take Trump’s side on 1/6. We know Trump is the type of person who is going to try every dirty trick in the book to get his way. Given that, it seems to me that one of those dirty tricks would have been to order the armed forces to participate in 1/6 on his side. Obviously if that did happen, whoever Trump approached in the military chain of command refused. So the question isn’t so much about the top military brass. It’s about whether or not Trump took that last step to try to use the military as his own personal army.
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### Author:  [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2024, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-late-for-america-to-save-itself/1000023/62 "2024-04-11T12:59:53Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#):
>
> and you are saying it like it’s a good thing?
It’s a bad thing that it was necessary, but a good thing that it happened (assuming that FlikTheBlue’s hypothesis is correct. And it wouldn’t be surprising if it is correct)
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### Author:  [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2024, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-late-for-america-to-save-itself/1000023/63 "2024-04-11T13:32:23Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#):
>
> Well it might seem a good thing if it’s your guys who are wearing white hats, tooled up and doing the shooting.
> Bit of a bummer when it’s theirs.
Yep, if it’s evil all the way down, we’re doomed. At least until the next revolution.
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### Author:  [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2024, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-late-for-america-to-save-itself/1000023/64 "2024-04-11T13:33:39Z")
> [@velomont](#):
>
> It’s a bad thing that it was necessary, but a good thing that it happened (assuming that FlikTheBlue’s hypothesis is correct. And it wouldn’t be surprising if it is correct)
I hate it when someone communicates something in a much clearer and more concise way than I did. Cut it out!
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### Author:  [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2024, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-too-late-for-america-to-save-itself/1000023/65 "2024-04-11T14:00:35Z")
Thank you and greatly appreciated! 😃
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