# Is the "GOP coup" in NY a good thing for marriage equality? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 10, 2009, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377 "2009-06-10T20:11:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2009, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/1 "2009-06-10T20:11:19Z")
Republicans in the New York State Senate have managed to [flip](http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2009/06/08/2009-06-08_gop_coup_in_albany_senators_hiram_monserrate_and_pedro_espada_jr_vote_against_fe.html) 2 Democratic senators; Hiram Monserrate of Queens, and Pedro Espada Jr. of Bronx (they also made Espada President pro term). Both remain registered Democrats. Senator Espada has [said](http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/09/new-senate-president-wants-vote-on-same-sex-marriage/) he wants a vote on marriage equality. I think he’ll get his vote. Even if it fails it’ll force senators on both sides to stop dodging the question and declare where they stand (which will come in handy next year). It’ll be supremely ironic if the Republicans end up inadvertently granting gays & lesbians the right to marry. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/2 "2009-06-11T03:13:56Z")
… this is a fractally weird case. The more you look into it, the more twisted it gets. Let’s just say both these mothers are under investigation. Espada may not actually live in the district he claims to represent, and may have committed fraud as well, to be elected. And the Republicans just made him president of the senate. All I can say is that there is no chance this is the final state of things. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/3 "2009-06-11T03:39:48Z")
It’s an open question as to whether the Republicans’ move was even legal, given that a lot of people are saying that the session was adjourned before they made their motion. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ea5d25/32.png) [@Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Scrappy_Hero_Pup)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/4 "2009-06-11T05:17:28Z")
You got a fraudster and a guy who cut his woman with a beer bottle as your swing votes. If I were the GOP, I wouldn’t be tallying up chickens just yet. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/5 "2009-06-11T09:21:22Z")
All of that said I think a vote is always a good thing. Politicians will, by their very nature, avoid making votes on controversial issues. Therefore it behooves us all to force them to do so at all points. “Stand and be counted” is not one of the base motives for most elected officials. “Have power and dodge responsibility” is, however. So I figure votes are good. At least that way you have a record of where each member sits on the issue and can make downstream voting choices based on it. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/6 "2009-06-11T10:07:20Z")
And the fraudster, as president of the Senate, is Governor when Paterson wanders out of state. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/7 "2009-06-11T14:24:39Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > And the fraudster, as president of the Senate, is Governor when Paterson wanders out of state. A friend of mine who used to work for Paterson was very upset when Paterson ran as Lt. Gov. He said they needed him much more in the Senate. This sort of makes that seem true. Though I am still a big fan of him as Governor even though he’s getting the shit for it. I think he’s getting in trouble because he actually tried to fix the budget, something everyone is for until you touch a program that they like. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 9:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/8 "2009-06-14T09:34:54Z")
Can someone explain this to me. I read the linked article but still don’t understand what happened. How are they ‘flipped’ if they are still registered as democrats? In what sense have they gone over to the other side? And why would one of the apparent consequences, a forced vote on an issue the Reps have been stalling, be considered a welcome outcome for them? ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-gop-coup-in-ny-a-good-thing-for-marriage-equality/499377/9 "2009-06-14T13:06:22Z")
They’ve become Jeffords, Jack. Agreed to sit with the Republicans on matters of leadership. Without actually changing party affiliation. Which makes no sense and will get them thrown out on their ass… but that’s 2010. As far as a forced vote? No clue.