# Is there a historical reason soccer teams are referred to in the plural? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 22, 2018, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581 "2018-06-22T17:10:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2018, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/1 "2018-06-22T17:10:44Z")
Reading World Cup coverage has me wondering about why teams are referred to as if they were plural. For example, if the English team scores early the reporter might write “England were ahead early.” rather than “England was ahead early.” Is there some interesting story behind this way of referring to soccer teams? ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2018, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/2 "2018-06-22T17:15:41Z")
In British English, collective nouns like “England” are treated as plural. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2018, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/3 "2018-06-22T17:18:57Z")
It’s the Royal We. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2018, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/4 "2018-06-22T18:36:15Z")
> [@Rysto](#): > > In British English, collective nouns like “England” are treated as plural. As I understand it, this is the answer. In American English, we treat these two very similar sentences differently: “Green Bay was ahead early.” “The Packers were ahead early.” Green Bay, as a city (or England, as a country), is a singular noun. But, in the context of a team, “England” is effectively a shortened version of “the English national football team,” and, as Rysto notes, that’s a collective noun (it’s a group of players). ---
**Author:** ![polar\_bear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ec9cab/32.png) [@polar\_bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/polar_bear)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2018, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/5 "2018-06-22T19:55:05Z")
I always find this funny when watching English football coverage, until I stopped noticing I guess. Other languages just use the singular. I’m positive about Dutch and German at least. ---
**Author:** ![zombywoof](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/9e8a1a/32.png) [@zombywoof](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zombywoof)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/6 "2018-06-23T00:02:30Z")
You’ll often see this British/American English difference in reference to bands (“Coldplay are…” vs. “Coldplay is…”) ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/7 "2018-06-23T00:23:00Z")
And there are collective nouns in US English too: “The police are investigating.” ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/8 "2018-06-25T16:43:22Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > And there are collective nouns in US English too: “The police are investigating.” And of course, there’s some inconsistency. “The Police are defunct; but U2 is still going strong” ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-historical-reason-soccer-teams-are-referred-to-in-the-plural/816581/9 "2018-06-25T18:29:09Z")
> [@Quercus](#): > > And of course, there’s some inconsistency. “The Police are defunct; but U2 is still going strong” I think that’s mostly related to the “The” at the beginning of the band’s name. U2 doesn’t take one so they appear linguisticly like a singular. Try it with _Talking Heads_; if you add a “The” it changes what sounds right: [ul] [li]The Talking Heads are defunct[/li][li]Talking Heads is defunct[/li][/ul] Do they both sound correct to your ears?