# Is northism evil? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 19, 2010, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734 "2010-12-19T18:27:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/41 "2010-12-20T05:16:50Z")
> [@Pierrot\_Le\_Fou](#): > > You can be on the side of people that raped entire cultures. I will be on the side of angels. So you’re implying that the angles are on the side of good? That’s pretty Christocentric if you ask me. Sounds to me like you’re insulting the indigenous faiths of native peoples. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/42 "2010-12-20T05:20:10Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Unless they occidentally hung it upside-down. :rimshot: 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/43 "2010-12-20T05:28:38Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > So you’re implying that the angles are on the side of good? I gather this entire discussion requires the assumption that that are good angles and bad angles. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/44 "2010-12-20T05:32:02Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I gather this entire discussion requires the assumption that that are good angles and bad angles. The non-Euclidean angles are the bad ones. _Very_ bad. Cthulhu fhtagn! ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/45 "2010-12-20T05:56:20Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The non-Euclidean angles are the bad ones. _Very_ bad. > > Cthulhu fhtagn! And the Hounds of Tindalos haunt the right ones… ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/46 "2010-12-20T06:32:24Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I gather this entire discussion requires the assumption that that are good angles and bad angles. Don’t get me started on angles. Acute angles? Pure sexism. Obtuse angles? Intolerance of the differently abled. Right angles? Which I guess says that all other angles are somehow wrong. And straight angles - I notice that there are no gay angles. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/47 "2010-12-20T07:23:06Z")
Here’s a (semi-related) question: wherefore this assumption that “up” is good and “down” is bad? Is it just because of heaven and hell? Or is there more to it? (I know there’s “looking up” and “feeling down” and all that, but they have to have origins too.) ---
**Author:** ![Electric\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9de0a6/32.png) [@Electric\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Electric_Sky)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/48 "2010-12-20T10:04:56Z")
Not that exposing kids to different kinds of information isn’t a good thing, but instead of requiring schools to purchase a load of South-oriented maps, how about requiring them to teach the fact that North isn’t ‘up’ because “it just is, duh” (as I’ve heard said), but because our culture has over time decided that it is, and that trying to boil down an immense and complex world into a piece of paper requires a vast amount of simplification? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/49 "2010-12-20T10:37:58Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Here’s a (semi-related) question: wherefore this assumption that “up” is good and “down” is bad? Is it just because of heaven and hell? Or is there more to it? (I know there’s “looking up” and “feeling down” and all that, but they have to have origins too.) It’s probably been that way since cro-magnon man found out that he could stand on top of a hill and throw rocks down on his enemies. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/50 "2010-12-20T11:06:22Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > It’s probably been that way since cro-magnon man found out that he could stand on top of a hill and throw rocks down on his enemies. Or that you have a better view, or are less likely to get flooded out. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/51 "2010-12-20T11:28:01Z")
You northerners can orient the map however as most pleases your goodselves, just so long as you use an equal-area map something like the [Gall–Peters projection](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gall-peters.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Galileo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Galileo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Galileo)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/52 "2010-12-20T11:31:50Z")
Well, there’s Buckminster Fuller’s [Dymaxion Map](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dymaxion_map). It has no “up” or “down”. > [@](#): > > Fuller argued frequently that in the universe there is no “up” and “down”, or “north” and “south”: only “in” and “out”. Gravitational forces of the stars and planets created “in”, meaning ‘towards the gravitational center’, and “out”, meaning “away from the gravitational center”. He attributed the north-up-superior/south-down-inferior presentation of most other world maps to cultural bias. > > Fuller intended the map to be unfolded in different ways to emphasize different aspects of the world. Peeling the triangular faces of the icosahedron apart in one way results in an icosahedral net that shows an almost contiguous land mass comprising all of earth’s continents – not groups of continents divided by oceans. Peeling the solid apart in a different way presents a view of the world dominated by connected oceans surrounded by land. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/53 "2010-12-20T11:45:18Z")
Nah. Just teach students that they bear an immense level of guilt for being filth directionists. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/54 "2010-12-20T13:10:03Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > The OP is clearly thinking much too small. The most of the world’s landmass is in the Northern Hemisphere because of plate tectonics. But just who came up with this plate tectonics theory? Who made the continents start moving in the first place? In other words, _cui bono_ from a north-oriented world? The conclusion is inescapable: Santa Claus. He did it to drive up property values and keep away anyone who might start asking questions about his tax-free elf slave labor. IT ALL FITS TOGETHER! Reunite Gondwanaland! ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/55 "2010-12-20T13:15:58Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > Reunite Gondwanaland! Continentist. ---
**Author:** ![Pierrot\_Le\_Fou](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f475e1/32.png) [@Pierrot\_Le\_Fou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pierrot_Le_Fou)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/56 "2010-12-20T13:24:08Z")
> [@Galileo](#): > > Well, there’s Buckminster Fuller’s [Dymaxion Map](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dymaxion_map). It has no “up” or “down”. That is a great map. The Department of Education should require it or cut a school’s funding to zero. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/57 "2010-12-20T13:25:04Z")
> [@Pierrot\_Le\_Fou](#): > > Just like people can colonize and enslave whomever they want. You should look beyond what people can do and look at what they should do. The United States could nuke Mexico, but that is not something the US should do. Did you just compare drawing a map to slavery and nuclear genocide? > [@](#): > > The north orientation is evil. But a south orientation isn’t? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Baracus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/2bfe46/32.png) [@Baracus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baracus)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/58 "2010-12-20T18:17:33Z")
> [@Candyman74](#): > > But a south orientation isn’t? :rolleyes: And what is so much better about being at the top of the map in the first place? By failing to recognize the inherent value in the bottom of the map, the OP is revealing his uppism. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/59 "2010-12-20T18:39:51Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > You northerners can orient the map however as most pleases your goodselves, just so long as you use an equal-area map something like the [Gall–Peters projection](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gall-peters.jpg) I used to have something called The New World Map, which looked a bit like that. It debunked a lot of misconceptions propogated by the Mercator Projection, such as land mass of the south compared to the north. (The south has more.) I wish I could find a link to an image. Having said that, I’m tired of being oppressed by Canada. ---
**Author:** ![straight\_man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straight_man/32/3027_2.png) [@straight\_man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/straight_man)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734/60 "2010-12-20T19:27:33Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > I used to have something called The New World Map, which looked a bit like that. It debunked a lot of misconceptions propogated by the Mercator Projection, such as land mass of the south compared to the north. (The south has more.) I wish I could find a link to an image. > > Having said that, I’m tired of being oppressed by Canada. The Southern Hemisphere most certainly does _not_ have more. Quoting Wikipedia: [QUOTE=Wikipedia] Climates in the southern hemisphere overall tend to be slightly milder than those in the northern hemisphere except in the Antarctic which is colder than the Arctic. This is because the southern hemisphere has significantly more ocean and less land. Water heats up and cools down more slowly than land. The southern hemisphere is also significantly less polluted than the northern hemisphere because of lower overall population densities (a total of 10 to 12% of the human population), lower levels of industrialisation, and smaller land masses. [/QUOTE] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-northism-evil/564734.md?page=4)