# Is lying allowed when asked "are you a cop"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 11, 2003, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318 "2003-02-11T07:46:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/41 "2003-02-12T03:39:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by mipiace \* > \*_I think they can’t answert directly but I could easily see a cop coming nup with a lot of bullsh_# that doesn’t directly deny the allegation. Like laughing like a loon and saying “Do I look like a cop? I can’t believe you’s ask taht question. You insult me…blah blah blah” He never outright denied just implied…You’d be surprised how stupid some people are. \*\* An undercover cop can legally look you straight in the face and say “I am not a police officer. I swear to this, so help me God.” Then he can bust you, book you, and you will not be able to use his statement as a defense. Courts have ruled over and over that an undercover cop denying his connection with law enforcement is no grounds at all for the entrapment defense. For a defense of entrapment to be valid, the accused must show that the law enforcement officers actually induced the accused to perform the behavior and the accused was not otherwise previously intending the illegal act. Not intending to do the illegal act if a cop is watching is not the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![Dogface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@Dogface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogface)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/42 "2003-02-12T03:47:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bricker \* > \*\*As an example, the Virginia Court of Appeals found no entrapment in a man who was hailed by two undercover drug officers, shown what appeared to be drugs, and encouraged to buy them, even though the man had not asked about drugs first, because he was predisposed to commit the crime. A conviction will not be barred on grounds of entrapment because the police merely afford an opportunity to commit a crime to one already willing to commit it. \*\* I wonder how often Agency A has arrested an agent of Agency B, when Agency A and Agency B didn’t let each other know that Agency A was running a “sell” sting while Agency B was running a “buy” sting. I know that communication is supposed to go on… ---
**Author:** ![Dandmb50](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ba9def/32.png) [@Dandmb50](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dandmb50)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/43 "2003-02-12T03:59:28Z")
I remember when I was a little kid I told my Mother one day, “Mom I’m never going to lie to you again” That was a lie… ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Montana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/278dde/32.png) [@Tony\_Montana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tony_Montana)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/44 "2003-02-12T04:16:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dogface \* > \*\*An undercover cop can legally look you straight in the face and say “I am not a police officer. I swear to this, so help me God.” \*\* > [@](#): > > ## Did you read MeBuckners post? quote: > > From Snopes > Police don’t have to reveal their status, even when asked flat out. There’s nothing in the law that says a policeman can’t lie to you in the course of performing his duties > > * * * > > The cop can say “no, I am not a cop” How can you be more direct than that? “Your honor this question has been asked and answered time and again,Mr **Dogface** is clearly badgering the witness,at this junctureI will ask the court to…” ---
**Author:** ![1000monkeys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/7cd45c/32.png) [@1000monkeys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/1000monkeys)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/45 "2003-02-12T04:22:53Z")
Well, I pretty anti-cop so take this with some salt, but then again there is the assumption that I personally hold that not only are cops just as likely to be dishonest as the average citizen they might even be a tad moreso on average. For example, the Denver cops who assigned to busting prostitution at local XXX peep show type shops, were actually receiving the…ahem…oral pleasure via the glory holes before then arresting the prostitutes rather than paying. Now whichever side of the prostituion legalize it or not arguement you come down upon (I’m for it in case you couldnt guess, never having actually been a customer it just seems logical) its got to be some kind of crime to accept a service (illegal or otherwise) and not pay for it. Not to mention how uncool it would be to then arrest the poor girl. ---
**Author:** ![lamafish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@lamafish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lamafish)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/46 "2003-02-12T04:54:51Z")
## quote: Originally posted by isthatsowrong? ## Some women believed that asking “Are you a cop?” would protect them against arrest. This isn’t true, however; a cop can lie. Some women insisted that I touch them or show them my penis. They told me that the cops never do those things. I don’t know if there is a legal reason why the cops wouldn’t touch them, but it seemed to be their best protection against soliciting a cop. if anybody read that thread…this guy knows everything ---
**Author:** ![schwigiddy1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@schwigiddy1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/schwigiddy1)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/47 "2003-02-12T05:20:41Z")
well if you notice that in the movies most of the time when someone is asked if they are a COP they say no , or just says nothing but this is the skinny. we know what FBI stand for & NSA, DEA, Private DICK, and so on BUT, what does COP stand for = Constable On Patrol unless it’s a “C.O.P.” then they don’t have to say anything. a COP is a COP & all the rest is just that, the rest do not have to say anything because the rules governing this issue do not apply to anyone outside of the COPs, yes even a Sherif, yes very disturbing but, thats the facts. PS my stepdad is a C.O.P and they don’t mind being called a COP cause thats exactally what they are. ---
**Author:** ![pilot141](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pilot141](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pilot141)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/48 "2003-02-12T05:59:21Z")
**schwigiddy1** , welcome to the SDMB. Some advice, though: lurk for a loooong time before posting, especially before posting in GQ. This will allow you to become familiar with how things work. Read the thread: the OP has been answered many times over. “I know something about this too!” posts belong more in IMHO or CS. Your posts will carry more weight if you use proper grammar. pilot141 hoping he hasn’t just been suckered by a drive-by… ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/49 "2003-02-12T09:13:43Z")
To Mr. schwigiddy1 (yes, welcome to the Boards)… “Cop” is short for “copper”, which is itself a term that came into being due to the fact that the men in question, supposedly, had copper badges or something. Anyway… a question about the “touch my vagina” thing… Personal issues aside - such as the potential problems that may arise with, say, a wife, if a cop were to cop a feel (no pun intended) - is there anything illegal about a cop following through with such a request from a prostitute that they were planning on taking down? I mean, really… if a woman came up to me and told me, “Touch my vagina”, and I did, how could that be sexually inappropriate? She invited me, I agreed, it was a consensual contact. Am I to understand that the “no touching the vagina” thing is just a strongly-worded recommendation by police offices, or is it actually a strictly adhered-to rule? ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/50 "2003-02-12T11:03:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MEBuckner \* > \*\*No, [undercover police officers don’t have to truthfully answer the question “Are you a cop?”](http://www.snopes.com/sex/hookers/cop.htm) \*\* In the “Law & Order” video clip on that page it also confirmed that. I think it is good that movies usually deceive people (perhaps unintentionally) about this… I mean it can make some law-breakers ask the question and then make them appear to be very suspicious. I think it is better to let a lot of lawbreakers continue to get that misinformation from movies - rather than help them avoid detection by having the movies teach them the truth (like that “Law & Order” show). In that link it said how police catch a lot of prostitutes by that law. I think prostitution should be legal though… in fact even brothels are legal in Queensland, Australia (where I live)… but that doesn’t mean that I think illegal prostitutes should be better informed about how to avoid detection. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2003, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/51 "2003-02-12T13:27:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by schwigiddy1 \* > \*\*well if you notice that in the movies most of the time when > someone is asked if they are a COP they say no , or just > says nothing > > but this is the skinny. > we know what FBI stand for & NSA, DEA, Private DICK, and so on > BUT, what does COP stand for = > Constable On Patrol > unless it’s a “C.O.P.” then they don’t have to say anything. > a COP is a COP & all the rest is just that, the rest do not > have to say anything because the rules governing this issue > do not apply to anyone outside of the COPs, yes even a > Sherif, yes very disturbing but, thats the facts. > PS my stepdad is a C.O.P and they don’t mind being called > a COP cause thats exactally what they are. \*\* It never ends. Look, the etymology of ‘cop’ has no bearing on this issue. The law treats sheriffs, deputy sheriffs, city cops, county cops, and state cops in precisely the same way. It’s true that each of those departments may have different rules, but there is no particular legal distinction (for the purposes of this issue) between a sheriff and a police officer. If you’d like to defend your etymological theory, I’m sure we can open another thread… I thought that the “constable on patrol” theory was not taken seriously by etymologists, but I’m always willing to learn. - Rick ---
**Author:** ![schwigiddy1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@schwigiddy1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/schwigiddy1)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2003, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/52 "2003-02-14T06:40:11Z")
please see the following web site for info on the term “C.O.P” Article One Definitions Article one, section one (hereafter Art. 1.1 CCMC): COP - A term accepted in 1859 AD and which was a shortening of the word “copper” which was adopted as a term for a policeman in 1846 AD. We are alternatively told it was created as an English word to be a shortening for the term Constable On Patrol. Maybe our English or other British friends can shed some light on the accuracy of these tales. So 1 of you is 1/2 right on the term use to be “Copper” but, not for you think. it was the 1st short term for Constable On Patrol. and might i thank you for my crappy grammar…i have to say that my grammar is the worst i have ever seen…i think a 6 year old would have a better chance at writting a proper letter than i do. below another site with the definitaion of the term COP which i had allready know…and yes very sorry for replying to a topic that has since been talked about for some time now. [http://www.ci.mercer-island.wa.us/FAQ.asp?CategoryID=74](http://www.ci.mercer-island.wa.us/FAQ.asp?CategoryID=74) ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2003, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/53 "2003-02-14T06:52:13Z")
[Link](http://www.copsrus.com/3.html) omitted by **schwigiddy1** , from the site [Cops R Us](http://www.copsrus.com), which while well-meaning, isn’t in any way authoritative. > [@](#): > > Since Cop City is a City-State, answerable only to its own people and to itself, we will construct our own constitution and municipal code. We have reversed the order a bit and constructed a skeletal Cop City Municipal Code to get us by until we can write a constitution and a complete municipal code for our cyber city. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2003, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/54 "2003-02-14T15:27:25Z")
[This thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=163089) is now exploring the etymology of ‘cop’, and it’s not looking good for the acronym theory espoused by **schwigiddy1**. I’m shocked. - Rick ---
**Author:** ![tinman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/54ee81/32.png) [@tinman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tinman)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2004, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/55 "2004-06-26T16:06:44Z")
> [@Tony Montana](#): > > Ok,OK! > > I’ll get one of those battery powered ones ALRIGHT!? > > Me: “Are you a cop?” > > Cop:“no” > > Me: "then will you touch _this_ for me? ::buzzzz,buzzz:: > 😃 Will a tuna sandwitch work? ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2004, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/56 "2004-06-26T20:21:22Z")
Why wait for the cops to come to you? Since we all know cops aren’t ever allowed to lie when on duty ( 😉 ), just go down to the police station and say “I’m about to commit an illegal drug deal/ prostitute myself/ etc., are you planning any drug busts, sting opperations, etc. and if so are any of them going to take place at [address of illegal activity] at [time of illegal activity] today?” ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2004, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/57 "2004-06-26T21:21:15Z")
Unless I am mistaken, a police officer cannot enter your home without your premission unless they show probable cause. If nothing in my home were related to a crime, and hence the officer had no probable cause to enter, could I not invite them over to my house, and then make their entry be on the condition they are not a police officer. Here’s an example I saw on TV: An undercover police officer got a tip some guy wanted to bump off his wife and was looking for a hit man. The cop struck up a conversation with the suspect and somehow they got to talking about setting up a hit. The cop went outside with the fellow, asked the guy a few times if he was sure he wanted to have his wife killed, and then, after being repeatedly answered in the affirmative, promptly arrested him. Now, say I’m the suspect. I get talking to the guy. I figure the conversation is headed in the direction I’d like it to go, but I don’t want to get caught. Maybe I say “Man, I wish I could make that bitch pay, but I know I can’t.” Copper says “You don’t think so?” I say “Hey, I like you. Let’s change the subject, I’m tired of talking about my wife. Wanna come to my place and watch the fight on Pay-Per-View?” Cop says “sure.” We get to my house. On the doorstep, I say “You know, there’s just one thing I would like to ask you: Are you a cop? I get the feeling I’m being sized up here, and I don’t like it. If you’re a cop, you’re not welcome in my home, and have no right to enter my home. If I’m wrong, I apologize. Are you a cop?” ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2004, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/58 "2004-06-26T21:32:26Z")
> [@Loopydude](#): > > Unless I am mistaken, a police officer cannot enter your home without your premission unless they show probable cause. If nothing in my home were related to a crime, and hence the officer had no probable cause to enter, could I not invite them over to my house, and then make their entry be on the condition they are not a police officer. > > Here’s an example I saw on TV: An undercover police officer got a tip some guy wanted to bump off his wife and was looking for a hit man. The cop struck up a conversation with the suspect and somehow they got to talking about setting up a hit. The cop went outside with the fellow, asked the guy a few times if he was sure he wanted to have his wife killed, and then, after being repeatedly answered in the affirmative, promptly arrested him. > > Now, say I’m the suspect. I get talking to the guy. I figure the conversation is headed in the direction I’d like it to go, but I don’t want to get caught. Maybe I say “Man, I wish I could make that bitch pay, but I know I can’t.” Copper says “You don’t think so?” I say “Hey, I like you. Let’s change the subject, I’m tired of talking about my wife. Wanna come to my place and watch the fight on Pay-Per-View?” Cop says “sure.” We get to my house. On the doorstep, I say “You know, there’s just one thing I would like to ask you: Are you a cop? I get the feeling I’m being sized up here, and I don’t like it. If you’re a cop, you’re not welcome in my home, and have no right to enter my home. If I’m wrong, I apologize. Are you a cop?” A police officer cannot search your home without a warrant, an emergency, or permission. If he gains admission to your home under false pretences, I’d guess that any evidence found would be inadmissible. However, holding a conversation under false pretenses is not a search, and anything you say is just as admissible as if you’d said it to someone who isn’t a cop. Oh, and this thread was over a year old, so I’ve reported it to the Mods. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2004, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/59 "2004-06-26T21:41:27Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > A police officer cannot search your home without a warrant, an emergency, or permission. If he gains admission to your home under false pretences, I’d guess that any evidence found would be inadmissible. However, holding a conversation under false pretenses is not a search, and anything you say is just as admissible as if you’d said it to someone who isn’t a cop. > > Oh, and this thread was over a year old, so I’ve reported it to the Mods. But I’m not talking about a conversation. I’m talking about entry. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2004, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318/60 "2004-06-26T22:20:40Z")
Not that anyone bothers to read the information in ATMB, but it says, among other things > [@](#): > > What if I want to continue / add to the discussion on a topic that was mentioned in an old thread? > > Start a new thread with a link to the old thread. A general guideline for “old” would be a thread older than three months. It just gets too confusing, otherwise. Try to resist. **samclem** , moderator GQ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-lying-allowed-when-asked-are-you-a-cop/154318.md?page=2)