# Is McCain forked yet? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 25, 2008, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604 "2008-05-25T23:58:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/401 "2008-08-22T19:53:22Z")
[QUOTE=Sam Stone] The ‘McCain is Rich’ strategy is going to backfire on Obama. [/quote] Yeah, well, I’ll take my chances. > [@](#): > > And it opens the door to McCain re-opening the Rezko connection to Obama’s own house Which is really pretty trivial, compared to the favors McCain got from some guy named Keating. And the DNC has said they’re ready to go there. I’m game to see who comes out better. > [@](#): > > It also opens Obama up to the charge of class warfare, which plays well to his base but which turns off republicans and independents. Could you please describe how this charge will be made? Nobody’s saying McCain should give up his numerous houses. They’re just saying that someone who’s been living the lifestyle of the super-rich for the past three decades may be just a wee tad out of touch with the concerns of ordinary Americans, a charge which his stated policies, and his buddy (and once again his campaign advisor) Phil Gramm’s comments calling common people ‘whiners’ reinforce. > [@](#): > > And as we’ve seen with Edward’s massive home and high-living lifestyle, and Gore’s using 20 X more power than the average citizen in his home while calling for conservation, and Kerry’s fabulous wealth, this stuff just does not have traction with the voters. Funny how the guys on your side, from Rush Limbaugh to **Mr. Moto** , thought it did when the shoe was on the other foot. There’s also a big difference between a rich person who advances policies helping his class get even richer, and a rich person who is trying to do something about the problems of ordinary people. (Especially, as in the cases of Obama, Edwards, Bill Clinton and others, if they weren’t always rich, and remember what it’s like to be scraping by.) Who’s playing class war again? > [@](#): > > Even when it whiffs of hypocrisy, as it does with these three fabulously wealthy liberals. Explain the hypocrisy part. How’s it hypocrisy to advocate that governmental policies aid those who don’t have your advantages? > [@](#): > > Obama’s ‘brand’ is based on him being a new kind of politician. One who won’t run the same old kind of campaign, who won’t resort to smears and innuendo and other dirty tricks What smears? I guess the facts are a smear. Darn those facts for their liberal bias! What innuendo? If Obama’s implying something that isn’t so, feel free to spell it out. What dirty tricks? Please enumerate. > [@](#): > > Also, his campaign is starting to look a little desperate and afraid, and that’s also not a good thing for him to project. I dunno, seemed like [McCain’s campaign was the one that looked desperate and afraid today](http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-campaign22-2008aug22,0,2934245.story): > [@](#): > > McCain, who huddled with advisors at his desert compound in Sedona, Ariz., said nothing in public. A nine-car motorcade took him to a nearby Starbucks early in the morning, where he ordered a large cappuccino. McCain otherwise avoided reporters. The nine-car motorcade to get McCain a coffee (couldn’t he have just sent an aide out?) was the cherry on the sundae. That big a motorcade for such a trivial errand, for a guy who’s not even President yet - one might say it was…_presumptuous_ or something. Not to mention, for all the GOP nonsense about lattes and aragula, I note that the coffee McCain ordered was…a _cappucino_. Sounds pretty effete to me. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/402 "2008-08-22T20:12:13Z")
[QUOTE=RTFirefly] The nine-car motorcade to get McCain a coffee (couldn’t he have just sent an aide out?) was the cherry on the sundae. [/QUOTE] Clearly, $4 per gallon gas is having a major impact on the McCain campaign. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/403 "2008-08-22T20:16:13Z")
[QUOTE=Steve MB] McCain needs to work on his ability to think on his feet and keep those feet out of his mouth. [/QUOTE] At $260 a shoe, those gaffes are expensive! ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/404 "2008-08-22T20:58:58Z")
Boy, go on a vacation away from televisions and computers for a few days and look what happens. This race has changed over the week boys and girls. The movement has now moved out of statistical noise and into momentum going McCain’s way. No denying it. Why? Pure and simple: McCain is out-communicating Obama. He is stating simple messages in easy to absorb bites and staying with them: Russia bad; Drill and drill now; The surge worked. He is getting his story burned into the public’s consciousness in a way that Obama is failing to do. And Obama is playing cautiously, above all else trying not to make a mistake, yet that very cautiousness may be his biggest mistake to date. No, I am not Chicken Littling. The athletes have just been doing warm up laps. But kiddos, they are going to get into the blocks soon and when that whistle blows the real fun begins. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/405 "2008-08-22T21:02:04Z")
[QUOTE=DSeid] Boy, go on a vacation away from televisions and computers for a few days and look what happens. This race has changed over the week boys and girls. The movement has now moved out of statistical noise and into momentum going McCain’s way. No denying it. Why? Pure and simple: McCain is out-communicating Obama. He is stating simple messages in easy to absorb bites and staying with them: Russia bad; Drill and drill now; The surge worked. He is getting his story burned into the public’s consciousness in a way that Obama is failing to do. And Obama is playing cautiously, above all else trying not to make a mistake, yet that very cautiousness may be his biggest mistake to date. No, I am not Chicken Littling. The athletes have just been doing warm up laps. But kiddos, they are going to get into the blocks soon and when that whistle blows the real fun begins. [/QUOTE] Welcome back, but I don’t think you’ve finished reading all those newspapers on your porch. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/406 "2008-08-22T21:05:57Z")
[QUOTE=DSeid] Boy, go on a vacation away from televisions and computers for a few days and look what happens. This race has changed over the week boys and girls. The movement has now moved out of statistical noise and into momentum going McCain’s way. No denying it. Why? Pure and simple: McCain is out-communicating Obama. He is stating simple messages in easy to absorb bites and staying with them: Russia bad; Drill and drill now; The surge worked. He is getting his story burned into the public’s consciousness in a way that Obama is failing to do. And Obama is playing cautiously, above all else trying not to make a mistake, yet that very cautiousness may be his biggest mistake to date. No, I am not Chicken Littling. The athletes have just been doing warm up laps. But kiddos, they are going to get into the blocks soon and when that whistle blows the real fun begins. [/QUOTE] Welcome back! How fast do you think McCain can jump rope? ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/407 "2008-08-22T21:09:15Z")
And will it BE fun? Obama has someone Bill Clinton had and Kerry didn’t: Bill Daley. I’m expecting LOADS o’ fun, in a “McCain’s people won’t know what hit 'em” way. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2008, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/408 "2008-08-22T22:51:58Z")
[QUOTE=Happy Lendervedder] Welcome back, but I don’t think you’ve finished reading all those newspapers on your porch. [/QUOTE] Aw c’mon, McCain’s lead is safe as houses! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/409 "2008-08-23T00:23:20Z")
As I mentioned in the McCain Gaffe Pit thread-- it’s been a tough week for McCain. The “sure, the draft is on the table” video, not knowing how many houses he and his wife live in, and the McCain terrible response to both have been hurtful.[Obama attacked immediately with some pretty effective ads.](http://www.youtube.com/user/barackobamadotcom?ob=4) Perhaps the biggest damage to the McCain’s campaign has been the overuse of the POW excuse. This has been pretty effective deflecting device for him but people have started comparing this to Guliani’s 9/11 schtick. He’s gonna have to go really light on this for a while. WARNING!!! KOS LINK. For the Daily Kos sensitive. [Fellow POW Lt General Robert Gard has taken notice.](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/8/21/205255/705/324/572249) ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/410 "2008-08-23T02:07:24Z")
I’m not sure, but I’m thinking that Obama’s been waiting for McCain to use all his best negative stuff early. Wait it out, wait it out, then start hitting. Because it’s not about who gets the early lead, it’s about who holds the lead last. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/411 "2008-08-23T02:33:31Z")
[McCain Strategist Fears Approach to Forking Territory:](http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/mccain-expects-obama-to-get-15-percent-bump-in-polls-2008-08-22.html) > [@](#): > > Barack Obama may get a 15 percent bump in the polls from the announcement of his vice presidential pick and next week’s Democratic convention, according to a memo from John McCain’s campaign. > > The memo from campaign strategy director Sarah Simmons attempted to set expectations for the Democratic senator from Illinois, who has failed to break 50 percent in most polls since clinching the delegates necessary to win his party’s nomination. She also blamed what she predicted will be worshipful media coverage of Obama. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/412 "2008-08-23T02:39:28Z")
> [@](#): > > She also blamed what she predicted will be worshipful media coverage of Obama. Awww…are all of Johnny’s fair-weather media friends defecting now that his mouth is chewing on $520 shoe leather? ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/413 "2008-08-23T03:11:01Z")
Okay, that’s another good game to play! How much of a bump will Obama get by the end of the Democratic convention and how much of an off set will there be by the end of the GOP convention? I am expecting very mild ones of each but a bit more after the Dem show than won back by the GOP one. Back up to a RCP rolling average of 7 or 8 by a week from now and back down to the usual average of 3 or 4 the following week. Your guesses? ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/414 "2008-08-23T04:41:34Z")
Gotta go with you, Doc. I see more of a pulling away as the campaign wears on thing. Especially since McCain may not physically be able to take the wear. Doctor Who claimed to be able to take down the government of a prime minister who pissed him off with a simple, “Don’t you think she looks tired?” Enough missed Saturday naps and McCain runs the risk of us choosing between tired and cranky. Not a good choice for the guy who is expected to be wakeful at 3AM and not because his enlarged prostate has him peeing. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/415 "2008-08-23T05:37:41Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] [McCain Strategist Fears Approach to Forking Territory:](http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/mccain-expects-obama-to-get-15-percent-bump-in-polls-2008-08-22.html) [/QUOTE] This is an old tactic - The McCain camp says they expect a 15 point bump for Obama, and they try to convince the media of it. Then if Obama gets a more reasonable 5-10 point bump, the narrative becomes, “What happened? Why didn’t he get more of a lift? Is there something wrong with Obama?” And if he does through some miracle get a 15 point bump, the McCain camp will say, “this was expected. Nothing to see here.” The various campaigns trot this out before the convention every year. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2008, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/416 "2008-08-23T05:39:03Z")
True dat, **Sam**. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2008, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/417 "2008-08-26T04:30:04Z")
[QUOTE=RTFirefly] Funny how the guys on your side, from Rush Limbaugh to **Mr. Moto** , thought it did when the shoe was on the other foot. [/QUOTE] Sorry I’m late - I just got home from a trip. And I have to ask for a cite - I seem to remember saying the talk about Gore’s house wasn’t a big issue, and I don’t remember saying much about John Edwards’ house at all. If you can find anything, I’d sure appreciate it. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2008, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/418 "2008-08-26T09:25:16Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Sorry I’m late - I just got home from a trip. And I have to ask for a cite - I seem to remember saying the talk about Gore’s house wasn’t a big issue, and I don’t remember saying much about John Edwards’ house at all. If you can find anything, I’d sure appreciate it. [/QUOTE] [I found something.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=425519) OK, I’ll admit it - I decided to pull a **Moto** here. Read the thread, and you’ll see what I mean. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2008, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/419 "2008-08-26T09:37:04Z")
[QUOTE=Biggirl] WARNING!!! KOS LINK. For the Daily Kos sensitive. [/QUOTE] Then go to the front page and read about the [meth drug bust](http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/25/224736/139/440/575192) in their hotel. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2008, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604/420 "2008-08-26T10:21:54Z")
I think the Democratic convention bump will be about 8 for Obama and then he’ll give about half of that back with the Republican convention and the naming of Mitt Romney as veep candidate. I think from here on out, Obama will be over the 50% barrier now that people are starting to pay attention and getting their information about him from something besides a McCain ad. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-mccain-forked-yet/450604.md?page=22)