# Is there a list of countries I can become citizens of? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 8, 2013, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814 "2013-12-08T13:03:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![jharvey963](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/54ee81/32.png) [@jharvey963](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jharvey963)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2013, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814/41 "2013-12-09T18:08:27Z")
Some posts in this thread mention dual citizenship. Note that with dual citizenship you are STILL liable for US taxes. Another thread in SD (which I’m too lazy to look up right now) was talking about not being able to get a bank account due to onerous new requirements required of them. So in this case, one course of action (if possible) is to renounce your US citizenship so that you no longer have to deal with US taxes. J. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2013, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814/42 "2013-12-09T20:02:33Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > … > I happen to know someone who became a Swiss citizen…I might mention that you actually have to be accepted by a community, that being to arduous part. Then the canton and the federal government rubber stamp it. Interesting. How is this adjudicated in practice? Does the government have a referendum every time someone applies, so e.g. you show up to vote one year and there are questions like: Should Hari Seldon be allowed to become a citizen? Yes/No Should John Smith be allowed to become a citizen? Yes/No Should Mary Jones be allowed to become a citizen? Yes/No Should Englebert Humperdink be allowed to become a citizen? Yes/No ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2013, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814/43 "2013-12-10T01:48:48Z")
> [@grude](#): > > I hope it isn’t prying but is that a tourist visa? My wife didn’t want to go through permanent residency yet and inquired about getting a tourist visa from the USA embassy. Thankfully I guess since we didn’t waste the money the woman on the phone told her straight out since she was married to a USA citizen there was no hope for a tourist visa, they would just assume immigrant intent. > > Looking online on immigration forums it appears you can occasionally get a tourist visa as a USA citizen spouse depending on a lot of things, but often you’re just wasting the application fee. And apparently if you mention being married to a USA citizen when entering the USA on the visa they can decide to deny entry.:smack: > [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > It is a tourist visa. Was never much of a problem for us at the Bangkok embassy. I don’t know how much it matters, but she has civil-servant status and is a fairly senior level, plus she received one of her master’s degrees in the US (we met at the U of Hawaii) and so already lived in the US without abusing her visa. Plus she owns a fair amount of property, at least on paper, as much of it really belongs to “the family” rather than her; since some_one_ has to own a property, her family just divvies up who owns what, but it’s considered everyone’s, a typical practice here. But the point is she had a lot of stuff to show she was tied to Thailand and intended to return. That seems to matter a lot. > > The very first time we applied for a visa for her after getting married was the only hiccup. They would give her only one year, but it’s been 10 years each time after that. We’ve almost always entered the country together and never a problem with Immigration. In fact, entering New York City via JFK Airport last year, they even let her get into the “US Citizens” line with me. But even when we are in separate lines, she always points me out, and I wave to the Immigration officer. The one time she went to the US without me was in 1996, to attend a summer workshop at the U of Michigan, but that was on her official Thai-government passport, and I’m not sure they would have been aware of me (especially since that was pre-9/11). > > But my best friend in Thailand will be down this week with his Thai wife to renew her US visa. She routinely gets 10 years too, and she’s not a government official. They met when she was his secretary and now is a housewife. I wrote the the above response after midnight, and my wife was asleep when I asked her to confirm hers is a tourist visa. This morning we took a look at her visa in her passport and saw the word “tourist” didn’t actually appear. It says “Visa: R” and “Type/Class: B1/B2.” [Doing a little Wikipedia research](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_the_United_States), it looks like B1/B2 is essentially a tourist visa. It says: **“B-1 and B-2: The most common non-immigrant visa is the multiple-purpose B-1/B-2 visa, also known as the ‘visa for temporary visitors for business or pleasure.’ Visa applicants sometimes receive either a B-1 (temporary visitor for business) or a B-2 (temporary visitor for pleasure) visa, if their reason for travel is specific enough that the consular officer does not feel they qualify for combined B-1/B-2 status.”** But toward the end, under “Visa denial” it says: **“Section 221(g) of Immigration and Nationality Act defined several classes of aliens ineligible to receive visas. Grounds for denial may include, but are not limited to:”** And among the reasons listed is: **“The spouse of a US Citizen is almost always denied a visitor’s (B1/B2) visa on grounds that the spouse might want to stay in the United States.”** Huh. That’s news to me. And to the wife. I’ve known quite a few Americans legitimately married to Thai ladies, and I can’t think of a single one whose wife was denied a US visa. My wife too has had one or two colleagues over the years married to Americans, and she says they weren’t denied a visa either. But based on what the Wikipedia entry says, the embassy official your wife spoke to was telling her straight. I don’t know where you are, but it could be a case of one embassy being more hard-assed than another. But the US Embassy in Bangkok has something of a reputation for being strict with visa approvals – a _lot_ of bargirls would _love_ a chance to ply their trade in the Golden Land – and I don’t blame them. Judging from the lines I see every time I go there, it would not surprise me if the processed 1000 per business day or more. I mentioned my friend upcountry whose wife did not have all the background my wife had and was still granted a visa. The funny thing is they wanted to take her sister to the US on a visit, but _she_ was denied a visa, at least initially. My friend’s parents in South Carolina even wrote a letter guaranteeing they would sponsor her. One of the sticking points was the sister had never had any international experience. So they took her on a quick trip to Singapore, where Americans and Thais alike don’t need a visa to visit, and that solved that hoop. She eventually wangled a visa and did not abuse it. Sorry if this is something of a hijack, but this might be important information for **grude**. I believe we do have an Immigration official here on the Board. Perhaps you could ask her advice. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2013, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814/44 "2013-12-10T02:32:00Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Sorry if this is something of a hijack, but this might be important information for **grude**. I believe we do have an Immigration official here on the Board. Perhaps you could ask her advice. Yes, looks like it’s **Eva Luna**. I don’t mean to be pressing her into service, but perhaps a quick PM to her about advice would elicit a response. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814/45 "2013-12-11T02:32:34Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Yes, looks like it’s **Eva Luna**. I don’t mean to be pressing her into service, but perhaps a quick PM to her about advice would elicit a response. Howdy. I’m not an immigration official; I’m a paralegal in the immigration practice group of a private law firm. It’s complete BS that spouses of U.S. citizens are routinely/nearly always denied visitor (aka tourist - B-2 - or business - B-1) visas. It is true that applicants for nonimmigrant visas such as these are required to satisfy a consular official that they intend to depart the U.S. at the end of a temporary stay, but marriage to a U.S. citizen is certainly not cause for an automatic denial, as **Siam Sam** mentions. Demonstarting a job in your home country, property, bank accounts, other close family members, etc. are all helpful in demonstrating an intent to return to your home country. Documenting a specific purpose for your trip, whether wedding, conference, or just vacation, is helpful. And be prepared to explain your reason for wanting the visa without sounding either desperate or idiotic, like the guy I heard of who, when asked why he wanted to come to the U.S., said that he wanted to go to NYC to see the Grand Canyon. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814/46 "2013-12-11T04:37:12Z")
Thank you, **Eva**. That is good information. I hope **grude** will contact the embassy in question himself and maybe speak with a different person. I know Wikipedia is always to be taken with a grain of salt, but they ought to be ashamed of themselves for what they seem to be stating is a provision of a law. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-a-list-of-countries-i-can-become-citizens-of/675814.md?page=2)