# Is it "wrong" to prefer untouched girls? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 31, 2003, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740 "2003-08-31T02:52:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/241 "2003-09-01T20:59:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Giggle Gaggle \* > \*\*When I speak of a sure shot, I speak of a woman coming up to a man and offering sex with no stipulations: That she will not demand money, that she will not require a monogamous commitment, that she will not fall in love or intentionally become pregnant or demand marriage or press charges or threaten blackmail, that she will not tell her other partner(s) and lead to a physical, legal or other sort of confrontation, that she will not give him an STD, and a whole bunch of other possible strings. > > I speak of a woman who, even if sex with her poses none of the aforementioned risks or stipulations, will not demand courting, dating, dining, wining, and other expenditures of time, energy and money, before offering sex. > > This is what I mean by a sure shot. \*\* **ROFL!!!** 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Giggle\_Gaggle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c4cdca/32.png) [@Giggle\_Gaggle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giggle_Gaggle)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/242 "2003-09-01T21:07:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jsgoddess \* > **I’ll ask again, since you haven’t come through yet. Cite?** I addressed this pages ago. The success of religious movements that advocate and mostly police premarital female virginity (Judeo-Christian and Islamic faiths) versus the relative failure of religious movements that advocate female hypersexuality (Pagan faiths) proves this. These religions glorify virgin females & offer virgin females as rewards to Heaven-bound men. Even though men would be getting far more sex from women if they bought into hypersexual religions such as Paganism, they still prefer religions that increase their chances of mating with (fewer) virgins. (Technically, one. And then seventy-two more in Islamic Heaven. The issue is vague and open to interpretations of various sects in Christian Heaven.) ---
**Author:** ![Giggle\_Gaggle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c4cdca/32.png) [@Giggle\_Gaggle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giggle_Gaggle)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/243 "2003-09-01T21:11:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by istara \* > \*\ ***ROFL!!!** 😉 \*\* Yes, I’m sure the concept is completely foreign and ridiculous to you in Dubai. In the western world, it’s unusual enough, but happens every once in a blue moon when enough alcohol or youth or desperation is involved. ---
**Author:** ![Bugnorton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bugnorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bugnorton)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/244 "2003-09-01T21:21:13Z")
**Giggle gaggle** , you forgot to add “When the moon is in the seventh house and Jupiter aligns with Mars, then peace will rule the planets and love or a sure shot at sex according to GG will steer the stars”. Or are there yet more circumstances that must converge to reconcile seemingly divergent and mutually exclusive beliefs held to be self evident in the world according to **Giggle**? ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/245 "2003-09-01T21:22:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Giggle Gaggle \* > **I addressed this pages ago. The success of religious movements that advocate and mostly police premarital female virginity (Judeo-Christian and Islamic faiths) versus the relative failure of religious movements that advocate female hypersexuality (Pagan faiths) proves this.** That proves nothing. You have failed to show that there is a positive correlation between the relative popularity of such faiths and the supposed male preference for virgins. > [@](#): > > **Even though men would be getting far more sex from women if they bought into hypersexual religions such as Paganism, they still prefer religions that increase their chances of mating with (fewer) virgins.** You have neglected to address the possibility that there may be a completely different reason that such religions are popular. Notice that almost all of the popular modern religions are monotheistic. Perhaps it is something about monotheism that attracts people, and the whole virgin thing is a coincidence. Similarity does not equal correlation. ---
**Author:** ![TonyJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9c0ed/32.png) [@TonyJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonyJ)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/246 "2003-09-01T21:27:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Giggle Gaggle \* > **The success of religious movements that advocate and mostly police premarital female virginity (Judeo-Christian and Islamic faiths) versus the relative failure of religious movements that advocate female hypersexuality (Pagan faiths) proves this.** Sorry, but that’s almost pure fallacy. ---
**Author:** ![FreeRange\_Maniac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/97f17d/32.png) [@FreeRange\_Maniac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FreeRange_Maniac)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/247 "2003-09-01T21:40:29Z")
That’s a good question, elfbabe. What DOES happen after you find you “untouched” woman and…umm…touch her? Does that automatically make her a “used woman”? ---
**Author:** ![Azael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@Azael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Azael)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/248 "2003-09-01T21:47:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*I addressed this pages ago. The success of religious movements that advocate and mostly police premarital female virginity (Judeo-Christian and Islamic faiths) versus the relative failure of religious movements that advocate female hypersexuality (Pagan faiths) proves this. These religions glorify virgin females & offer virgin females as rewards to Heaven-bound men. \*\* First of all your arguments were debunked several pages ago. What is happening now is more like a chicken running around with it’s head cut off. Secondly, **correlation does not imply causation.** I would figure that anyone who seems to be able to parrot the language of statistics as well as you might be aware of that. Third I would like a cite that any of these religions offer “virgins as rewards to heaven-bound men.” Especially seeing as this is nothing more than a popular Western misconception of Islamic beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![MrO](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/50afbb/32.png) [@MrO](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrO)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/249 "2003-09-01T22:19:48Z")
**GG** , you were beat a long, long time ago in this debate. You’ve ignored direct, pertinent questions, and you’ve been unable to provide cites for the claims you’ve made. You’ve dug yourself so far down in this hole, I expect you to pop up any minute now in the thread about the term “Oriental” being offensive. (Weak joke, I know. See, you dig through the center of the earth, and. . . .) Still, I have to thank you for a good laugh. Your claim that “virgin porn” is expensive to make because each virgin is good for only one shot is just priceless. Do you honestly think that “virgin porn” is produced using exclusively real virgins? Here’s a newsflash: porn actors are _actors_. They might be faking it sometimes. And Arnold is really just a guy with big muscles, not a skin-covered android that came back from the future. Of course this board is made up of statistical anomalies (I suspect that higher-than-average intelligence is pretty common here, with some notable exceptions), and I admit that being outnumbered doesn’t prove you wrong. Carry on, please. Maybe you’ll convince us all. ---
**Author:** ![Giggle\_Gaggle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c4cdca/32.png) [@Giggle\_Gaggle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giggle_Gaggle)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/250 "2003-09-01T22:32:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Azael \* > **Secondly, correlation does not imply causation. I would figure that anyone who seems to be able to parrot the language of statistics as well as you might be aware of that.** Men consistently prefer religions that advocate female virginity over religions that do not. It’s not just a fluke. Christianity and Islam are being adopted at record numbers, the born-again virgin movement and the True Love Waits movements are gaining converts beyond expectations. The facts are not in question. Why do you propose that this is so? ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/251 "2003-09-01T22:33:14Z")
What disturbs me most about **Giggle’s** POV is his way of reducing the amazing vagaries and complexities (and beauty) of human behaviour into some sort of evolutionary determinism (or economic transaction) depending on which behaviour he is attempting to defend. It’s really very sad…imagine how powerless he must feel about living his own life knowing that it has all been set out for him. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/252 "2003-09-01T22:35:39Z")
> [@](#): > > And Arnold is really just a guy with big muscles, not a skin-covered android that came back from the future. Cite? > [@](#): > > It’s really very sad…imagine how powerless he must feel about living his own life knowing that it has all been set out for him. Actually, convincing yourself that everything you want is biologically ordained is comforting. It precludes self-examination and questioning. ---
**Author:** ![MrO](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/50afbb/32.png) [@MrO](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrO)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/253 "2003-09-01T22:41:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by robertliguori \* > **Cite?** Okay, I might be wrong about Arnold. ---
**Author:** ![Azael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@Azael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Azael)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/254 "2003-09-01T22:47:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*Men consistently prefer religions that advocate female virginity over religions that do not. \*\* Am I to seriously understand that men base their spiritual beliefs solely on whether female virginity is advocated? :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > \*\*Christianity and Islam are being adopted at record numbers, the born-again virgin movement and the True Love Waits movements are gaining converts beyond expectations. \*\* And…? You see, it’s still up to you to show what this has to with men prefering virgins. Maybe they like the free crackers and grape juice every Sunday. > [@](#): > > \*\*The facts are not in question. \*\* Many of your “facts” remain in question. Keep dancing buddy. ---
**Author:** ![Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Speaker_for_the_Dead)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/255 "2003-09-01T22:52:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Azael \* > \*\*And…? You see, it’s still up to you to show what this has to with men prefering virgins. Maybe they like the free crackers and grape juice every Sunday. > \*\* That’s why I like being Anglican as a kid! ---
**Author:** ![Giggle\_Gaggle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c4cdca/32.png) [@Giggle\_Gaggle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giggle_Gaggle)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/256 "2003-09-01T22:58:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by kambuckta \* > **It’s really very sad…imagine how powerless he must feel about living his own life knowing that it has all been set out for him.** If you study the [relevant literature,](http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/columns/?article=willpower) you will find that mammals find themselves feeling powerless when they’re _unable_ to predict future events, not when they are _able_ to predict future events. ---
**Author:** ![Azael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@Azael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Azael)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/257 "2003-09-01T23:07:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*If you study the relevant literature, you will find that mammals find themselves feeling powerless when they’re unable to predict future events, not when they are able to predict future events. \*\* Fascinating. Speaking as a mammal, I suppose that being able to predict that the tsunami bearing down on me will leave me no possibility of escape would be quite empowering. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/258 "2003-09-01T23:11:48Z")
Oh, what a wonderfully ‘relevant’ cite…an Encarta tabloidy thing on _willpower_. :rolleyes: Is that where you get your world-information and experience from **Giggle**? May I suggest you broaden your reading bud!! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Azael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@Azael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Azael)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/259 "2003-09-01T23:26:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*Is that where you get your world-information and experience from Giggle? \*\* Nah, given his overall ideology I think it would be safe to say that it comes directly from [Tom Leykis](http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Leykis). ---
**Author:** ![MrO](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/50afbb/32.png) [@MrO](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrO)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2003, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740/260 "2003-09-01T23:27:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Giggle Gaggle \* > \*\*. . . and the True Love Waits movements are gaining converts beyond expectations. \*\* Not familiar with this. Is some kind of Tom Waits fan club? Or maybe it’s an organization for virgins who are saving themselves for that first porn flick. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-it-wrong-to-prefer-untouched-girls/198740.md?page=14)