# Is Shaun King (Daily Kos writer & Black Lives Matter activist) really white? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 19, 2015, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271 "2015-08-19T16:39:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/261 "2015-08-21T14:10:08Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Can you NAME the eye witnesses? Eye witnesses to what, btw? WTF D’Anconia are you even on the same planet? ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/262 "2015-08-21T14:11:36Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Here is an [eyewitness](http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Screen-Shot-2015-08-17-at-3.16.32-AM1.jpg) and another [eyewitness](http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Screen-Shot-2015-08-17-at-3.18.52-AM.jpg). > > And these are not 20-year-after-the-event eyewitnesses either. Bwah!!! No names just bad penmanship!! Hilarious. Do better. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/263 "2015-08-21T14:14:50Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > Bwah!!! No names just bad penmanship!! Hilarious. Do better. These are eyewitnesses from the police report. Which is a bit more credible than people reporting on a high school fight 20 years later. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/264 "2015-08-21T14:16:49Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > WTF D’Anconia are you even on the same planet? Who are the eyewitnesses, and what did they witness? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/265 "2015-08-21T14:17:28Z")
I have to wonder if we’d even be having this conversation if it weren’t for Rachel Dolezal. At any rate, I think the wise thing to do at this point is to believe the guy. It’s not like it really matters anyway. Unless his mother surfaces and recants the story, or he submits to a DNA test, I don’t think anyone else’s testimony matters. And don’t laugh at the DNA test idea. Louis Gates has a PBS series where he interviews black people about their experiences, what they know about their ancestors, and then does a DNA test at the end part of which is to determine how much of their ancestry comes form Africa. The record low for his guests is 20% African ancestry (80% European) and that was for [Benjamin Jealous](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Jealous), the former head of the NAACP. But he’s not doing himself any favors by comparing his detractors to Birthers. In his case, it’s his actual birth certificate that is causing the confusion, not the lack of one (or the lack of people having seen one). It would only be like the Birthers if there actually WAS a birth certificate of Obama from Kenya. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/266 "2015-08-21T14:21:25Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > These are eyewitnesses from the police report. Which is a bit more credible than people reporting on a high school fight 20 years later. Credible police report? Not when the investigating officer just ticks off “white” based on his mother’s skin color. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/267 "2015-08-21T14:24:53Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > But he’s not doing himself any favors by comparing his detractors to Birthers. In his case, it’s his actual birth certificate that is causing the confusion, not the lack of one (or the lack of people having seen one). It would only be like the Birthers if there actually WAS a birth certificate of Obama from Kenya. But they are Birthers and they have to own their racism. This is the slippery slope with racists. They are people who are hell bent on trying to out someone based on race. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/268 "2015-08-21T14:24:57Z")
Pick the white kid: [1](http://data.whicdn.com/images/35718723/original.jpg) [2](http://www.polyvore.com/cgi/img-thing?.out=jpg&size=l&tid=64819226) [3](https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/34/c9/ef/34c9ef056464169bf60320ba12b6a722.jpg) [4](http://38.media.tumblr.com/75e5b8ea5fbf57080961e761fb54b439/tumblr_mvg9m8TS2j1sh2p4ao1_250.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/269 "2015-08-21T14:27:43Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > And don’t laugh at the DNA test idea. Louis Gates has a PBS series where he interviews black people about their experiences, what they about their ancestors, and then does a DNA test at the end part of which is to determine how much of their ancestry comes form Africa. The record low for his guests is 20% African ancestry (80% European) and that was for [Benjamin Jealous](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Jealous), the former head of the NAACP. Doesn’t that establish exactly why the DNA test idea is laughable? There is no physical test for how someone racially identifies and to what extent that identification is shaped by how they are perceived by society. An individual might have genes that make her skin color, hair, and face shape “black” enough in America that they have no realistic option but to identify as black because that’s how society will treat them. Another individual with the same percentage of “African ancestry”–whatever it is we mean by that–might appear differently and have the option of how to identify. There is no generally agreed-upon social standard for how black someone has to be before they can so identify. Naturally, most people don’t have a choice in the matter because society will assign them a race. But for people whose features are borderline for the social conventions, there’s no such thing as a DNA test for race. This apparently offends a lot of people on all sides. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/270 "2015-08-21T14:40:07Z")
Genes don’t matter as to whether or not King is being honest about his racial identity – if he’s telling the truth about what his mother told him (that his father was a light-skinned black person), then it _doesn’t matter if his mother was actually telling the truth or not_, since he would have acted from then on with the knowledge (whether true or not) that he was “black”. I suppose a DNA test that showed he had ~25% African ancestry might demonstrate that his mother was telling the truth, but a DNA test that showed he had entirely European ancestry would tell us nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/271 "2015-08-21T14:52:58Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Who are the eyewitnesses, and what did they witness? Shea Gold and Teacher Nathaniel Carter are ones that witnessed the racial attack on Shaun and wrote about it. You would know that if you read Shaun’s blog. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/272 "2015-08-21T14:58:05Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I suppose a DNA test that showed he had ~25% African ancestry might demonstrate that his mother was telling the truth, but a DNA test that showed he had entirely European ancestry would tell us nothing. It wouldn’t tell us nothing. Because you would have to consider how likely it is that his mother would tell him his bio father was a light-skinned black man if that was not actually the case. It certainly raises the likelihood that he’s lying about that. Of course, this is all theoretical. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/273 "2015-08-21T14:59:50Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > Shea Gold and Teacher Nathaniel Carter are ones that witnessed the racial attack on Shaun and wrote about it. You would know that if you read Shaun’s blog. What I’m wondering is whether these people are definitively known to exist. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/274 "2015-08-21T14:59:52Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > It wouldn’t tell us nothing. Because you would have to consider how likely it is that his mother would tell him his bio father was a light-skinned black man if that was not actually the case. It certainly raises the likelihood that he’s lying about that. > > Of course, this is all theoretical. His mother could very easily have been mistaken – or she could even have been correct, but the “light-skinned black man” that is his actual father turns out to not have any significant amount of African ancestry. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/275 "2015-08-21T15:01:16Z")
It’s all possible. But it would certainly raise the likelihood that King is lying about it. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/276 "2015-08-21T15:01:56Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > Shea Gold and Teacher Nathaniel Carter are ones that witnessed the racial attack on Shaun and wrote about it. You would know that if you read Shaun’s blog. Anyone can start a blog, and write whatever he likes. How is that dispositive? ---
**Author:** ![Gent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gent)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/277 "2015-08-21T15:05:59Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > Sorry you have it wrong. The multitude of lies comes from the right wing with an agenda to stop him. He’s debunked everything The poster above is a great example of why you shouldn’t waste your time debating this subject. Lost in these people are the facts: Mr. King’s family, including his brother, have stated that he’s not black - and that he lied about the events surrounding his attack. King himself has already admitted that he has no idea who his father is. Previously he stated that he knew his father was black. Please, do not debate these people. They’re trolling you. It will drive you nuts. Mr. King has been caught in his lies. The case is closed. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/278 "2015-08-21T15:15:31Z")
> [@Gent](#): > > King himself has already admitted that he has no idea who his father is. I’ve seen this reported in media reports, but didn’t see it in his DailyKos article. He writes: > [@Shaun King](#): > > After that day when I was first asked if I was mixed, while I was still a very young child, kids and their well-intentioned parents began telling me they knew who my black father was, that I was so and so’s cousin, etc. So it sounds like he has some good idea, at least of who was thought to be his father. I was uncertain of the meaning of one sentence in his article (emphasis mine): > [@Shaun King](#): > > Until this past week, never has anyone asked me who my father was during these 35 years of mine. It occurs to me now that I’ve never asked anyone **that question** either. It’s an odd question, and, in my case, has a complicated, deeply personal answer, but one that I have actually seen lived out many other times. What question did he never ask anyone? Did he never ask anyone who his (SK’s) father is? Or was he just saying similar to no one ever asking him who his father is, he himself had never asked anyone else who their father was - this being a lead-in to the next sentence that “it’s an odd question …” ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/279 "2015-08-21T15:32:29Z")
I wish certain posters who are unfailingly skeptical when it comes to accusations of police brutality would give just HALF that respect to this guy. DNA results aren’t perfect. A few years ago I remember reading the story of a guy who was without a doubt African American based on his physical appearance and family background. Yet his test didn’t find any recent African ancestry. I know way too many people who don’t look black but who are black, and they are kin to me. I’m talking, they’ve got blonde hair and blue eyes and could easily pass as white, just like Shaun King can. And some of them do, because fooling people–especially white people–is very easy to do when you are ambigious-looking enough. If Shaun King is telling the truth and his mother told him the truth, I hope it all comes out to light. But if it doesn’t, I’m satisfied with his defense. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/280 "2015-08-21T15:41:13Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > If Shaun King is telling the truth and his mother told him the truth, I hope it all comes out to light. But if it doesn’t, I’m satisfied with his defense. So in the end, the truth doesn’t matter. ☹ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271.md?page=15)