# Is Latin America Western? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 15, 2011, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428 "2011-04-15T01:29:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![pinguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ac8455/32.png) [@pinguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinguin)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2011, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/1 "2011-04-15T01:29:13Z")
According to Huntington it isn’t. According to most educated Latin Americans, of course it is Western, and I agree with them. So, just to hear your oppinions. Answer at your own risk 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2011, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/2 "2011-04-15T02:12:20Z")
Opinion threads belong in IMHO. Who is Huntington, and why ought I to listen to him? But since you ask in GD, here’s a thesis for debate: "Western nations are those in which the culture is predominantly derived from a European, as opposed to indigenous origin, though with varying degrees of indigenous and other-immigrant influence. This would include lingua franca, cultural institutions, etc. By this definition the Western nations include: 1. The Americas 2. European nations, including Russia and Turkey (which are European in culture though with Asian territory) 3. Australia and New Zealand Many nations are _influenced_ to varying degrees by Western culture, but these are the ones predominantly founded on it. ---
**Author:** ![pinguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ac8455/32.png) [@pinguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinguin)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2011, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/3 "2011-04-15T02:23:36Z")
I agree with your definition. Huntington is Samuel Huntington, author of The Clash of Civilizations. He draw a map puting Latin America outside of his civilization. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2011, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/4 "2011-04-15T02:28:41Z")
[Original article, from Foreign Affairs, 1993](http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/48950/samuel-p-huntington/the-clash-of-civilizations) > [@](#): > > THE NEXT PATTERN OF CONFLICT > > World politics is entering a new phase, and intellectuals have not hesitated to proliferate visions of what it will be-the end of history, the return of traditional rivalries between nation states, and the decline of the nation state from the conflicting pulls of tribalism and globalism, among others. Each of these visions catches aspects of the emerging reality. Yet they all miss a crucial, indeed a central, aspect of what global politics is likely to be in the coming years. > > It is my hypothesis that the fundamental source of conflict in this new world will not be primarily ideological or primarily economic. The great divisions among humankind and the dominating source of conflict will be cultural. Nation states will remain the most powerful actors in world affairs, but the principal conflicts of global politics will occur between nations and groups of different civilizations. The clash of civilizations will dominate global politics. The fault lines between civilizations will be the battle lines of the future. [Commentary on it.](http://www.historyorb.com/world/clashofcivilizations.shtml) > [@](#): > > by James Graham > Published: May, 2004 > > In the post Cold War world few articles have influenced how Western and especially American policymakers view the world more than Samuel P. Huntington’s 1993 article, The Clash of Civilizations. Published in the influential Foreign Affairs journal the article suggested the world was returning to a civilization dominated world where future conflicts would originate from clashes between ‘civilizations’. The theory has been broadly criticised for oversimplification, ignoring indigenous conflicts and for incorrectly predicting what has happened in the decade since its publication. The claim made by many that September the 11th has vindicated Huntington is simply not supported by the evidence. Published while a post Cold War world was searching for a new prism to view international relations through ensured it has however proved influential. > > Huntington’s thesis outlines a future where the “great divisions among humankind and the dominating source of conflict will be cultural” (Huntington 1993:22). He divides the world’s cultures into seven current civilizations, Western, Latin American, Confucian, Japanese, Islamic, Hindu and Slavic-Orthodox (Huntington 1993:26). In addition he judged Africa only as a possible civilization depending on how far one viewed the development of an African consciousness had developed. These civilizations seem to be defined primarily by religion with a number of ad hoc exceptions. Israel is lumped together with the West, Buddhist states and the whole religion is completely ignored. Huntington was one of a number of writers commenting on the fall of the Soviet Union. You might put him as opposite to Frances Fukuyama’s The End of History, which was published as a book in 1992, though based on a 1989 essay. Personally, I prefer Fukuyama, but it took me a while to understand that he was writing philosophy rather than political science. Similarly, Huntington’s case for Latin America not being “Western” can probably be better understood more a matter of theoretical academic divisions than what people use in everyday language. I think there’s a risk whenever people discuss technical distinctions with slippery and never-defined everyday words. There will be heat but no light. ---
**Author:** ![pinguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ac8455/32.png) [@pinguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinguin)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/5 "2011-04-16T01:34:16Z")
Great answers, guys. I agree. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/6 "2011-04-16T01:50:12Z")
As long as Latin America is a third world region with struggling democratic (or not) governments, I’d guess not. That being said, people often call Israel “Western”. :o ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/7 "2011-04-16T02:04:25Z")
Samuel Huntington was a cold warrior trying to cast the new world in terms he understood. His work is useless except as a justification for neoconservative foreign policy. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/8 "2011-04-16T02:09:48Z")
And what’s your solution? Put a McDonald’s in every area of the world? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/9 "2011-04-16T02:13:13Z")
My solution to… what? ---
**Author:** ![pinguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ac8455/32.png) [@pinguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinguin)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/10 "2011-04-16T02:30:57Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > As long as Latin America is a third world region with struggling democratic (or not) governments, I’d guess not. > > That being said, people often call Israel “Western”. :o So, if the U.S. get poorer after the deficit devast it, that country will stop to be Western? We are talking about civilization here, if you didn’t noticed, not about GDP. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/11 "2011-04-16T02:36:27Z")
There’s no such thing as a western civilization. ---
**Author:** ![pinguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ac8455/32.png) [@pinguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinguin)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/12 "2011-04-16T02:42:38Z")
Of course there is Western Civilization=Greek Roman roots + Jewish Christian religious ideas. Some characteristics=originated in Europe, matured during the Middle Ages and spread during the age of Discovery. Languages=Romance and Germanic languages, mainly. Scripts=Latin script. Law=Roman and British common law It is so easy. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/13 "2011-04-16T03:35:56Z")
> [@pinguin](#): > > Of course there is > Western Civilization=Greek Roman roots + Jewish Christian religious ideas. > Some characteristics=originated in Europe, matured during the Middle Ages and spread during the age of Discovery. > Languages=Romance and Germanic languages, mainly. > Scripts=Latin script. > Law=Roman and British common law > > It is so easy. Then Turkey isn’t all that Western, it’s Asiatic. And Europe has Napoleonic civil law. I think you’re accidentally defining Western more narrowly, as “To the East” German nationalists might have: to mean the Anglophone powers. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/14 "2011-04-16T06:13:35Z")
Let’s take some general criteria (criterion?) for being a Western country: \*Allied with other major Western countries \*Western legal systems/democratic governments \*Developed economies \*Some poorly-defined and arbitrary ties to things like TVs, pop culture, and Hollywood > [@pinguin](#): > > So, if the U.S. get poorer after the deficit devast it, that country will stop to be Western? “Third World” is usually applied to countries that are economically underdeveloped and/or not ‘democratic’. A Depression wouldn’t make us a third world country. > [@](#): > > We are talking about civilization here, if you didn’t noticed, not about GDP. Ooh youz is so snarkay snarkay you iz! I didn’t say anything about the GDP, though there does seem to be a correlation. :o We’re not talking about what makes a country _civilized_, we are talking about _civilizations_. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/15 "2011-04-16T06:22:12Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Samuel Huntington was a cold warrior trying to cast the new world in terms he understood. **His work is useless except as a justification for neoconservative foreign policy.** I was just curious if you had any other alternatives to neocon foreign policy. Like a [McWorld](http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B03EEDD123FF93BA35751C1A960958260)? Do you have an idea for a post Cold War foreign relations policy that isn’t _cold warrior-like_ and neocon? And happens to be useful? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/16 "2011-04-16T06:52:19Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Samuel Huntington was a cold warrior trying to cast the new world in terms he understood. His work is useless except as a justification for neoconservative foreign policy. I think you’re really oversimplifying. His work is really the seminal one on military-state relations in the developing world. And in Clash of Civilizations, Huntington rejected the universalism implicit in neoconservativism. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/17 "2011-04-16T08:25:53Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > That being said, people often call Israel “Western”. :o Why the surprise? Insomuch as we’re similar to anyone, we’re most similar to western countries. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/18 "2011-04-16T08:36:50Z")
:eek: is a surprise, and :o is embarrassment, but :o seemed to fit what I was feeling. I’m down with Israel being Western. :o ---
**Author:** ![Blake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@Blake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blake)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/19 "2011-04-16T08:48:57Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Why the surprise? Insomuch as we’re similar to anyone, we’re most similar to western countries. Not really. This is a country that receives vast amounts a foreign aid from the developed world, a country where a large proportion of the population live in third world conditions without adequate access to basics such as medicine, housing or education. A country where a sizable proportion of the population have no representation in government, highly inferior legal rights and so forth. I can’t think of a single western country remotely like that. Israel is more akin to cold-war era South Africa or Burma, insofar some of the population maintains a high standard of living at the expense of the underclass with the assistance of foreign capital. ---
**Author:** ![Sri\_Theo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f04885/32.png) [@Sri\_Theo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sri_Theo)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2011, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428/20 "2011-04-16T09:23:13Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > Not really. This is a country that receives vast amounts a foreign aid from the developed world, a country where a large proportion of the population live in third world conditions without adequate access to basics such as medicine, housing or education. A country where a sizable proportion of the population have no representation in government, highly inferior legal rights and so forth.. So what? At various points in time both the USA and Western Europe were in the same situation - they were still Western? Also South Africa is arguably a Western country as well… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-latin-america-western/578428.md?page=2)