# Is the New York Times Pro-Trump? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [June 29, 2024, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509 "2024-06-29T21:31:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 25
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/481 "2024-10-16T15:25:03Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > “Bending over backwards to maintain the appearance of neutrality” when the facts are anything but neutral is not actually a neutral position. I would tend to agree that the NYT is probably not intentionally supporting Trump, but outside of their explicit endorsement editorials they may as well be. Like it or not, that’s what Old Media is like. Their gravitas and reputation stems from this perceived neutrality. You may say that this is a relict of a bygone time when we could presume that our elected officials were acting in good faith, and I’d agree. It’s why I don’t purely consume old media anymore. But you can’t expect a leopard to change its spots. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/482 "2024-10-16T15:32:38Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > that’s literally the _definition_ of purity testing It’s literally not. It’s nothing of the sort. Saying NYT cannot really oppose Trump because they support fracking or don’t support the Palestinians in Gaza enough, that’s a purity test. Saying that you can’t belong to our group unless you agree completely with us on a huge raft of issues That’s not remotely the same as pointing out the obvious fact that publishing a bunch of blatantly pro Trump articles is not consistent with the NYT’s allegedly anti Trump position ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/483 "2024-10-16T15:35:14Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > That’s not remotely the same as pointing out the obvious fact that publishing a bunch of blatantly pro Trump articles The problem is that the NYT _is not_ posting blatantly pro Trump articles, and the fact that you _ **think** _ they did because they didn’t use enough mean words about Trump in the article _is precisely the purity testing we are talking about_. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/484 "2024-10-16T15:43:00Z")
The problem is that the NYT is playing both sides of the street and trying to collect clicks from both sides. This means they officially endorse Harris while at the same time writing Trump puff pieces. It is just a money-making scam to please the stockholders. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/485 "2024-10-16T15:43:49Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > they didn’t use enough mean words about Trump Again this article (which is just one of many like this in the NYT) didn’t just “not use mean words” about Trump. > It is a completely distorted inaccurate description of what happened at that rally. If you just read this article and did not watch the video you would have an incorrect understanding of what happened at the rally, in way that benefits Trump massively. Even the _Fox News_ account pointed out that this was a deeply weird thing that happened, something NYT readers would be blissfully unaware of. Pointing out that completely self evident fact is absolutely not a “purity test” ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/486 "2024-10-16T15:46:22Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > It is a completely distorted inaccurate description of what happened at that rally. If you just read this article and did not watch the video you would have an incorrect understanding of what happened at the rally, in way that benefits Trump massively. What are you _talking_ about? Are you under the impression that the events described in that article represent the actions of a _same_ political actor? Reading that Trump “decided that it would be more enjoyable to listen to music instead” at a rally makes him come across as _fucking unhinged_. I’m sorry the New York Times authors aren’t using terms like “fucking unhinged”, but that is certainly not a _positive_ spin. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/487 "2024-10-16T15:49:27Z")
How is it “sanewashing”? What kind of “sane” person would “fire up his campaign playlist, standing on the stage for about half an hour and swaying to songs as his crowd diminished”? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/488 "2024-10-16T15:49:47Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Reading that Trump “decided that it would be more enjoyable to listen to music instead” at a rally makes him come across as _fucking unhinged_. No, because this wasn’t an unhinged act of a guy who is losing it, it’s a detour made by a political candidate known for improvisation. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/489 "2024-10-16T15:51:06Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > No, because this wasn’t an unhinged act of a guy who is losing it, it’s a detour made by a political candidate known for improvisation [![](https://i.imgflip.com/4ol7zs.jpg) ](https://i.imgflip.com/4ol7zs.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/490 "2024-10-16T15:54:19Z")
By the way, here’s the headline to this “pro Trump article”: **Trump Bobs His Head to Music for 30 Minutes in Odd Town Hall Detour** ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/491 "2024-10-16T15:55:25Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > How is it purity testing to note that the NYT, _which endorsed Harris and called Trump unsuitable to lead_, doesn’t say exactly what you would say **when it criticizes Trump** and therefore dismiss it as pro Trump? (bold added) The issue isn’t what the NYT says when it criticizes Trump. The issue is the NYT refuses to describe Trump’s behaviour in an objective fashion if an objective description of Trump’s behaviour might sound critical. Trump expresses racist eugenic beliefs that underpinned Nazism? “Trump’s Remarks on Migrants Illustrate His Obsession With Genes” Trump completely loses the plot at a town hall? “Odd Town Hall Detour” There are scores of examples in this thread. Let me repeat. _When an objective description of Trump’s behaviour might sound critical, the NYT does not provide an objective description, but rather puts a positively biased spin on things in the name of appearing neutral._ Demanding that a newspaper describe things objectively, even if that might make those things sound bad, is not purity testing. It’s just asking that they report the news in an objective fashion. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/492 "2024-10-16T15:56:26Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Reading that Trump “decided that it would be more enjoyable to listen to music instead” at a rally makes him come across as _fucking unhinged_ Only if you’ve seen the video or heard other coverage (including goddamned FOX NEWS). Going just on that NYT piece you’d think he was being a happy go lucky man of the people, giving his supporters a bit of fun light relief and sticking it to the dour men in suits who want to ask boring interview questions. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/493 "2024-10-16T15:59:16Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Trump Bobs His Head to Music for 30 Minutes in Odd Town Hall Detour Odd. Presidential candidate stops his campaign town hall mid event to stand onstage for a half hour listening to music. Odd is all you have to say about it? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/494 "2024-10-16T16:02:26Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > Trump completely loses the plot at a town hall? “Odd Town Hall Detour” > > There are scores of examples in this thread. Let me repeat. _When an objective description of Trump’s behaviour might sound critical, the NYT does not provide an objective description, but rather puts a positively biased spin on things in the name of appearing neutral._ Trump bobbing his head for 30 minutes is indeed an objective description. We can infer from that that he lost the plot, and indeed, I don’t think in any way that the NYT is implying that Trump was _correct_ about people finding his “odd” move _enjoyable_. It seems like exactly the understated way I’d expect Old Media papers to call someone “unhinged”. You may not like that understatement or feel that it is appropriate. Fine - you don’t like Old Media, then. There are literally dozens of alternative media channels that will happily tell you that Trump is an unhinged, deranged, senile lunatic. The fact that this isn’t how the NYT operates doesn’t make them “Pro Trump”. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/495 "2024-10-16T16:06:27Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > Only if you’ve seen the video or heard other coverage (including goddamned FOX NEWS). Sample size of one, but I read the excerpt to my wife (who hadn’t heard about this story yet) without any additional context, and she thought it made Trump sound unhinged. I then asked her if she thought the excerpt sounded pro Trump, and she said no; if anything, reporting “just the facts” makes the story more damning to Trump, in her eyes. > [@griffin1977](#): > > Going just on that NYT piece you’d think he was being a happy go lucky man of the people, giving his supporters a bit of fun light relief and sticking it to the dour men in suits who want to ask boring interview questions. Only if you’ve never seen or heard a political rally before. No reasonable person would think it’s an appropriate thing to do at a Town Hall. Hell, if I asked a 5th grader “How was class today?” and they told me “It was odd, the teacher put on a playlist and bobbed his head for 30 minutes” I’d be very concerned about that class. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/496 "2024-10-16T16:06:43Z")
Interesting that you focus on the second example and ignore the first. I’m much more concerned about refusing to call out Nazism. As a dirty foreigner, I don’t much give a fuck if Americans decide to elect a senile senior citizen. I do care if they decide to elect a white supremacist fascist authoritarian. Expecting the media to call out nazism is not purity testing. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/497 "2024-10-16T16:09:10Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > Odd. > > Presidential candidate stops his campaign town hall mid event to stand onstage for a half hour listening to music. > > Odd is all you have to say about it? No, I’d probably say that Trump is completely unhinged and clearly incapable of leadership. But I don’t write articles for Old Media, so I don’t have to abide by their standards. “Odd” is about what I’d expect to see about it in the paper. “Lunacy” is what I’d expect a late night comedy show host to describe it as. I’d expect a funny skit about it on SNL. And I’d expect my favorite online political shows to call Trump “fucking insane”. What’s your point? ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/498 "2024-10-16T16:13:09Z")
So here’s the text of the NYT article in question > Donald J. Trump was about 30 minutes into a town hall Monday night in suburban Philadelphia when a medical emergency in the crowd brought the questions and answers to a halt. Moments later, he tried to get back on track, when another medical incident seemed to derail things, this time for good. > > And so Mr. Trump, a political candidate known for improvisational departures, made a detour. Rather than try to restart the political program, he seemed to decide in the moment that it would be more enjoyable for all concerned — and, it appeared, for himself — to just listen to music instead. > > Mr. Trump had his staff fire up his campaign playlist, standing on the stage for about half an hour and swaying to songs as his crowd slowly dwindled. > > He bobbed his head through the Village People’s “Y.M.C.A.,” his usual closing song. He swayed soberly to Rufus Wainwright’s version of “Hallelujah,” watched a Sinead O’Connor video, rocked along to Elvis, watched the crowd during “Rich Men North of Richmond” and then, finally, left the stage to shake hands on his way out during one last song. I am sorry that is a blatantly pro Trump description of the events at the rally. If that was your only source for the rally (which remember is from THE PAPER OF RECORD) you would absolutely not come away with the fair understanding of what clearly was an episode of cognitive decline from a presidential candidate. I mean they list the songs that were played but omit the fact the even Kristi Noem was visibly freaked out by his behavior and spoke to him like he was a child (or, more pertinently, a far gone nursing home patient). ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/499 "2024-10-16T16:13:52Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > Interesting that you focus on the second example and ignore the first. I’m much more concerned about refusing to call out Nazism. As a dirty foreigner, I don’t much give a fuck if Americans decide to elect a senile senior citizen. I do care if they decide to elect a white supremacist fascist authoritarian. Expecting the media to call out nazism is not purity testing. Sorry, Trump expressed support for Nazism? When? What exactly did he say? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2024, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509/500 "2024-10-16T16:16:35Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > I am sorry that is a blatantly pro Trump description of the events at the rally. I have no idea how you read that article and come away with that opinion. I genuinely don’t. > [@griffin1977](#): > > If that was your only source for the rally (which remember is from THE PAPER OF RECORD) you would absolutely not come away with the fair understanding of what clearly was an episode of cognitive decline from a presidential candidate. The excerpt quoted in the tweet above was my wife’s only source for the rally, and she absolutely did come away with an understanding that when a guy stops a rally to away to music for 30 minutes, that’s absolutely a clear example of congnitive decline. Her exact response was, “and they say that Biden is senile?”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509.md?page=24) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-new-york-times-pro-trump/1003509.md?page=26)