# Is Leetspeak only an English derivative? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 20, 2007, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831 "2007-09-20T02:47:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/1 "2007-09-20T02:47:18Z")
Is Leetspeak only an English derivative, or are there other languages with their own derivatives of Leetspeak? What is the term for Leetspeak derived from other languages if they exist. Please don’t turn this into a Leetspeak mess with your replies. This is for the Leetspeak curious, not the people proficient in Leetspeak. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/2 "2007-09-20T03:42:08Z")
Sadly, it’s not only in English. I encounter that cursed trash on Vietnamese forums also. ---
**Author:** ![jovan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/0ea827/32.png) [@jovan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jovan)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/3 "2007-09-20T03:49:57Z")
There is most definitely Japanese equivalents to leet. The most direct equivalent is known as [_gyaru-moji_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyaru-moji), literally “girl characters”. The name comes from the fact that it is mostly used by teenage girls when they send cell-phone text messages. There is also _kusachuu-go_ (“kusachuu language”) which is similar but used mostly in message boards. Both, like leet, use different characters to approximate similar-looking ones. Also, the intentional use of mistaken kanji (Chinese) characters is common. Leet is also used in French, where, as far as the alphabet is concerned, it works the same way as in English. There are also a great number of French-specific abbreviations that are used alongside English classics such as “lol”. [This entry](http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argot_Internet) (in French) has a list of common expressions. These are the two languages that I read frequently, I’m sure others have their own equivalent. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/4 "2007-09-20T04:50:27Z")
Not precisely leetspeak, but there’s internetspeak in Quebec French, with similar legibility values. ---
**Author:** ![Timchik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@Timchik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timchik)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/5 "2007-09-20T06:13:21Z")
Russian has its own version of [leetspeak](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preved), inspired by a John Lurie watercolor, of all things… It’s both amusing and annoying, but not quite as baffling or childish as leetish. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/6 "2007-09-20T07:42:14Z")
Also Spanish and Korean. It’s not the language, but the technology, and the impetuousness of youth. “Have to chat. But can’t spend .483 second more to type a complete sentence. Have to chat. Have to chat. What did you say? My hair’s on fire? OMG!!!” ---
**Author:** ![WonJohnSoup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f17d59/32.png) [@WonJohnSoup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WonJohnSoup)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/7 "2007-09-20T09:07:32Z")
In the Chinese mainland I’ve seen people use a ton of “numbers-speak.” Like, 88 = ba ba = bye bye. There’re a ton and some of them are near undecipherable to me. I actually saw one hilarious article by an academic rallying against its use because he claimed it would cause a rift between the generations. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/8 "2007-09-20T11:40:13Z")
[QUOTE=guizot] Also Spanish and Korean. It’s not the language, but the technology, and the impetuousness of youth. “Have to chat. But can’t spend .483 second more to type a complete sentence. Have to chat. Have to chat. What did you say? My hair’s on fire? OMG!!!” [/QUOTE] I think you’re confusing chat speak and leetspeak. Not the same deal. Leetspeak is substituting weird, perhaps ‘neat’, spellings for standard English. It’s far quicker for me to type: What the hell are you guys doing? than VVh47 t3h H377 4r3 j00 GuYz C|01nG? The newer chat speak would be more along the lines of: wth u guyz doin? ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/9 "2007-09-20T12:30:33Z")
From the sound of the posts, many languages see it’s use. Some have matured long enough to be called something in that language and many have not. Thanks for the inputs so far people. I don’t think that most people posting in English have ever heard of a term for a different language version. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/10 "2007-09-20T12:43:56Z")
Online Indian English seems to mix English, Hindi, and some kind of hybrid text-speak. E.g. - from an Indian friend’s “wall” in Facebook: > [@](#): > > i thougth sum1 wuld have sorri ..l…india poach gaye btw i was joking i am not married lol my fren got married!!! x 😕 ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/11 "2007-09-20T15:06:12Z")
[QUOTE=WonJohnSoup] some of them are **undecipherable** to me. I actually saw one hilarious article by an academic rallying against its use because he claimed it would cause a rift between the generations. [/QUOTE] What’s so hilarious about it? You just said that it is undecipherable. It could become a real problem. Probably not so real as to cause a “rift between the generations”–but real enough to cause communication problems. And communication problems become social problems. There are teens now who honestly think that the word “u” is in the dictionary. Now, I know that language changes over time, of course. But there are still rules, dammit. Spelling changes are okay. Leet speak is not. And yes,I’m an old fart-- but not so old that I refuse accept logical changes. If the word “you” becomes simplified to “U” (like in Dutch) that could be okay. But when young people can’t write a coherent email which a business colleague can read without having to decipher it–then somebody is going to get fired. And I don’t want it to be me—because some new boss just out of college thinks I can’t read his emails. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/12 "2007-09-20T16:13:28Z")
I actually did a presentation in my Linguistics class on this very topic. As a lot of others have pointed out, there are a ton of other languages that have their own derivative of Leet. Usually the Leetspeak is configured around the keyboard settings of a particular language. I fail to remember a clear example, but the classic !!!1!!!1 formation takes on other forms for other structures of keyboards. I also found a few studies that indicate that there is a correlation between a teen’s grasp of their own language and their frequency of text messaging using Leet. Teens who regularly text messaged using Leetspeak tended to have a firmer grasp of the English language. The proposed explanation for this is that because Leet is a structured, systematic derivative of English, that follows its own constantly evolving grammatical changes with surprising accuracy, it stands to reason that one would have to understand the structure of their own language in order to use it. There was also another study that used Leet in language acquisition exercises. The study found that Chinese-heritage learners of Chinese as a second language learned Chinese faster when they chatted with native Chinese speakers using the anglicized Chinese version of Leet. If you are interested in this topic, I direct you to the fascinating Wiki link [leet.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leet) You will find that the author here attempts to draw a strong connection between the relative efficiency of leet and its use in rapid MMORPGing. The argument tends to be that, like most dialects, leet has evolved systematically and spontaneously to fulfill certain necessary functions that the original standard form of the language could not manage. I remain convinced that it is a valid linguistic phenomenon. IANAL\* \*I am not a linguist. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/13 "2007-09-20T16:16:47Z")
> [@](#): > > There are teens now who honestly think that the word “u” is in the dictionary. It is. It’s defined as “The 21st letter of the alphabet”. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/14 "2007-09-20T16:18:08Z")
Since long before the internets and texting, it has been common to drop the letter “e” in many words. Because the consonants are read with an “e” sound anyways. For example (from the 7up ads, I believe) “obedece” becomes “obdc”. “obdc” cannot be sounded, but if you spell it, it sounds exactly like “obedece” (obey). CVD for “se vende” (for sale) has been around since my parents were kids, for example. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2007, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-leetspeak-only-an-english-derivative/419831/15 "2007-09-20T16:20:30Z")
Well, I might add that the wiki article I linked is a lot different than it was when I did my presentation. It’s still pretty interesting, but it was a lot more so back then.