# Is "opaque couché" (Pantone 448C) the ugliest color in the world? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 10, 2016, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044 "2016-06-10T20:24:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/21 "2016-06-11T06:24:18Z")
Nice detective work! I guess we get what we are willing to pay for with journalism nowadays. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/22 "2016-06-11T06:34:09Z")
Ha–I have a silk skirt just that color. Well, it’s hard to tell, since the skirt is in real space in my closet, and I’m looking at the color on a computer. I’ve had it for years. The color was decribed as “tobacco.” So that seems like a perfectly appropriate package color for cigarettes to me. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/23 "2016-06-11T13:22:14Z")
What am I missing? Just looks black to me. I clicked on the other link in the article,and got another square and that just looked black, too. Like the label colors of really expensive lines of designer brands. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/24 "2016-06-11T14:44:07Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > All colors are contextual. There are no colors that are inherently ugly. I’ve finally found someone who agrees with me! Just like “what’s your favorite color?”. It’s a meaningless question to me, because, well, favorite color for _what_? And there’re too many colors within a group; I love chartreusey, acidy yellow green but am less fond of huntery, foresty greens. But the forest greens can look great with the right support colors. ---
**Author:** ![Me\_Billy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e480ec/32.png) [@Me\_Billy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Me_Billy)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/25 "2016-06-11T14:47:18Z")
Ugly unless you are in the Army! ---
**Author:** ![mind\_the\_gap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ea666f/32.png) [@mind\_the\_gap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mind_the_gap)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/26 "2016-06-11T14:55:19Z")
> [@Me\_Billy](#): > > Ugly unless you are in the Army! First thing I thought was “looks like olive drab”. If I was an old Army guy, I might just light one up and think of all the good times I had w/ my mates. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/27 "2016-06-11T15:08:30Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Australian researchers, looking for an ugly color to use in cigarette packaging, did a survey, and decided that a color called “opaque couché” is the ugliest color in the world, and therefore are applying it to Australian, and now UK, cigarette packaging. > > [Color me ugly! World's most horrible color shade described as 'death'](http://www.today.com/home/color-me-ugly-world-s-most-horrible-color-shade-described-t97346) Gah. How many meetings and wasted time was spent on this pointless task. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/28 "2016-06-11T15:16:25Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Yup, I think “puke green” is pretty much rebranded “avocado” (or vice versa) isn’t it? Well, 1970s refrigerator avocado is different from metallic goat-vomit green (which is a color I see adorning certain car models like the Kia Soul). Interestingly, “opaque couché” is not far from the color of our Batmobile (it’s actually a couple of shades darker). Anyway, smokers are die-hard enough that you could cover the packs with flashing neon print (“DEATH DEATH DEATH DEATH DEATH”) and they’d still light up. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/29 "2016-06-11T15:53:38Z")
Yeah, I pulled out my Pantone book and was surprised it was such a… nothing color. There are whole pages in the pukey-greenish-yellowish-grayish range that are much worse, and in fact should be illegal except for cigarette packaging. ---
**Author:** ![TheChileanBlob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thechileanblob/32/435_2.png) [@TheChileanBlob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheChileanBlob)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/30 "2016-06-11T16:56:15Z")
I like the more greenish color; it would look good on me. The other one in the OP was ok too; just looked like taupe. ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/31 "2016-06-11T21:56:18Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Well, 1970s refrigerator avocado is different from metallic goat-vomit green (which is a color I see adorning certain car models like the Kia Soul). > > Interestingly, “opaque couché” is not far from the color of our Batmobile (it’s actually a couple of shades darker). > > Anyway, smokers are die-hard enough that you could cover the packs with flashing neon print (“DEATH DEATH DEATH DEATH DEATH”) and they’d still light up. There’s been a big push over the last few years to reduce the (already [pretty small](http://www.tobaccoinaustralia.org.au/chapter-1-prevalence/1-13-international-comparisons-of-prevalence-of-sm) by international standards) smoking rates here, and it’s [working](http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/Lookup/by%20Subject/4338.0~2011-13~Main%20Features~Tobacco%20smoking~10008). > [@](#): > > In 2011-12, men were more likely to smoke daily than women (18.3% compared with 14.1%). These rates have decreased since 2001, when 25.4% of men and 19.5% of women smoked daily. I for one welcome our Drab Olive overlords… ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/32 "2016-06-11T23:07:57Z")
> [@mind\_the\_gap](#): > > First thing I thought was “looks like olive drab”. If I was an old Army guy, I might just light one up and think of all the good times I had w/ my mates. They wanted to call it “olive green” but the olive association complained because that would sully the reputation of the olive. I kid you not. [The colour is now described officially as a ‘drab dark brown’, after its initial description by the Australian government of ‘olive green’ was disputed by the Australian Olive Association for sullying the reputation of the olive.](http://metro.co.uk/2016/05/20/cigarette-packets-to-become-even-more-grisly-from-today-5893831/) ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2016, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/33 "2016-06-11T23:19:25Z")
> [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > They wanted to call it “olive green” but the olive association complained because that would sully the reputation of the olive. I kid you not. > > [The colour is now described officially as a ‘drab dark brown’, after its initial description by the Australian government of ‘olive green’ was disputed by the Australian Olive Association for sullying the reputation of the olive.](http://metro.co.uk/2016/05/20/cigarette-packets-to-become-even-more-grisly-from-today-5893831/) That’s amazing! You must have really done some digging to find that. Did you have to read the \* whole thread\*? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/34 "2016-06-12T01:22:15Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > That’s amazing! You must have really done some digging to find that. Did you have to read the \* whole thread\*? 😉 Sorry, I got the link from your post but missed where you mentioned the olive green bit, so no I didn’t read every bit of the thread. ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/35 "2016-06-12T02:11:08Z")
Does anyone think less attractive and eye-catching packaging may prevent some young people from starting to smoke? I realize that smokers are going to smoke until they personally decide not to, and there’s little that can hurry that along other than personal experiences, like losing someone to cancer or heart disease. The best way to spend “stop smoking” dollars is on getting young people not to start in the first place. It’s pretty rare for someone to start after about age 24 (it happens, when a 27-year-old non-smoker marries a smoker, for example, but it’s a statistical outlier). If ugly packages make smoking less fun, maybe it will cut down on smoking among 12-16 year olds, and this is where your hard core smokers come from. Even if it only cute it by 5%, it’s probably worth it. Besides, there may be a domino effect: A doesn’t start because the packages aren’t fun to flash, and then B doesn’t start because A didn’t. I’m assuming that because they put so much time into choosing the color, they must have put some time into researching whether this would be at all effective. Am I wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/36 "2016-06-12T02:46:51Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Does anyone think less attractive and eye-catching packaging may prevent some young people from starting to smoke? If pictures of diseased lungs don’t stop people from smoking, bad colour choices sure as hell won’t stop them either. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/37 "2016-06-12T20:11:30Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > [Looks to me](https://www.pantone.com/color-finder/448-C) like the Grauniad messed up. Though I concede, that’s a much worse color than the real opaque couché. > [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > [The colour is now described officially as a ‘drab dark brown’, after its initial description by the Australian government of ‘olive green’ was disputed by the Australian Olive Association for sullying the reputation of the olive.](http://metro.co.uk/2016/05/20/cigarette-packets-to-become-even-more-grisly-from-today-5893831/) Somebody’s mixed up. The color in the Metro article appears to be [this](http://www.theguardian.com/fashion/2016/jun/08/stylewatch-pantone-448c-ugliest-colour-world-opaque-couche-australian-smokers-fashion#img-1) rather than [this](https://www.pantone.com/color-finder/448-C) and actual Australian packaging [seems to be between the two](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/UyYV1ugvvH4/hqdefault.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/38 "2016-06-12T21:43:47Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > If pictures of diseased lungs don’t stop people from smoking, bad colour choices sure as hell won’t stop them either. I forgot about the pictures of diseased body parts. Yeah, I just looked at the labels. I don’t know that the color will make that much of a difference. I was thinking in terms of US packaging. ---
**Author:** ![Wallaby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/dc4da7/32.png) [@Wallaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallaby)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2016, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/39 "2016-06-13T01:00:12Z")
It’s in that broad spectrum described as ‘baby-sh!t brown’. Variations available, depending on diet etc. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2016, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044/40 "2016-06-18T12:02:23Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Does anyone think less attractive and eye-catching packaging may prevent some young people from starting to smoke? > > I realize that smokers are going to smoke until they personally decide not to, and there’s little that can hurry that along other than personal experiences, like losing someone to cancer or heart disease. The best way to spend “stop smoking” dollars is on getting young people not to start in the first place. It’s pretty rare for someone to start after about age 24 (it happens, when a 27-year-old non-smoker marries a smoker, for example, but it’s a statistical outlier). > > If ugly packages make smoking less fun, maybe it will cut down on smoking among 12-16 year olds, and this is where your hard core smokers come from. Even if it only cute it by 5%, it’s probably worth it. Besides, there may be a domino effect: A doesn’t start because the packages aren’t fun to flash, and then B doesn’t start because A didn’t. > > I’m assuming that because they put so much time into choosing the color, they must have put some time into researching whether this would be at all effective. > > Am I wrong? I was an occasional smoker for about five two-or-three-month stretches, scattered across a decade, and there were a few times during these periods when I thought about buying a pack of cigs, then decided not to after seeing the awful warnings with pictures of missing jaw surgery and the like. This was all outside the US. But for most truly addicted smokers, I suspect you’re right. I think the main target audience are folks (mainly young) who are thinking about giving it a try. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-opaque-couche-pantone-448c-the-ugliest-color-in-the-world/757044.md?page=1)