# Is Superman and illegal alien? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 29, 2006, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649 "2006-06-29T16:56:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/21 "2006-06-29T20:56:16Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > But this is a question that would need to be answered. What about if an alien, a real alien, was born in the States? If said alien were deemed a person then it would have US citizenship (unless it’s “parents” where diplomats or occupying soldiers). The real question is; must a natural person be a human being\> ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/22 "2006-06-29T22:10:37Z")
My understanding is that it’s no longer generally recognized for private property ownership, but that most nations do (theoretically, at least) claim all of the space in the funny-shaped wedge projected from the center of the Earth through the borders of the nation. If Krypton were in the US’s particular funny-shaped wedge at the moment of Kal-El’s birth, then arguably, by virtue of being in that wedge, he was born in American territory. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/23 "2006-06-29T23:04:06Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > I don’t think adoption automatically confers citizenship in all cases. But anyway, that would apply to Clark Kent only. If Superman wanted to claim that, he would have to reveal his identity. In the particular story (Superman becomes President) referred to, his identity had already been revealed. He had been shot by robot mini-supermen with laser eyes that burned his Clark Kent suit and revealed his Superman costume underneath. This happened on live TV, so everyone knows. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/24 "2006-06-29T23:08:00Z")
Clark Kent was legally adopted by the Kents; they told the authorities he was a foundling (which he was), brought him to an orphanage, then showed up a few days later to adopt. I would assume that the orphanage would have gotten him a birth certificate saying he was born in Smallville to unknown parents. So Clark shouldn’t have any issues: he’s a US citizen. Superman, OTOH, is a different issue: he might not be regarded as a citizen, since no one knows he’s really Kent. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/25 "2006-06-29T23:15:30Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > I don’t even know whether Superman is a known alien, these days. And what about the rest of the superheroes? Since nobody knows their secret identities, none of them can have passports either. I wouldn’t be surprised if there had been a story in which the Justice Society (and maybe also the Justice League) were given permission to do battle against evil anywhere. There have been a number of stories recently involving various governments taking issue with “American” superheroes operating on their soil. In most cases, the argument is valid. A couple Green Lanterns recently pointed out that, although they were Americans, when they wear their rings and uniforms they are responsible for the entire planet - borders be damned. The Chinese superhumans attempting to stop them didn’t agree. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/26 "2006-06-29T23:18:33Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > But this is a question that would need to be answered. What about if an alien, a real alien, was born in the States? If the lawyers successfully argue that a “person” need not be a Human (using the generally accepted definition of Human = the Terran species known as _Homo sapiens_), then ISTM that a xeno-Terrestrial born on US soil would qualify as a native-born American. (Subject to the rules of the parental xeno society on dual citizenship.) I am not an immigration lawyer, this point has not been raised (AFAIK) in American courts, feel free to give it a try but don’t hold me responsible. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/27 "2006-06-29T23:24:03Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Clark Kent was legally adopted by the Kents; they told the authorities he was a foundling (which he was), brought him to an orphanage, then showed up a few days later to adopt. I would assume that the orphanage would have gotten him a birth certificate saying he was born in Smallville to unknown parents. > . Wowza, I was adopted like that. (Dropped off at an orphanage for a couple of days so they could legally adopt me). Cool. ---
**Author:** ![Antigen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Antigen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antigen)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/28 "2006-06-29T23:31:31Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Wowza, I was adopted like that. (Dropped off at an orphanage for a couple of days so they could legally adopt me). Cool. Stay away from Kryptonite, just in case. ---
**Author:** ![Bob\_Scene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Bob\_Scene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bob_Scene)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/29 "2006-06-29T23:44:26Z")
Only an idiot would vote for Superman as President, because there’s always a disaster somewhere in the world. When some guys get trapped a mile underground in a coal mine in Australia, he has to fly off to rescue them, right? And when a ferry capsizes in Indonesia and there are 800 people floating in the shark-infested waters, he has to fly off to save them, right? When will he have time to be President? Would you vote for him knowing that he would constantly have to fly around the world saving people? And what if he didn’t? Would you vote for the kind of person who would let all those people in that skyscraper in Moscow burn to death because he had to finish reading that NSA report on terrorist activities? ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2006, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/30 "2006-06-29T23:57:39Z")
Well, yes, I’d certainly vote for him. (In theory, since I’m English, and don’t get to vote in Presidential elections) Of course, he could read that NSA report in about 1/2 a second, leaving him plenty of time to rescue those Ruskies. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/31 "2006-06-30T00:38:05Z")
> [@Antigen](#): > > Stay away from Kryptonite, just in case. I could be Superman’s younger sister! 🆒🆒🆒 ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/32 "2006-06-30T01:20:05Z")
This OP is better suited to Cafe Society. **samclem** ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/33 "2006-06-30T01:52:45Z")
Are _you_ going to deport him? Go ahead. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/34 "2006-06-30T02:33:09Z")
I don’t know which issue this can be found in, but according to the [Supermanica](http://supermanica.info/wiki/index.php/Superman) wiki, “Although Superman apparently lacks jurisdiction to apprehend criminals outside Earth’s solar system, he has been awarded honorary citizenship “in all the countries of the United Nations”, along with a special “golden certificate” empowering him to apprehend criminals in U.N. member nations and to travel in and out of those nations without a passport.” Now, whether this gives him permission to permanently settle in any one country is unclear. This does allow him to come and go in any U.N. member nation as necessary to apprehend criminals or to rescue people. And it probably doesn’t apply to his Clark Kent identity. Presumably Clark Kent is a citizen of the U.S. and needs passports to enter foreign countries under his job as a journalist in order to protect his secret identity. But as long as he enters foreign soil in his Superman identity and remains in the costume, he is free of all bureaucratic restrictions, at least as far as U.N. member nations are concerned. ---
**Author:** ![yelimS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/54ee81/32.png) [@yelimS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yelimS)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/35 "2006-06-30T02:38:03Z")
There is a superman = F There is an illegal alien = T Superman AND illegal alien = F ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/36 "2006-06-30T02:49:12Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > But this is a question that would need to be answered. What about if an alien, a real alien, was born in the States? The Master speaks. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/37 "2006-06-30T02:58:33Z")
Pre-Crisis, Superman had been granted global citizenship by the U.N. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/38 "2006-06-30T05:03:16Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I believe there’s a principle in law that an abandoned infant found in a country’s territory is legally presumed to have been born in that country. Yes - as quoted in the post just three posts above yours, with chapter and verse. ---
**Author:** ![ululate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/59ef9b/32.png) [@ululate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ululate)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/39 "2006-06-30T11:49:00Z")
> [@Peter Morris](#): > > In the particular story (Superman becomes President) referred to, his identity had already been revealed. He had been shot by robot mini-supermen with laser eyes that burned his Clark Kent suit and revealed his Superman costume underneath. This happened on live TV, so everyone knows. I believe you’re mixing up two stories, there. The action-figure bit is from **“Whatever Happened To The Man Of Tomorrow?”** , which most assuredly does _not_ involve him running for, or getting elected to, any office. He receives a rather nice trophy, but that’s about it. The possible future in **Armageddon: 2001** involved him signing on with the Presidential campaign of his old pal Pete Ross, who’d figured that an award-winning writer with media connections would be a useful guy to have around – never realizing just _how_ useful, as when Clark threw himself in front of the _rest_ of the bullets coming at him. The first shot put Pete in the hospital, and out of the race – but the next five only tore Clark’s shirt, exposing the ‘S’. Which, of course, made him a lock for the White House right when Pete asked him to carry on in his stead. That’s when the Supreme Court was called in to determine his eligibility, and unanimously ruled that the birthing matrix was like unto the artificial womb of a test tube baby, such that he was born on American soil. Oh, and: > [@RealityChuck](#): > > Clark Kent was legally adopted by the Kents; they told the authorities he was a foundling (which he was), brought him to an orphanage, then showed up a few days later to adopt. I would assume that the orphanage would have gotten him a birth certificate saying he was born in Smallville to unknown parents. That’s pre-1986. Then there was this big time-travel thing where history started back over from zero, and everything unfolded differently; among many other changes, the Kents _ **didn’t** _ go through the two-step at the orphanage. Clark himself grew up thinking he was (a) human, and (b) their kid; he cheerfully became a high-school football star – and even after they told him what they knew and showed him the rocket, he concluded he was probably some weird Soviet super-soldier experiment to put a fetus up in orbit and expose the drugs in its system to radiation or something. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2006, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649/40 "2006-06-30T11:53:17Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Wowza, I was adopted like that. (Dropped off at an orphanage for a couple of days so they could legally adopt me). Cool. Where/when did _this_ happen? Unusual, or so it seems in terms of the Paperwork Hell that adoption is usually described as. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-superman-and-illegal-alien/362649.md?page=3)