# Is Reddit Really Going to Have A 'Blackout'? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 10, 2023, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278 "2023-06-10T06:02:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![B.Serum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/b.serum/32/14266_2.png) [@B.Serum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B.Serum)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2023, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/81 "2023-06-15T09:47:27Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > Some of the Reddits I participate in have decided to go permanently dark at the end of the month. The miniature painting Reddit has a poll up asking what people want to do and going private permanently and continuing to exist are running neck and neck. Like another poster mentioned, that may just result in another sun being created, into which most of the same people will congregate. Would it not be better to start a forum elsewhere, announce it to the users, and funnel those people away from Reddit? Because I have to imagine that after a short while, that craving to chat about one’s hobby will draw all but those with the most willpower back to the replacement sub. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2023, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/82 "2023-06-15T12:37:15Z")
> [@B.Serum](#): > > Like another poster mentioned, that may just result in another sun being created All these worlds… ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2023, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/83 "2023-06-15T12:43:24Z")
> [@B.Serum](#): > > Like another poster mentioned, that may just result in another sun being created, into which most of the same people will congregate. That might happen. I’m an old fogey who only uses Reddit on his web browser on the computer. I don’t use any third party products, was completely blindsided by the announcement, don’t really have a good grasp of the issue, and I can’t bring myself to care that much. One of the subreddits I like announced they weren’t leaving. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2023, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/84 "2023-06-15T13:57:24Z")
… except Reddit. Attempt no landing there. ---
**Author:** ![Gravity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gravity/32/14322_2.png) [@Gravity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gravity)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2023, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/85 "2023-06-15T19:24:21Z")
I’ve already seen speculation that Reddit may look into using the “no squatting” rule to remove moderators/owners of subs that remain shut, even provided that the mods post internally on closed subs to keep it ‘active’ in an attempt to forestall it. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2023, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/86 "2023-06-15T20:45:27Z")
The closed subs are active to the people who joined them. It’s just that people who haven’t joined can’t see. One of the subs that I started only has like 3.2k members but way more people read it. You ordinarily don’t need to be a member to read and post. I got several messages during the blackout asking for permission to join. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2023, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/87 "2023-06-15T21:01:09Z")
Most subs are not allowing people to join. Even if you subscribed before your wild need permission again to join. Some of them even have messages up saying don’t bother to ask for access. ---
**Author:** ![Gravity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gravity/32/14322_2.png) [@Gravity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gravity)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/88 "2023-06-16T11:21:32Z")
We have a bit more on the way that the admins are “dealing” with [it here,](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModSupport/comments/14a5lz5/comment/jo9wdol/) including the contradictions being said depending on the outlet they’re speaking to. I find it rather frightening that they can switch so easily from “moderators and owners of a subreddit can do what they like within reason and if you don’t like it, you can go make another of your own” to "if your subreddit is popular it becomes owned ‘by the people’ and you’re not allowed to do anything against their will’. I was a mod for a fairly popular (for the niche it was in, of course - about 120,000 subscribed users, though it only had an active posting base of a couple of hundred) and I know the absurd things that ‘the people’ can decide they want. I was perfectly happy to discuss a change if a user brought it to us by modmail, and even if what they wanted wasn’t viable I would explain our reasons why. What I didn’t take kindly to was people who tried to stir things up to have backing from others on my own sub without even talking to me. It’s one of the reasons that I gave over my subreddit to my junior mods and changed my username after almost ten years. If the admins were this blatant about not supporting their unpaid moderator labor when I was still doing that, I would have told them to go screw themselves. Moderation of a subreddit that is even mildly popular can be a big pain in the butt, and this was before spambots became so prevalent. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/89 "2023-06-16T13:30:59Z")
> [@Gravity](#): > > if your subreddit is popular it becomes owned ‘by the people’ and you’re not allowed to do anything against their will’. This is fake-populist bullshit that Reddit’s ruling class is pulling, as anyone who watches American politics will recognize. They’re guaranteeing that there will no longer be actual communities, only herds of sheep and expendable unpaid sheepdogs. ---
**Author:** ![Gravity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gravity/32/14322_2.png) [@Gravity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gravity)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/90 "2023-06-16T13:34:52Z")
It’s legitimately troubling. ---
**Author:** ![Omega\_Glory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7c8e57/32.png) [@Omega\_Glory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omega_Glory)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/91 "2023-06-16T13:51:03Z")
This has not been my experience. The closed subs I’ve joined don’t even show up in the home list anymore. If you search for them, you get sent to a page explaining that it’s a private community, sometimes with a bit of extra context about the protest. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/92 "2023-06-16T14:26:36Z")
And some of them are just….gone. They don’t show up on the home list, they don’t show up on a search and old posts and comments I’ve made in the protesting sub don’t appear in my history. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/93 "2023-06-16T14:28:50Z")
Clearly my small group of regular subs aren’t fully representational. Interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/94 "2023-06-16T14:32:53Z")
> [@Gravity](#): > > if your subreddit is popular it becomes owned ‘by the people’ and you’re not allowed to do anything against their will’. Anybody who thought their subreddit was owned or controlled by anybody other than Reddit itself has been deluding themselves. What reddit is doing is heavy handed and probably destructive, but I can’t see how it’s frightening or troubling. “Inevitable” feels like a much better word. ---
**Author:** ![Gravity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gravity/32/14322_2.png) [@Gravity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gravity)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/95 "2023-06-16T14:36:32Z")
It’s emotional mostly. It doesn’t feel safe any longer. Unfortunately, I think you’re right about the inevitability of it, which is very sad. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/96 "2023-06-16T14:39:23Z")
That’s more than fair. It sucks to lose a space you feel comfortable in. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/97 "2023-06-16T15:03:14Z")
Here is a sometimes combative interview with spez about the issue. > **[Reddit CEO Steve Huffman isn’t backing down: our full interview](https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/15/23762868/reddit-ceo-steve-huffman-interview)** > > “The blackouts are not representative of the greater Reddit community.” ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/98 "2023-06-16T15:33:32Z")
That’s a good read. I didn’t know the larger apps were running their own ads and turning a profit on reddit’s back. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/99 "2023-06-16T15:44:57Z")
I mean, that’s entire coming from the guy who wants to shut them down. It’s a _bit_ one-sided. It’s leaving out the fact that reddit’s users are ones providing the content. No users, no content. And some of the most prolific posters are posting from these third party apps. If reddit wanted to make money off the third party apps, they easily could by charging a fair value to the API and/or passing ads through the API. Instead what they’ve done is raised the price so high that the only option for the apps is to shut down. Edit: And it’s a little cheeky to say “they’re making profit off our work” when reddits whole business model is “here’s all this content from other websites in one place!” ---
**Author:** ![troub](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troub/32/14802_2.png) [@troub](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/troub)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2023, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278/100 "2023-06-16T15:58:46Z")
My only thought about all this API stuff is that other services I’m familiar with, you apply and are assigned an API key that gives you different permissions or levels of service based on what you say you’re going to do with it. Why can’t Reddit do this, or do it to effectively solve the problem they’re stating? If they want/need their own ads to show up in 3rd party apps, why not push (labeled) ads through the API feed and _require_ their delivery as part of the API terms of service? And the LLM scraper companies would have to pay the shitton of money to get an API key with capabilities for that, and won’t get ads mixed in? And I don’t know if it’s “trivial,” but it’s certainly extremely common for automated monitoring and detection for if someone seems to be using the wrong type of API key for what they said they were using it for. So in addition to u/spez running his mouth and sounding like a giant ass all the time, it seems like the company is handling this in a completely incompetent way (or at least the least thoughtful, creative way possible) for the problems they _claim_ they’re trying to solve. Way back when it felt like it was just a thing by a couple of guys that was growing super fast, the “rough” technical problems (frequent outages, glitches, lack of functional search, no app, shitty app, etc.) were the butt of a lot of reasonably good-natured jokes, but as a mature product and massive corporate sort of enterprise, the “incompetence” feels more like intentional maliciousness or hostility. It’ll be interesting to see how it plays out. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-reddit-really-going-to-have-a-blackout/985278.md?page=6)