# Is the use of "motherland" or "fatherland" creepy to you? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 12, 2006, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069 "2006-03-12T19:47:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/21 "2006-03-13T03:46:38Z")
> [@HPL](#): > > Fatherland has Nazi connections. > Motherland has Soviet connections. > > Though I believe the Romans used the term “motherland” when referring to their country, if I remember my latin correctly. No, I don’t think so. Augustus wanted the title _pater patriae_, or “father of the fatherland.” ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/22 "2006-03-13T03:58:31Z")
> [@kellner](#): > > The fatherland is the land of someone’s fathers. It’s basically the germanic version of the latin _patria_, as in _patriot_. I can see how the word got a bad name in English, but originally there was nothing expansionist about it. Yeah, those Romans were perfectly content to stay in their own little piece of the world. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/23 "2006-03-13T04:25:55Z")
The old double standard. It’s all fine for your fatherland to go running around, annexing every loose territory on three continents. But if your motherland tries to occupy just three or four neighbouring countries, all the other countries act like it’s some kind of slut. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/24 "2006-03-13T04:28:56Z")
Yes, and homeland gives me the creeps as well. ---
**Author:** ![Ea\_calendula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b5e925/32.png) [@Ea\_calendula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ea_calendula)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/25 "2006-03-13T11:09:47Z")
In English and German, yes, ‘fatherland’ and ‘Vaterland’ do have WWII connotations. But in my native language, Danish, no - not at all. Fatherland sounds perfectly normal. I guess I’ve seen to many with neo-nazi bad guys, since it only registers in English and German. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Rashak\_Mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@Rashak\_Mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rashak_Mani)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/26 "2006-03-13T14:35:27Z")
One more creeped out by Homeland, mother and fatherland too. I think any overly patriotic names or speeches creep me out. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/27 "2006-03-13T14:58:23Z")
Me, if I see “heartland” one more time…apparently some tornadoes ripped through the Heartland again this weekend. Can’t they just go through rural \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_(insert state here)? Argh. I don’t mind homeland–I don’t like what Bush has done to it. Motherland/fatherland…mother not so bad, father is completely tied in my mind to Nazis. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/28 "2006-03-13T17:34:16Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > Me, if I see “heartland” one more time…apparently some tornadoes ripped through the Heartland again this weekend. > > Can’t they just go through rural \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_(insert state here)? > > Argh. Or at least associate some of the other regions of the country with organs and systems. “Today we’ll be talking with a used car salesman from the spleenland of America,” or “The kind of old-fashioned liverland values one expects in the Southwest.” Yeah, that would be cool. Sailboat ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/29 "2006-03-13T18:28:22Z")
I hate “homeland.” Why not “domestic security”? Why not “national”? Jesus, even “border” or “turf” or “myspace” or “crib”? Anything! ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/30 "2006-03-13T18:33:19Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Or at least associate some of the other regions of the country with organs and systems. > > “Today we’ll be talking with a used car salesman from the spleenland of America,” or “The kind of old-fashioned liverland values one expects in the Southwest.” > > Yeah, that would be cool. > > Sailboat Does that make Hawaii the appendix of America? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/31 "2006-03-13T18:55:01Z")
Fatherland: creepy Motherland: semi-creepy Homeland: not creepy ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/32 "2006-03-13T20:10:49Z")
> [@Gladstone](#): > > I was struck by Chavez’s use of “fatherland” a few paragraphs into the piece… … did he say “Patria” or “Madre Patria”, in the original? In Spain it became somewhat identified with Franco’s dictatorship, but that has washed away after a while. After all, our separatists are always talking about the Motherland - they just mean a different chunk of land. The motto of the Guardia Civil (similar to US Marshals in many respects) is “Todo por la Patria”, “I’ll give everything for the Motherland”; they’re very much our most respected police force. It was kind of shocking but at the same time a nice surprise when I first ran into Latin Americans who greeted me as being “from the Madre Patria”. Those were Cubans, but I’ve received the same greeting from several other nationalities. In these context, the Mother Country is Spain as the one that brought our language etc etc to our former colonies; the same people usually refer to their own countries as “la Patria”, without the mother bit. To me it’s a pretty neutral term, its meaning depends wholly on the context. When I see some imbecile with a balaklava over his face and a gun in his hand saying that he’s going to use said gun to kill “outsiders” who “dare infect our Motherland with their presence” (the ones who do that in my homeland tend to be the children of inmigrants) it’s negative. When it gets me a hug from someone I’ve just met, it’s positive 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2006, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/33 "2006-03-13T21:20:50Z")
Another vote for creepy as hell. Which is probably why the Bush Administration loves to tout “Homeland” every chance it gets… ---
**Author:** ![elelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@elelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elelle)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2006, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/34 "2006-03-14T03:01:30Z")
Yep, creeped out here, too, by Fatherland, Motherland, Homeland in terms of US use. I suppose Homeland was chosen for this latest whup up of national fervor to avoid the Bad Hitlery connotations the scant decades back. IMHO, Homeland Security sure ain’t doing enough to honor people whose homes have been here a great while; witness Jack Abramoff and that thicket of deceit with Native Americans. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2006, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/35 "2006-03-14T07:38:28Z")
Like **Loach** , I get the Nazi and Soviet vibe from “fatherland” and “motherland”, although of course, context counts. But “homeland”? The warm fuzzies. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2006, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/36 "2006-03-14T10:02:02Z")
I doubt there was anything else they could have used other than “homeland” for Homeland Security. But it does seem to me, right from the start, to have “fatherland”/“motherland” connotations. And those, historically, don’t end up well. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2006, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/37 "2006-03-14T12:18:45Z")
> [@Ice Wolf](#): > > I doubt there was anything else they could have used other than “homeland” for Homeland Security. How about _U.S._ Security? I, too, am weirded out by the term “Homeland” for many of the reasons stated above. ---
**Author:** ![Who\_me\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/958977/32.png) [@Who\_me\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Who_me_1)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2006, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/38 "2006-03-14T12:59:10Z")
I’m not creeped out by any of the terms, but Motherland, Fatherland, and Homeland all seem the same to me. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2006, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/39 "2006-03-14T18:18:48Z")
> [@threemae](#): > > Augustus wanted the title _pater patriae_, or “father of the fatherland.” And Horace said “Dulce et decorum est pro patria mori” – “It is sweet and fitting to die for one’s, you know, country…thing.” Add me to the list of those who find homeland creepy. “Domestic security” would’ve worked just fine. ---
**Author:** ![BoringDad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ad7895/32.png) [@BoringDad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BoringDad)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2006, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069/40 "2006-03-14T23:58:56Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > How about _U.S._ Security? I, too, am weirded out by the term “Homeland” for many of the reasons stated above. Well, National Security was just too old fashioned and could include protecting _ **anyone** _ who happened to be in our country. If you call it Homeland security then you can get away with persecuting those that did not grow up in the US. Homeland excludes from our mental picture the huge numbers of immigrants throughout history. Immigrants referring to countries they came from as their motherland I have no problem with. Native Americans refering to a Homeland I have no problem with. But other than that, Mother, Father, Homeland all creep me out for the US. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-the-use-of-motherland-or-fatherland-creepy-to-you/348069.md?page=3)