# Is President Trump suddenly Getting Worse? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 12, 2018, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444 "2018-01-12T04:54:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/161 "2018-01-15T21:54:01Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > I was thinking more of shitholes like West Virginia, Mississippi, Arkansas, Alabama, places that have a in common with the places that Trump calls shitholes. Hey, I’m just being honest like Trump, right? The ‘whole’ of these places are not shit holes. Detroit is not completely shitty. And, a BIG And, the people are worthy. Trump is so ignorant that he wouldn’t know a worthy person if they were right in front of him. He is racist, bigoted and a pig, who had no respect for women, or people of color. Trump is the last name I would associate with honesty. If he told me it was raining I would look out the window before I got out my umbrella. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/162 "2018-01-15T22:08:53Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Thanks. > > Is it an all of the above kind of thing? If I understand this question correctly, then no, it’s not an “all of the above kind of thing”. Reagan spoke about ‘80% friends’. I suspect there are not many people that subscribe to every single viewpoint that we label “liberal” in our political lexicon. If they’re at ~80+%, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to call them “liberal” as a short-hand label, but it’s helpful to remember they may not endorse every single liberal position or policy. Same goes for “conservative”. > [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > For example, the “shithole countries” thing certainly seems to be “viewing things through a racial lens.” Somehow I doubt you will accept that Trump and half his supporters are liberals, so how do I parse that? Seems like “sympathy for all races” gets turned into “viewing things through a racial lens,” while, say, white supremacy is somehow a different case. I was trying to find a diplomatic way to put this and probably did a bad job of it. I think liberals tend to emphasize race more than conservatives. Undoubtedly there are some conservatives that emphasize race as well, they’re just fewer and farther in between, at least in my experience. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/163 "2018-01-15T22:37:13Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > …I think liberals tend to emphasize race more than conservatives. Undoubtedly there are some conservatives that emphasize race as well, they’re just fewer and farther in between, at least in my experience. Don’t you think there’s a societal advantage for conservatives (overwhelmingly white) not to view things racially, as compared to liberals (less overwhelmingly white)? > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > If he told me it was raining I would look out the window before I got out my umbrella. My personal analogy is that if Trump said water is wet, I’d check it first. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/164 "2018-01-15T22:41:20Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Don’t you think there’s a societal advantage for conservatives (overwhelmingly white) not to view things racially, as compared to liberals (less overwhelmingly white)? … I’m not sure I understand your question. What do you mean by “societal advantage”? ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/165 "2018-01-15T22:44:24Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Is there any evidence that Trump ever even saw the cover, or that he concluded it made him look cool? You said “They both just figured” and “Hicks and Trump assumed”. What evidence is there that these assumptions were shared by Trump, and not just Hicks? Why would that matter? The point was that Wolff got entry into the West Wing. As mentioned earlier, he was signed in most often by Steve Bannon, who no doubt had his own reasons for wanting Wolff reporting what was going on (a strategy that appears to have backfired; but of course that’s a separate thread). But Hicks seems to have been the first to contact him (Wolff). What does it matter whether or not Trump liked the cover? It’s quite possible that Trump trusts Hicks’ judgment. She wrote an admiring email to Wolff and was glad to see him at the White House, and possibly that was good enough for Trump. The one bet I’d gladly make, though, is that Trump never read the article. The fact that Hicks complimented Wolff argues strongly that she never read it, either. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/166 "2018-01-15T22:48:24Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’m not sure I understand your question. What do you mean by “societal advantage”? White privilege. If they don’t acknowledge it, it’s easier to maintain it. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/167 "2018-01-15T22:49:48Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Why would that matter? … It only matters if you care to be accurate in what you post. I asked you for evidence to support your assertions, and you appear to have declined to provide any. You’ve been around here long enough to know what that means. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/168 "2018-01-15T22:53:45Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Don’t you think there’s a societal advantage for conservatives (overwhelmingly white) not to view things racially, as compared to liberals (less overwhelmingly white)? … > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’m not sure I understand your question. What do you mean by “societal advantage”? > [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > White privilege. If they don’t acknowledge it, it’s easier to maintain it. I don’t know. I don’t claim to be particularly well-informed about white privilege. On the surface, your last post sounds plausible. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/169 "2018-01-15T23:09:36Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > The ‘whole’ of these places are not shit holes. Detroit is not completely shitty. And, a BIG And, the people are worthy. Trump is so ignorant that he wouldn’t know a worthy person if they were right in front of him. He is racist, bigoted and a pig, who had no respect for women, or people of color. Trump is the last name I would associate with honesty. If he told me it was raining I would look out the window before I got out my umbrella. Many parts of Appalacha and the Mississippi Delta have lower life expectancies than Nepal and Bangladesh ([https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-03-14/how-mississippi-is-worse-off-than-bangladeshsince](https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-03-14/how-mississippi-is-worse-off-than-bangladeshsince) our president seems to be intent on labeling places as shitholes, I guess he’d have to call parts of America shitholes. It might be better if we didn’t use shithole in our political discourse, but since Trump’s defenders are ok with his use of the term for other countries, I guess we’re obligated to use it for parts of America. It seems crazy for the president to say it and it seems crazier for Americans to defend him, but since they do, I guess it’s ok to point out that many Trump voters are from shitholes. I wish they where more like Norwegians. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/170 "2018-01-15T23:18:03Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > … I guess we’re obligated to … I’d encourage you to reexamine this. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/171 "2018-01-15T23:28:01Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’d encourage you to reexamine this. I would encourage you to re-examine your support for this unhinged president. In fact the post you quoted was just such an attempt. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/172 "2018-01-15T23:30:43Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > … In fact the post you quoted was just such an attempt. LOL! No it wasn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blue_blistering_barnacle/32/3386_2.png) [@Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blue_Blistering_Barnacle)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/173 "2018-01-15T23:32:42Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/174 "2018-01-15T23:34:18Z")
I would encourage you to simply reconsider your strategy. Namely, you should: 1. Call those regions “shitholes” whenever you wish. 2. If anyone objects, claim you never said it. 3. If they heard you say it, claim they are misrepresenting the words. 4. If the representation is accurate, claim they are partisans who can’t be trusted. 5. If they aren’t, say this is how real people talk anyway. 6. Even if it isn’t, move on to bullshit strategy number 7, likely involving insults. 7. (TBD) ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/175 "2018-01-15T23:49:27Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It only matters if you care to be accurate in what you post. I asked you for evidence to support your assertions, and you appear to have declined to provide any. You’ve been around here long enough to know what that means. I’ve been around here long enough to know how seriously to take your claim that I made “assertions” that require supportive evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/176 "2018-01-16T03:29:57Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > Many parts of Appalacha and the Mississippi Delta have lower life expectancies than Nepal and Bangladesh ([https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-03-14/how-mississippi-is-worse-off-than-bangladeshsince](https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-03-14/how-mississippi-is-worse-off-than-bangladeshsince) our president seems to be intent on labeling places as shitholes, I guess he’d have to call parts of America shitholes. They don’t even like being called “flyover country”. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/177 "2018-01-16T05:45:28Z")
It’s somewhat off-topic (long-standing pattern rather than sudden worsening) but [a video comparing the rhetorics of Donald Trump and Charles Manson](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybitHLhb0yw) may be of interest to arm-chair psychiatrists. The 9-minute video is somewhat tedious, but it does point out uncanny similarities between the styles and (unconscious?) rhetorical tricks of the two men. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/178 "2018-01-16T10:53:46Z")
I would refer anyone interested in pursuing the whole “remote diagnosis” issue (and indeed the nature of psychopathy) to Jon Ronson’s excellent book “[The Psychopath Test](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Psychopath_Test)”. Ronson does note that there is an overlap in personality traits between successful CEOs and sociopaths (which may explain any Trump v Manson similarities) but does not automatically jump to the obvious conclusion, and indeed questions the whole process of determining who is mad and who isn’t. Worth a read. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/179 "2018-01-16T14:14:16Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > They don’t even like being called “flyover country”. Which they actually complain about far more often than it actually happens, similar to Bush being accused of being a Nazi. This time around there are more people actually making the comparison and fewer people complaining about it, I guess because they don’t think the Nazis were all that bad. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444/180 "2018-01-16T21:21:34Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Then substitute any medical condition that does. > > What is the upshot? What is the outcome of a bunch of professionals diagnosing someone they have never treated or evaluated? What changes occur in society, the public dialog, the government as a result of this? It could be used as an impedes for more severe screenings or elected office. People in the military or intelligence agencies have to undergo very intense background and medical screenings. Elected officials do not, part of that is because the founders assumed the public were wise enough to not pick someone dysfunctional. But we the public are not. So we need to pass laws mandating full neurological and medical exams, full financial accountings, etc before someone can run for higher office. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-president-trump-suddenly-getting-worse/806444.md?page=10)