# Is Shaun King (Daily Kos writer & Black Lives Matter activist) really white? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 19, 2015, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271 "2015-08-19T16:39:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Construct](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@Construct](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Construct)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/281 "2015-08-21T15:42:47Z")
DNA testing doesn’t lie. Perhaps the guy had Native American, Southeast Asian, or aboriginal heritage, and that accounted for his African American appearance, but a DNA test would reveal African ancestry. Hair, eye and skin color are all caused by varying levels of melanin and someone with dark skin, blue eyes, and blonde hair would be very nearly impossible. > [@D\_Anconia](#): > > So in the end, the truth doesn’t matter. ☹ It’s a shame, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/282 "2015-08-21T15:44:37Z")
Apparently, Dolezal had the [same defense](http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-dolezal-interview-20150616-story.html) - except that she didn’t even want to admit that her mother is her biological mother. Wonder if monstro is satisfied with her defense as well? ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/283 "2015-08-21T15:45:06Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > I know way too many people who don’t look black but who are black, and they are kin to me. I’m talking, they’ve got blonde hair and blue eyes and could easily pass as white, just like Shaun King can. And some of them do, because fooling people–especially white people–is very easy to do when you are ambigious-looking enough. There was another recent suggestion - by either you or someone else - that black people are harder to fool in this manner. I am a bit skeptical. Certainly nothing in the Dolezal story supports that, and it seems likely that NOI founder [Wallace Fard](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallace_Fard_Muhammad#Efforts_to_trace_Fard.E2.80.99s_biography) was also a non-black who passed pretty well. Though I suppose it’s possible that the average black person is more familiar with minute aspects of white culture and speech etc. than the reverse and this gives them an advantage. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/284 "2015-08-21T15:45:53Z")
> [@Construct](#): > > DNA testing doesn’t lie. Perhaps the guy had Native American, Southeast Asian, or aboriginal heritage, and that accounted for his African American appearance, but a DNA test would reveal African ancestry. Hair, eye and skin color are all caused by varying levels of melanin and someone with dark skin, blue eyes, and blonde hair would be very nearly impossible. This wouldn’t make him a liar – it could be entirely consistent with his story. And you still didn’t answer my question from earlier – what’s wrong with race-mixing? ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/285 "2015-08-21T15:50:52Z")
> [@Construct](#): > > DNA testing doesn’t lie. Perhaps the guy had Native American, Southeast Asian, or aboriginal heritage, and that accounted for his African American appearance, but a DNA test would reveal African ancestry. Hair, eye and skin color are all caused by varying levels of melanin and someone with dark skin, blue eyes, and blonde hair would be very nearly impossible. > > It’s a shame, isn’t it? The truth doesn’t matter-it is the “narrative” that is important. Racism is evil; that is the important thing. Whether somebody is black or white is unimportant. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/286 "2015-08-21T15:51:03Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > The birth certificate doesn’t list race. Thank you! ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/287 "2015-08-21T16:00:10Z")
> [@Construct](#): > > Hair, eye and skin color are all caused by varying levels of melanin and someone with dark skin, blue eyes, and blonde hair would be very nearly impossible. [Not](http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/00/7b/d4/007bd45f2f60657db4e578de1e95e668.jpg) [so](https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/93/12/51/9312512a89b58b03d514aa282bcbf371.jpg) [impossible.](https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/9b/34/14/9b34146c381dc217d169289fc8137fab.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/288 "2015-08-21T16:09:27Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > So in the end, the truth doesn’t matter. ☹ Well, maybe. If King held a scholarship reserved for black kids, and isn’t black, that is arguably a matter of significance. If King is a significant name in the BLM movement, but isn’t black, I don’t know why anyone should care. I’m not black and I am sympathetic to BLM. As far as I can tell, the movement is not closed to non-blacks. Would it be news if we found out Wayne LaPierre doesn’t own any guns? Hardly. This is just concern trolling by Breitbart and other right-wing news outlets. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/289 "2015-08-21T16:10:29Z")
Also, the “truth doesn’t matter” paraphrasing of **monstro** is entirely inaccurate. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/290 "2015-08-21T16:14:56Z")
I agree. All she was saying - AFAICT - is that even if the truth of his story doesn’t get conclusively proved she’s still satisfied that it’s correct based on what she’s seen so far. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/291 "2015-08-21T16:21:54Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Well, maybe. If King held a scholarship reserved for black kids, and isn’t black, that is arguably a matter of significance. If King is a significant name in the BLM movement, but isn’t black, I don’t know why anyone should care. The NAACP cared when it came to Rachel Dolezal. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/292 "2015-08-21T16:27:03Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > Also, the “truth doesn’t matter” paraphrasing of **monstro** is entirely inaccurate. What about **iiandyiiii** in post # 270? > [@](#): > > it doesn’t matter if his mother was actually telling the truth or not. I can’t get behind any statement where telling the truth or not doesn’t matter. The truth always matters. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/293 "2015-08-21T16:28:34Z")
It matters to SK’s mother. It doesn’t matter to SK, if he only said he was black because he legitimately thought so. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/294 "2015-08-21T16:31:46Z")
> [@Construct](#): > > DNA testing doesn’t lie…a DNA test would reveal African ancestry. Is this really true?! There’s specific DNA that identifies someone’s ancestors as being from Africa? If so, don’t we all have it, since, as I understand it, we all have ancestors from Africa? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/295 "2015-08-21T16:31:59Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > What about **iiandyiiii** in post # 270? > > I can’t get behind any statement where telling the truth or not doesn’t matter. > > The truth always matters. How about snipping text without the context that properly explains it – does that matter? Is it dishonest to quote someone out of context? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/296 "2015-08-21T16:46:53Z")
> [@Gent](#): > > The poster above is a great example of why you shouldn’t waste your time debating this subject. Lost in these people are the facts: Mr. King’s family, including his brother, have stated that he’s not black - and that he lied about the events surrounding his attack. King himself has already admitted that he has no idea who his father is. Previously he stated that he knew his father was black. > > Please, do not debate these people. They’re trolling you. It will drive you nuts. Mr. King has been caught in his lies. The case is closed. Gent, I’m giving you a warning for this. It is specifically forbidden to refer to other posters as trolls or that they are trolling. Don’t do this again. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/297 "2015-08-21T16:51:15Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > The NAACP cared when it came to Rachel Dolezal. Indeed. And if BLM cares about King, that’s their lookout. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/298 "2015-08-21T17:17:09Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Indeed. Actually I think the national NAACP said they don’t care. It was the local guys who were not happy (though it’s not clear to me that they were unhappy with her being white specifically, or whether it was her whole pattern of deceit). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/299 "2015-08-21T17:18:37Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > Doesn’t that establish exactly why the DNA test idea is laughable? There is no physical test for how someone racially identifies and to what extent that identification is shaped by how they are perceived by society. > > An individual might have genes that make her skin color, hair, and face shape “black” enough in America that they have no realistic option but to identify as black because that’s how society will treat them. Another individual with the same percentage of “African ancestry”–whatever it is we mean by that–might appear differently and have the option of how to identify. > > There is no generally agreed-upon social standard for how black someone has to be before they can so identify. Naturally, most people don’t have a choice in the matter because society will assign them a race. But for people whose features are borderline for the social conventions, there’s no such thing as a DNA test for race. > > This apparently offends a lot of people on all sides. Not sure I’m following you. The DNA test would tell whether he had an African-American father. Whether or not he, while growing up, decided to self-identify as black or white was a choice he could make. Assuming he does have some recent African ancestry, he probably could have passed\* if he so chose. What difference does that make? Of course it could turn out that his biological father traced his ancestry not to Africa, but to some other part of the world where people might typically be labeled “black” if they lived in the US. But the DNA evidence will tell us that-- we won’t have to guess. In the case of Mr. Jealous, he knew exactly who his African-American ancestors were, and although he is mostly white, he chose to identify more with the black side of his family. But at some point, there is no reason why you can’t just give it up. Once you are 15/16 white, why not just say you’re white and be done with it. \*For lack of a better word. Personally, I have no problem with anyone who is mostly white to self-identify as white, regardless of what society thinks they should be. I think we should be beyond the point where “passing as white” is even a thing. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2015, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271/300 "2015-08-21T17:25:29Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I think we should be beyond the point where “passing as white” is even a thing. ISTM that we already are. When is the last time you heard of someone being outed as passing as white while secretly having black ancestry? ISTM that it only works the other way around these days. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-shaun-king-daily-kos-writer-black-lives-matter-activist-really-white/728271.md?page=16)