# Is Obama all that different from other Presidents? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 14, 2011, 9:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993 "2011-07-14T09:22:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/121 "2011-07-17T00:11:44Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > There is little reason to think another few hundred billion dollars to the seven hundred billion dollars in the stimulus bill would have made any difference. There are actually lots of [reasons](http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/2010-08-30-stimulus30_CV_N.htm) to think it did. Certainly it has more reasoning behind it than cutting taxes on the rich to create jobs. > [@](#): > > But to estimate the answers to such questions, economists rely on models based on historical relationships between various policies and real-world results. Earlier this month, Zandi and co-author Alan Blinder, former vice chairman of the Federal Reserve, released the most detailed assessment of the government’s efforts to combat the so-called Great Recession. Neither economist is regarded as a partisan firebrand. Zandi, for example, backed John McCain in the 2008 presidential campaign and has advised members of both parties. > > Their conclusion: The fiscal stimulus created 2.7 million jobs and added $460 billion to gross domestic product. Unemployment would be 11% today if the stimulus hadn’t been passed and 16.5% if neither the fiscal stimulus nor the banks’ rescue had been enacted, according to Zandi and Blinder. “It’s pretty hard to deny that it had a measurable impact,” Zandi said. ---
**Author:** ![PigArcher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bcef8e/32.png) [@PigArcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PigArcher)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/122 "2011-07-17T02:06:10Z")
> [@HumanBear](#): > > Is that really true? I don’t live in America and therefore probably miss a lot, but in what ways has Obama been incompetent? > > The way I see it is that he has to fight a ton of Republicans and Tea Partiers over every single thing he does, their stated goal is to get him out asap regardless of what he does; Fox News views everything he does with a particularly vehement skew, and for some unknown reason this is the most popular news in the US; and he inherited a very bad situation both internal and external to the US, one in which whatever he does he will be painted as the bad guy. > > The hated Obamacare promises to save money rather than lose it, and I’ve never heard any actual facts that prove it to have been a bad move, other than there may have been things that were even better that could have been done. > > I’ve never heard from a credible source that the spending to boost the economy was disastrous, and it’s very hard to tell what the world would’ve looked like should there have been no spending, and as far as I can see most world leaders agreed with it, so it can;t be that crazy. > > As far as I can tell he can hardly be blamed for the deficit, what spending has he done that wasn’t accepted as sensible by many people? > > Where are all these big mistakes? What am I missing, and I admit it could be a lot as I only read up on what’s going on every now and then. > > As I stated before, rather than people just stating he’s bad or incompetent is there anyone who can state what he’s done wrong, and what they would have done if they were in his shoes? Sounds like you understand the situation perfectly. Everything you said here is 100% accurate. ---
**Author:** ![HumanBear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/919ad9/32.png) [@HumanBear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HumanBear)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/123 "2011-07-17T21:21:30Z")
> [@kenetic](#): > > Sounds like you understand the situation perfectly. Everything you said here is 100% accurate. I guess the question has been answered, Obama really isn’t all that different, and he’s not been particularly bad, although perhaps he hasn’t done as much as some people would like but then he has had his hands tied by the Republicans and a global financial crisis not of his making. If that’s not right then how come no one here has been able to explain just what makes Obama incompetent, or a bad president. I’ve asked repeatedly, but as far as I can there hasn’t been a single example of just what he has done wrong and how it could have been done differently. ---
**Author:** ![PigArcher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bcef8e/32.png) [@PigArcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PigArcher)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/124 "2011-07-17T22:03:19Z")
> [@HumanBear](#): > > If that’s not right then how come no one here has been able to explain just what makes Obama incompetent, or a bad president. I’ve asked repeatedly, but as far as I can there hasn’t been a single example of just what he has done wrong and how it could have been done differently. Looking at who’s saying he’s incompetent should explain this. And their inability to express any thought besides barely coherent vitriol is another big clue. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/125 "2011-07-17T22:10:02Z")
He’s incompetent because things are bad. Never mind that things were already bad and getting worse when he took office, or that the economic problems are global in scope, or that the Republicans have done everything in their power to stop him from accomplishing anything at all - when you measure things by the “Criteria I Cherrypick and Ignoring All Other Criteria” system we can clearly see how terrible he is. ---
**Author:** ![2sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/e47774/32.png) [@2sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2sense)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/126 "2011-07-18T09:15:10Z")
In order to understand the political dynamic in America the important thing to remember is that the public doesn’t support anything on the Republican agenda. If elections were decided on the issues the GOP would have to moderate their march to oligarchy. Extreme rhetoric and bizarre accusations help obscure this basic truth. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/127 "2011-07-18T12:26:38Z")
I think he’s been a fine prsident. I’ve been a republican for over 2 decades and I almost cried with happiness when he was elected. ---
**Author:** ![HumanBear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/919ad9/32.png) [@HumanBear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HumanBear)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/128 "2011-07-18T17:27:24Z")
> [@BMalion](#): > > I think he’s been a fine prsident. > > I’ve been a republican for over 2 decades and I almost cried with happiness when he was elected. Now that’s an interesting thing to hear. I guess we hardly ever hear from the moderate Republicans nowadays, I suppose the news people like to get extremes arguing as often as they can. ---
**Author:** ![Dick\_Dastardly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c4cdca/32.png) [@Dick\_Dastardly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dick_Dastardly)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/129 "2011-07-18T17:52:05Z")
> [@Susanann](#): > > Originally Posted by Recovering Republican > Well, you’d have to go back to Jimmy Carter to find anyone as grossly incompetent as Obama is. > Yes. That is true. Neither one of those two knew anything about budgets, foreign policy, nor economics which is why both of them gave us economic depression while at the same time making the world less safe. > > …except that obama is much more incompetent than even Carter. Obama is making a bigger mess than Carter did. This is not really very surprising, since obama’s greatest “achievement” (sic) in life was as a **Chicago Community Organizer** - which left that part of Chicago in shambles. Could you please explain to me how you think Carter and Obama were/are incompetent and compare their competency to other contemporary US presidents. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/130 "2011-07-18T18:30:36Z")
> [@HumanBear](#): > > Now that’s an interesting thing to hear. I guess we hardly ever hear from the moderate Republicans nowadays, I suppose the news people like to get extremes arguing as often as they can. Yeah, I know. I ignore all the crap spewing back & forth, it saddens me. Its a lot easier to ignore if you don’t watch TV. Funny, Reagun was the first president I voted for, I felt so good about his presidency. over the years I became increasingly disappointed with the grand old party. So much so that I have been voting democrat for the last 8 years or so. I’d always heard that when you were young you’re a democrat, when you’re older you’re a republican. I seemed to have turned that around. I guess I’m getting soft in my old age. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/131 "2011-07-18T20:35:23Z")
> [@BMalion](#): > > Funny, Reagun was the first president I voted for, I felt so good about his presidency. over the years I became increasingly disappointed with the grand old party. So much so that I have been voting democrat for the last 8 years or so. It’s not just you that changed over that period - the GOP changed quite a bit, also. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/132 "2011-07-18T20:46:56Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > Could you please explain to me how you think Carter and Obama were/are incompetent and compare their competency to other contemporary US presidents. It’s an article of faith, they can’t actually explain it. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/133 "2011-07-18T20:58:33Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > It’s not just you that changed over that period - the GOP changed quite a bit, also. Amen, to both. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/134 "2011-07-18T21:24:48Z")
> [@BMalion](#): > > I think he’s been a fine prsident. > > I’ve been a republican for over 2 decades and I almost cried with happiness when he was elected. I left the GOP over W Bush’s nomination–and I think if anything Obama should be further left economically. ---
**Author:** ![HumanBear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/919ad9/32.png) [@HumanBear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HumanBear)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/135 "2011-07-19T08:55:17Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > I left the GOP over W Bush’s nomination–and I think if anything Obama should be further left economically. I suspect (without much real evidence) that Obama would like to be a bit more to the left economically, but the Republicans have sold their message of no tax increases, less regulation, and the rich are the job creators so well that there isn’t the will to move the slightest bit to the left (while still remaining pretty much to the right). What amazes me is that the obvious problem in government in the US is money. It seems to me that democracy is subverted hugely by money, and yet I never hear anyone saying something should be done about this. Surely if fund raising were removed it would help in so many ways. Why don’t tax payers think that tax money would be better used to fund politicians than corporate donations? I would like to have seen Obama be president when there wasn’t a global financial crisis, I wonder if he would have made bigger changes then. ---
**Author:** ![Susanann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ab992/32.png) [@Susanann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Susanann)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/136 "2011-07-19T13:41:28Z")
> [@BMalion](#): > > Funny, Reagun was the first president I voted for, I felt so good about his presidency. over the years I became increasingly disappointed with the grand old party. So much so that I have been voting democrat for the last 8 years or so. > > I’d always heard that when you were young you’re a democrat, when you’re older you’re a republican. I seemed to have turned that around. Reagan’s first term was pretty good, Reagan’s second term was terrible and his second term undid a lot of the good he did in the first term. As far as you switching to Democrat, there has not been a dime’s worth of difference between Republicans and Democrats since 1984. ---
**Author:** ![HumanBear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/919ad9/32.png) [@HumanBear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HumanBear)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/137 "2011-07-19T13:55:55Z")
> [@Susanann](#): > > Reagan’s first term was pretty good, Reagan’s second term was terrible and his second term undid a lot of the good he did in the first term. > > As far as you switching to Democrat, there has not been a dime’s worth of difference between Republicans and Democrats since 1984. As a non-American it’s hard for me to know what you’re talking about, I really only know a bit about recent American politics. How about some examples of things you liked and things you didn’t. I’d really like to know where you’re coming from, but you tend to give very large sweeping statements which doesn’t help me understand why you think the way you do. Is there anyone you would vote for in the next election? Do you prefer smaller government, and less taxes; no government; more government as long as it doesn’t cost too much; or something else? Please give me an idea of where you’re coming from. ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/138 "2011-07-19T15:41:43Z")
> [@Susanann](#): > > Reagan’s first term was pretty good, Reagan’s second term was terrible and his second term undid a lot of the good he did in the first term. > > As far as you switching to Democrat, there has not been a dime’s worth of difference between Republicans and Democrats since 1984. That’s one of the stupidest statements that I hear. The parties differ on tax policy, voting rights, reaction to global warming, gay marriage, abortion, union rights, and a host of other policies. The SC Justices that each party has put forward could not be more different. Bow of course the Democrats could move further left, but then they’d never get elected so what does it matter what they believe at that point? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/139 "2011-07-19T21:49:47Z")
> [@HumanBear](#): > > Thanks for the reply Der Trihs. I think you yourself are considered one of the more radical guys on this message board, yet I often find myself agreeing with you. I wonder if it’s something to do with those outside of America being a little less religious / right-wing on average, or maybe it’s just me 🙂 You find yourself agreeing with him for the same reason i find myself nodding my head when Kucinich gives a speech, then I go and try to figure out if I want to vote for Obama or Hillary. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993/140 "2011-07-19T22:06:48Z")
> [@Susanann](#): > > As far as you switching to Democrat, there has not been a dime’s worth of difference between Republicans and Democrats since 1984. > [@sh1bu1](#): > > That’s one of the stupidest statements that I hear. The parties differ on tax policy, voting rights, reaction to global warming, gay marriage, abortion, union rights, and a host of other policies. The SC Justices that each party has put forward could not be more different. +1 to **sh1bu1** ’s post. I am endlessly amused by people who pull the “both parties are the same!” card, because it’s lazy, fact-less thinking. There are clear, well-established, and substantial policy differences at the national, state, and local levels between the two major parties, and anyone who states otherwise is not paying attention, or has an agenda. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-obama-all-that-different-from-other-presidents/588993.md?page=8)