# Is "Mary Hartman Mary Harman" worth revisiting 40 years later? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 5, 2015, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297 "2015-07-05T06:53:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/1 "2015-07-05T06:53:34Z")
I was reading [this interview with Louise Lasser](http://the-toast.net/2013/12/20/an-interview-with-louise-lasser-tv-depression-snl-and-woody/) of [Mary Hartman Mary Harman](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Hartman,_Mary_Hartman)and was wondering if the show was worth revisiting. I tried watching it a few times in 1976 when I was 17, but couldn’t really watch it for more than a few minutes at a time because it seemed kind of pointless and annoying. Should I re-visit watching it as an adult 40 years later. Does it have more to offer now? I’ve read how it should no be viewed as a “comedy” but more like some existentialist play. Is there more going on there than just a bizarre and unfunny sitcom? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/2 "2015-07-05T12:55:19Z")
The last episode is groundbreaking television and in fact is prolly somewhat groundbreaking for visual narrative storytelling. But if you found the show to be “kind of pointless and annoying” when it first aired, I doubt you’ll think much differently of it today. Yes, there’s more going there than just a bizarre and unfunny sitcom, but at it’s heart it is still a bizarre and unfunny (to many) sitcom. The show is basically a send-up of soap operas, a subject ripe for picking in the mid-late '70s, but filtered through a couple of miles of dry humor and surreal perspectives. _Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman_ remains one of my favorite prime-time television shows from the 1970s, right up there with _Barney Miller_ and _Soap_. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/3 "2015-07-05T14:41:19Z")
The show was a very deadpan satire of soap opera; it was less the jokes as the way the characters react to the tropes of the genre. It’s also (deliberately) slowly paced and unless you understand that they’re making it look as much like a soap opera of the era as possible, you may find it slow (especially since nowadays people expect everything to happen quickly). Let’s all go down to the International House of Pancakes to continue to discuss this. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Krupe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Leo\_Krupe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Krupe)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/4 "2015-07-05T15:33:23Z")
Not long ago, I watched at least the first 25 episodes on YouTube. I remember enjoying them during the original run, and absolutely laughed til my sides hurt this time around. I love deadpan humor, and **RealityChuck** is right – unless you know about what they’re parodying, it won’t work. Leo “Waxy yellow buildup” Krupe ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/5 "2015-07-05T15:59:54Z")
Foreplay is fairplay! I fear to return to this given how much I liked it as a teenager… ---
**Author:** ![Don\_Draper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Don\_Draper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Draper)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/6 "2015-07-05T16:09:58Z")
Executive producer Norman Lear has always maintained that MH2 was not just a satire of soap operas, but of the way that ALL television shows reduce life to its most banal, dull and mediocre condition. (Soaps just being the most obvious example.) That was a timely critcism in 1975, but in the modern “golden age of television” in which we have quite a few very well made, complex and mutl-dimensional series, the criticism doesn’t apply. I rented a few MH2 DVDs from Netflix some time back and didn’t think it held up well. Much of the humor derived from introducing topics that network TV of the mid-70s wouldn’t dare touch - impotence, VD, anti-semitism, obnoxious evangelical Christians. Viewers back then were likely shocked and laughing that the show would even ‘go there.’ Nowadays, it’s all seems pretty tame. What does hold up very well from that period is the sitcom “Soap.” This show followed a similar format - parody of soap operas, lots of randy innuendo - but IMO features better performances by the cast, situations that are still laugh-out-loud funny, and storylines that still seem risque today. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/7 "2015-07-05T17:52:21Z")
It’s…it’s…its…I think I got it…its annnnn…APPLE! Right up there with turkeys could fly. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/8 "2015-07-05T17:57:18Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > It’s…it’s…its…I think I got it…its annnnn…APPLE! > > Right up there with turkeys could fly. Hell yeah. ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/9 "2015-07-05T21:52:01Z")
I bought the DVD (select episodes compiled) for my sister a few years ago, and she loved it. She loved it when it first aired though. Even though it was a bit over my head for me originally (I was like 10) I’ve since watched it and find it to be incredibly ahead of its time. All single camera, no audience or laugh track comedy shows (like _The Office, Arrested Development, Parks & Recreation, Modern Family_ etc.) owe a debt to it. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/10 "2015-07-06T00:43:16Z")
Absolutely not. It was banal and unfunny to the point of excrutiation. Stay well clear. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/11 "2015-07-06T13:51:44Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > … It was banal and unfunny to the point of excrutiation. … That’s what made it great! ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/12 "2015-07-06T14:13:45Z")
I never liked, or got, MH2. But its spinoff, _Fernwood 2-Night_ (and later _America 2-Night_) was brilliant. Martin Mull and Fred Willard were brilliant as the dumbest talk-show hosts you’ve ever seen. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/13 "2015-07-06T15:07:28Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I never liked, or got, MH2. > > But its spinoff, _Fernwood 2-Night_ (and later _America 2-Night_) was brilliant. Martin Mull and Fred Willard were brilliant as the dumbest talk-show hosts you’ve ever seen. 40 years later I can still recall Garth interviewing a legalized prostitute, who’d been issued an ID card. “Oh look! I can hold this up with one hand!” God, Martin Mull was funny in his prime. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mary-hartman-mary-harman-worth-revisiting-40-years-later/724297/14 "2015-07-06T15:08:52Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I never liked, or got, MH2. > > But its spinoff, _Fernwood 2-Night_ (and later _America 2-Night_) was brilliant. Martin Mull and Fred Willard were brilliant as the dumbest talk-show hosts you’ve ever seen. Aye, I loved the spinoffs too! Martin Mull’s sense of humor is so dry it needs it’s own scale to measure by and aye, Fred Willard does “pleasant & well-intentioned idiot” better than anyone else ever has or will. They made a great team.