# Is Sam Adams beer really that special, relatively speaking? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** beer\ **Created:** [February 26, 2012, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073 "2012-02-26T19:43:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/81 "2012-02-29T18:49:39Z")
Heh. I’ve been to all of those except for Dave’s Brew Farm. All the breweries mentioned are excellent. (Breweries mentioned are: Founders, Bell’s, Three Floyd’s, Revolution, New Glarus, and Dave’s Brew Farm.) ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/82 "2012-02-29T19:13:21Z")
> [@BomTek](#): > > Oh, and an enticing quote: “… people who know beer know that the United States now brews the best beer in the world, end of story.” Discuss. 😃 There’s not much to discuss. It’s widely accepted that many of the best beers in the world are brewed in the US. And it’s certainly hard to find such a wide variety of different styles brewed at such consistently high quality anywhere else in the world. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/83 "2012-02-29T19:28:15Z")
> [@BomTek](#): > > Oh, and an enticing quote: “… people who know beer know that the United States now brews the best beer in the world, end of story.” Discuss. 😃 I take it you missed [this brouhaha](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=641538). ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/84 "2012-02-29T19:30:16Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > There’s not much to discuss. It’s widely accepted that many of the best beers in the world are brewed in the US. And it’s certainly hard to find such a wide variety of different styles brewed at such consistently high quality anywhere else in the world. [Not everyone is convinced.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=641538&page=2) ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/85 "2012-02-29T20:04:34Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > [Not everyone is convinced.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=641538&page=2) Meh. I don’t claim it’s necessarily the best, just that there’s no doubt America is at least near the top. And at least there’s no reason for people to automatically dismiss American beers as inferior, which still seems to happen for some reason (as occurred in that thread, as I recall). ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/86 "2012-03-01T15:09:32Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Necessary [YouTube](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKZqGJONH68&ob=av3e)link. Um…enjoy. I feel I should be angry with you. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2012, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/87 "2012-03-02T04:22:42Z")
A bit of trivia: most SA beers are brewed in Cincinnati. So I am supporting my home state by drinking SA. 🙂 My two favorite SA beers are Boston Lager and Summer Ale. I do \*\*\*not \*\*\*like their overly-fruity/sweet beers like Cherry Wheat, Cream Stout, and Honey Porter. Yuck. ---
**Author:** ![Lazlo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lazlo/32/9678_2.png) [@Lazlo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lazlo)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2012, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/88 "2012-03-02T07:54:31Z")
> [@amanset](#): > > I feel I should be angry with you. Indeed. I didn’t even click the damned link and I still have the stupid thing stuck in my head. ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2012, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/89 "2012-03-03T04:49:13Z")
Sam Adams is just not as good as SAMUEL JACKSON BEER! IT’LL GET YA DRUNK! ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2012, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/90 "2012-03-03T15:39:55Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Sam Adams for all intents and purposes is a Miller Product. It’s distributed by Miller’s distribution network in every major market and it’s contract brewed by Miller across the country. Sam Adams is a macrobrew, period. That doesn’t make them bad, but they in no way are a beachhead in a sea of macrobrews. Sam Adams is Miller’s faux-microbrew product and they collaborate to market and sell it. Blue Moon is Coor’s (now owned by Miller) faux-microbrew and it too was distributed by Miller in the east and Coors in the west (now merged into one). When you see Blue Moon on tap, you’re simply seeing more Miller. > > Budwesier is heavily investing in Goose Island as well as a few other large regional microbrews in an attempt to gain parity with Miller on this front since it’s Michelob/Shock Top/Bare Knuckle bands haven’t taken hold. It’s unclear if Budweiser intends to take one regional microbrew national or if it intends to compete locally with Sam Adams and Blue Moon with a bunch of more independent local partners. In Chicago the latter is apparently effective as Goose Island’s main lines (Honkers and 312) is gaining steam over the Miller offerings, whether they’ll take 312 and Honkers to the Coasts is yet to be determined or if they’ll continue to leverage relationships with brands like Widmer/Redhook in the west in various regions. Not sure what point you’re actually making. No, Sam Adams is not a Miller product and your reasons for saying it is are simply asinine. It’s like saying Dr. Pepper/7UP soft drinks are really products of Coke or Pepsi (both Coke and Pepsi control large parts of the Dr. Pepper/7UP bottling and distribution business.) I don’t think anyone would deny that those distribution and bottling ties to the “big two” are essential for Dr. Pepper/7UP soft drinks being ubiquitous in their availability, but it’s an entirely separately owned company with different product design staff and et cetera. Same deal with the Boston Beer Company, it’s irrelevant if 100% of their distribution network is controlled by another company, if they are legally a separate company (not a subsidiary or majority owned by another company) and they have their own product development staff it’s just simply _factually_ incorrect to present the idea that Sam Adams is a Miller product. Another salient point is _even if it was a Miller product_, that doesn’t impact whether it’s a **good beer**. The only thing it would impact is whether it was “technically” defined as a craft brewer by the American Brewers Association. There are wholly owned subsidiaries of macrobrews that produce decent beer, Leinenkugel is an SABMiller owned company and produces good beer, the aforementioned Blue Moon created by Coors is not a bad beer (typically where I buy beer I can find 2-3 better Belgian white style ales so I don’t often drink it, but it’s worlds better than Coors Light or any of the mainstream Coors products.) So I guess I’m left confused what point you’re trying to make. Are you trying to bash the quality of Sam Adams because of who distributes it? Well, that’s obviously a matter of opinion, but the “weight of public opinion” at both beer festivals and on sights like Beer Advocate are that Sam Adams is substantially higher quality than any of the mainstream Macrobrew products in the United States. I think the top 10 best selling individual beer types in the U.S. are: Bud Light, Budweiser, Miller Lite, Coors Light, Corona Extra, Natural Light, Heineken, Michelob Ultra Light, Busch Light, Miller High Life. I can tell you in my own personal opinion, the opinion of various beer festivals, and the opinion of sites like Beer Advocate Sam Adams is in a whole different tier of quality than any of those ten named beers. So **even if it was** a Miller product, it wouldn’t mean it was a bad beer. However, it _isn’t_ a Miller product nor is it a macrobrew. Based on the _technical_ (meaning the only one I give a shit about) definition of “craft brewery” the American Brewer’s Association says a craft brewer is any brewer with less than 6,000,000 barrels in annual production _and_ who are not 24% or more owned by a brewer with more than 6m barrels in annual production. Further, I think your characterization of the relationship between Boston Beer Company and SABMiller does not hold up to factual scrutiny, this is from the Boston Beer Company’s annual report: > [@](#): > > The Company-owned breweries are located in Breinigsville, Pennsylvania, Cincinnati, Ohio and Boston, Massachusetts. The Pennsylvania and Cincinnati > Breweries produce the full range of the Company’s core brands and produce most of the Company’s shipment volume. The Pennsylvania Brewery is the > Company’s largest brewery and was purchased from Diageo North America Inc. (“Diageo”) in June 2008. The Cincinnati Brewery is the primary brewery for > the production of most of the Company’s specialty and lower volume products. The Company’s Boston Brewery production is mainly for developing new > types of innovative and traditional beers and brewing and packaging beers in the Samuel Adams Barrel Room Collection and certain keg beers for the local > market. Product development entails researching market needs and competitive products, sample brewing and market taste testing. Most of the Company’s > Samuel Adams beers are produced at the Boston Brewery in the course of each year. > > The Company currently has a brewing and packaging services agreement with City Brewing Company, LLC, to produce its products at facilities in Latrobe, > Pennsylvania and La Crosse, Wisconsin as well as agreements with MillerCoors, Nestlé Professional Vitality and Pleasant Valley Wine Company to brew > and/or package at facilities in Eden, North Carolina, Chicago, Illinois and Hammondsport, New York, respectively. The brewing and packaging agreements > with MillerCoors and Nestlé Professional Vitality are expiring during the first quarter of 2012 and the Company does not expect them to be renewed. The > Company carefully selects breweries and packaging facilities owned by others with (i) the capability of utilizing traditional brewing methods and (ii) first-rate > quality control capabilities throughout brewing, fermentation, finishing and packaging. Under its brewing and packaging arrangements with third parties, the > Company is charged a per unit rate for its products that are produced at each of the facilities and bears the costs of raw materials, excise taxes and deposits for > pallets and kegs and specialized equipment required to brew and package the Company’s beers. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2012, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/91 "2012-03-03T15:54:32Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#): > > I’ll happily send you a care package of whatever you’d like from the sunshine state in return for Belgian Red, and other NG offerings. Just sayin…We got Cigar City, Terrapin, The Funky Buddha… If you can figure out safe packaging for beer bottles through the mail, maybe we can do a deal. I live about 45 minutes drive from the brewery. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2012, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/92 "2012-03-03T16:22:58Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#): > > I’ll happily send you a care package of whatever you’d like from the sunshine state in return for Belgian Red, and other NG offerings. Just sayin…We got Cigar City, Terrapin, The Funky Buddha… I just looked through their website, and [you can have them ship beer directly to you via UPS](http://www.newglarusbrewing.com/index.cfm/general/giftshop). And the shipping is free if your order is more than $60. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2012, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073/93 "2012-03-03T16:32:06Z")
> [@](#): > > The Pennsylvania and Cincinnati Breweries produce the full range of the Company’s core brands and produce most of the Company’s shipment volume. The Pennsylvania Brewery is the Company’s largest brewery and was purchased from Diageo North America Inc. (“Diageo”) in June 2008. The Cincinnati Brewery is the primary brewery for the production of most of the Company’s specialty and lower volume products. I stand corrected… I thought their Cincinnati brewery produced the most beer. Interesting. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-sam-adams-beer-really-that-special-relatively-speaking/614073.md?page=4)