# Is there a Democratic candidate for POTUS I can support? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 20, 2019, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714 "2019-11-20T17:28:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/81 "2019-11-20T22:21:29Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > He didn’t say 310 people are killed with guns every day. He said 310 people are shot every day. Yeah, I found that number- it’s on the Brady site. They have other numbers wrong also. I’d like to see a reliable cite for it. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/82 "2019-11-20T22:26:07Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > He didn’t say 310 people are killed with guns every day. He said 310 people are shot every day. There are also [nearly 40,000 people killed with guns every year](https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/08/16/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/). His change from “shot with guns” to “gun homicides” is pretty sneaky. But even if you look at straight-up murders, discounting accidental shootings, police-related shootings, and so on, it’s 14K per year. Given that another [67,000 people are injured by firearms each year](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4700838/), that “310 shot per day” number looks pretty accurate. ---
**Author:** ![Linden\_Arden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/53a042/32.png) [@Linden\_Arden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linden_Arden)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/83 "2019-11-20T22:31:51Z")
> [@Sterling\_Archer](#): > > I want to vote democrat but I insist my candidate be pro-life and anti-gay marriage!! Why is there no candidate for ME?! Waaaaah! > > Come on, man. No one is gonna be your perfect match. Find the one that won’t totally wreck the country. There are tens of millions single-issue voters. That is the way democracy works. I never thought I would become one but I have this cycle - I will vote **against** anyone who vows to take our health insurance away and replace it with some shitty type of Medicaid. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/84 "2019-11-20T22:59:51Z")
> [@Chingon](#): > > Pro tip: he was never considering voting for a dem. Pro tip: Read the fucking thread, especially post #27. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/85 "2019-11-20T23:01:49Z")
Oh I read it. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/86 "2019-11-20T23:14:32Z")
I want to apologize to Oakminster. I think I appeared to be attacking him as much as his post. I sincerely apologize. Let me restate. The OP identifies as a one issue voter. That issue is absolutely no registration or increased gun regulation. Refreshingly it didn’t mention any “sacred rights” enshrined in the constitution or the need for constant self-defense. It clearly stated I want as many and any kind of guns that I can afford. Good. Clearly stated. I appreciate that. The OP also states that he will not vote anyone who does not absolutely support that issue. Once again, good, clearly stated. My problem with that is how absolutely selfish that is. No regulations on you means that many other totally innocent people will be shot. No regulations on you means that many families will mourn their sons and daughters, live without their husbands and fathers. No regulations on you means that others will live with the knowledge that their 3 year old killed their 5 year old. Just so that you can shoot as much as you want. Selfish. Selfish and complicit in so many of the things that have made America so screwed up these days. ---
**Author:** ![Linden\_Arden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/53a042/32.png) [@Linden\_Arden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linden_Arden)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/87 "2019-11-20T23:22:22Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > My problem with that is how absolutely selfish that is. > No regulations on you means that many other totally innocent people will be shot. > No regulations on you means that many families will mourn their sons and daughters, live without their husbands and fathers. > No regulations on you means that others will live with the knowledge that their 3 year old killed their 5 year old. > Just so that you can shoot as much as you want. > > Selfish. Selfish and complicit in so many of the things that have made America so screwed up these days. You’re assuming that a total gun ban can pass and all 300 million guns confiscated. That is a ridiculous assumption. The reasonable position from Obama is that a background check can pass along with a limit on the size of mabazines/clips. I would be happy with that but the number of lives saved would be relatively small. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/88 "2019-11-20T23:25:58Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Pro tip: Read the fucking thread, especially post #27. Are you ever going to explain what your other moderate positions are, or do you just care about guns? ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/89 "2019-11-20T23:31:19Z")
> [@Linden\_Arden](#): > > There are tens of millions single-issue voters. That is the way democracy works. > > I never thought I would become one but I have this cycle - I will vote **against** anyone who vows to take our health insurance away and replace it with some shitty type of Medicaid. Which, of course, nobody is proposing. There might be someone telling you that certain candidates are proposing that, but they are lying to you. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/90 "2019-11-20T23:31:57Z")
I’m assuming no such thing. I’m advocating for trying to decrease the insane amount of firepower floating around. This is no idle exercise for me. I’m an ER nurse. I deal with the aftereffects of guns all the time. I also live in a rural area with near 100% gun ownership. I own guns. ETA in response to **Linden Arden** ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/91 "2019-11-20T23:41:11Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > There are also [nearly 40,000 people killed with guns every year](https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/08/16/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/). His change from “shot with guns” to “gun homicides” is pretty sneaky. > > But even if you look at straight-up murders, discounting accidental shootings, police-related shootings, and so on, it’s 14K per year. > > Given that another [67,000 people are injured by firearms each year](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4700838/), that “310 shot per day” number looks pretty accurate. Yeah, of that nearly 40000, 60% are suicides. From your cite:_Though they tend to get less attention than gun-related murders, suicides have long accounted for the majority of U.S. gun deaths. In 2017, six-in-ten gun-related deaths in the U.S. were suicides (23,854), while 37% were murders (14,542), according to the CDC. The remainder were unintentional (486), involved law enforcement (553) or had undetermined circumstances (338)._ But that '310" figure is intentionally scary, since what people are really worried about is being killed by a murderer. Not a piece of bird shot during duck season picked out in Urgent care. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/92 "2019-11-20T23:43:38Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > I want to apologize to Oakminster. I think I appeared to be attacking him as much as his post. I sincerely apologize. > > Let me restate. > The OP identifies as a one issue voter. That issue is absolutely no registration or increased gun regulation. Refreshingly it didn’t mention any “sacred rights” enshrined in the constitution or the need for constant self-defense. It clearly stated I want as many and any kind of guns that I can afford. Good. Clearly stated. I appreciate that. > The OP also states that he will not vote anyone who does not absolutely support that issue. Once again, good, clearly stated. > > … > Selfish. Selfish and complicit in so many of the things that have made America so screwed up these days. Ok, but all of those things are already law in CA, but CA still has a higher murder rate. In fact CA has just about the strongest gun control laws in the uSA. They do not seem to have done much good. So you can have ALL of those regulations yet all those bad things still happen. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/93 "2019-11-20T23:44:17Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > There are about 10-11K gun homicides in the uSA a year. Not 113,150. You are off by a order of magnitude. > [@DrDeth](#): > > Yeah, of that nearly 40000, 60% are suicides. From your cite:_Though they tend to get less attention than gun-related murders, suicides have long accounted for the majority of U.S. gun deaths. In 2017, six-in-ten gun-related deaths in the U.S. were suicides (23,854), while 37% were murders (14,542), according to the CDC. The remainder were unintentional (486), involved law enforcement (553) or had undetermined circumstances (338)._ > > But that '310" figure is intentionally scary, since what people are really worried about is being killed by a murderer. Not a piece of bird shot during duck season picked out in Urgent care. I hoped that you’d admit your error. Ah well. I’m glad we purchased the mobile goalposts. ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/94 "2019-11-20T23:48:50Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Yeah, of that nearly 40000, 60% are suicides. From your cite:_Though they tend to get less attention than gun-related murders, suicides have long accounted for the majority of U.S. gun deaths. In 2017, six-in-ten gun-related deaths in the U.S. were suicides (23,854), while 37% were murders (14,542), according to the CDC. The remainder were unintentional (486), involved law enforcement (553) or had undetermined circumstances (338)._ > > But that '310" figure is intentionally scary, since what people are really worried about is being killed by a murderer. Not a piece of bird shot during duck season picked out in Urgent care. I’m sorry that you find 310 people being injured daily by firearms scary. I’m also sorry that you are OK with suicides and minor injuries. ---
**Author:** ![Linden\_Arden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/53a042/32.png) [@Linden\_Arden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linden_Arden)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/95 "2019-11-20T23:51:46Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > Which, of course, nobody is proposing. There might be someone telling you that certain candidates are proposing that, but they are lying to you. Warren and Sanders want to eliminate all private\*\* primary \*\*health insurance. They need our premium payments to pay for others insurance. Don’t tell me I can still get insurance for cosmetic surgery like Kamala Harris said (a reason she has stunk up the polls since saying that). ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/96 "2019-11-20T23:51:55Z")
> [@steatopygia](#): > > I’m sorry that you find 310 people being injured daily by firearms scary. > I’m also sorry that you are OK with suicides and minor injuries. If someone with terminal cancer, living in daily, crippling, horrific pain, wants to end their life, i am fine with it. You’d make them suffer? ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/97 "2019-11-20T23:53:23Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > My criteria include, but are not limited to: > > 1. Generally considered moderate on most issues. > 2. No support for any form of gun ban, whether limited to “assault weapons” or not. > 3. No support for any form of gun registration or licensing . > 4. Support for legalization of marijuana is a plus, but I can live without it. > > Unfortunately, I think criteria 2 & 3 eliminate the entire field, or at least the ones that have a real chance to be the nominee. 1 and 4 are my points, I already believe in a waiting period and police check for gun purchase. No skin off my back, been licensed and held security clearances since I was 18, and I am a firm believer in safety training. > [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > I would caution you not to let perfect be the enemy of the good. Exactly. Guns are not overly important of an issue for me to not vote for someone. > [@Airbeck](#): > > “All the choices are shit” > > Maybe the problem is your expectations. There doesn’t seem to be much of a political push from any direction for a candidate that would fit all of your expectations. This is politics. There will never exist a perfect candidate just like there will never exist a perfect person. At some point though, we have to make a choice, and voting 3rd party in many cases in 2016 _was_ a vote for Trump. Unfortunately the third party voters lost the Democrats the presidency. > [@cuauhtemoc](#): > > I’m pretty dumb that I need this explained to me, I guess… > > But why the vehement opposition to gun registration? Guns aren’t a big part of my life and I don’t pretend to understand all the issues, but having to register your weapon just doesn’t seem like a huge burden to me. > > I’m sincerely asking because I want to understand, not trying to make a point. Honestly, safety training, a waiting period and a police check is no big deal, but a registry is seen as an easy way for a totalitarian government to go door to door with a list and demand the guns on the list to be turned over. [58 year old female, registered Republican since I was 18, gun owner and believer that the 2nd Amendment gives me the right to have weapons for hunting [I favor my Dad’s issue M1, a 12 ga shotgun, and my daily carry varies between 2 handguns - I am trained in their use from being an armed response guard, and I had carried for decades because I had a stalker. I do not believe I need a machine gun or weapon suitable for war though I am quite effective with the M1.] ---
**Author:** ![cutman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@cutman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cutman74)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/98 "2019-11-20T23:57:32Z")
Just for the record, One of the first gun laws “gun grabber” Obama signed was one allowing citizens to carry loaded weapons in national parks. Business Insider, Dec 21, 2012. Don’t know how to link, but it was easy to find. Has other gun rights expanding bills signed into law as well. Didn’t read the whole article. Just wanted to make sure my memory was correct. ---
**Author:** ![Linden\_Arden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/53a042/32.png) [@Linden\_Arden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linden_Arden)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/99 "2019-11-21T00:00:47Z")
> [@cutman74](#): > > Just for the record, One of the first gun laws “gun grabber” Obama signed was one allowing citizens to carry loaded weapons in national parks. Business Insider, Dec 21, 2012. Don’t know how to link, but it was easy to find. Has other gun rights expanding bills signed into law as well. Didn’t read the whole article. Just wanted to make sure my memory was correct. You are correct. That “gun-grabbing” Obama also signed a bill allowing firearms as Amtrak cargo. Another reason he is my favorite President of my lifetime (since JFK). ---
**Author:** ![steatopygia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steatopygia/32/3132_2.png) [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714/100 "2019-11-21T00:00:57Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > If someone with terminal cancer, living in daily, crippling, horrific pain, wants to end their life, i am fine with it. You’d make them suffer? Sure, that’s what the OP was talking about. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-democratic-candidate-for-potus-i-can-support/843714.md?page=6)